Asking opinions from 4 choices...(yes, another which would you buy?)

[forcefed]

Hello all,

I recently found this site from a link somebody posted over at packing.org. There seems to be more traffic, and more options to post about firearm choices here. This site is more my speed, enjoying the different opinions of quality firearms from experienced shooters.

Please bear with me as I explain my situation.

I purchased my first firearm, a Walther P99 in .40 back in mid-2000. I made the choice of buying all on stupid principles: It was one of the newer autos, looked sweet, and was carried by Bond. I first started looking at HK but turned to the P99 due to price and availability at the time. Well something did not sit right with me after awhile, the polymer frame. I could not get over the fact that is was composed of plastic, and I did not feel comfortable with it anymore. I placed it in my safe and purchased some wheel guns. I bought both a Ruger sp101 and a Rossi 462. Both snubbys and both in .357. I never thought I would carry a revolver but I love these guns. The Rossi is extremely accurate, more so than the Ruger, and I am amazed with the type of precision I can do with it. Not sure why its different from the Ruger, but it might be the slightly bigger frame and grip. For carry I switch between the two depending on clothing but mostly carry the Rossi because of the 6shot to the Rugers 5shot. After awhile I brought the P99 out of the safe and sold it. This is where I am currently, and now trying to venture back into to autoloaders.

Since I was not content with my first auto, I have taken my time to research all possible choices. I have come up with the following pistols which really don’t have much in common.

1911 Springfield Champion, HK P7M8, Sig 239, Kahr K9

I have fired a compact Springfield and liked everything but the 6shot capacity, it is expectable in a revolver but I think a auto should at least have capacity going for it. I think I might have gripes with cocked and locked instead of SA/DA but will get used to it if that’s the main concern.

Never fired a P7 only handled at a gun show. Don't think I will have the chance to rent one nor come across a local shooter with one either. I like the design and really like the reputation of HK. I have heard about the frame becoming hot to the touch after prolonged shooting, but don’t think it will be too much of a problem for me. I am interested to know if it requires a lot more cleaning and maintenance due to the gas cylinder and squeeze cocker. I hear the P7 is one of the most accurate production guns out there and that’s always a plus.

The P239 caught my eye at a show as well. Neat little ugly gun that would seem to take the role of carry gun over the wheel guns. Never fired a Sig either, but hear they have excellent triggers. I also hear there finish is prone to rust more than usual and thats a big minus if true. Overall, I like the size and feel of the gun and if purchased, could get a face lift with some nice hogue wrap arounds.

Last is the Kahr K9. I started off looking at the MK but the handle is way to small for my liking. Its funny how their full-size model is still incredibly small. Again I like the size and fit, and their warranty sounds good as well. I have heard there are a lot of duds from Kahr, especially in their polymer models, so this concerns me as well.

Ok, that’s about all I can think of at the moment. I am sure I had other concerns as well. Looking back the only pattern I can see from the group is: all steel, all single stacks, all expensive and all but the Sig has a lifetime warranty. The 1911 will obviously be a .45, and the other will be 9mm due to availability and capacity.

There is no main purpose for my next purchase. I already have reliable carry pieces; I am just looking to diversify my gun experience. So, out of the available choices which would you choose and why? Do you have any first hand experience with problems with these choices?

Thanks for the help and sorry I wrote a book. Its funny how you can write forever on something you actually care about.

-Michael

 

[hansolo]

Semiauto

Well, in the group you are considering, the only ones I have fired is the Sig and Springfield. All are quality firearms, so it's going to be subjective; what trips your, ahem, trigger? If there is a range/gunshop near you that rents handguns, give THESE a try: I have rented or borrowed from friends and have added these to my TO BUY list: Springfield 1911 in 9mm; all the heft and great shootability of the .45, but I personally prefer the 9mm....almost no flip/recoil and very reliable, accurate shooter. Ditto, the Mil Spec: the one I tried was parkerized(plain jane)and, again, the weight and overall ergonomics are fantastic. Cheap, too! I have a S&W 9mm(910s)that is 100% reliable....with new owners, I am not into the "political" thing. I loved my 2 broken CZ 75B 9mms, but the first was replaced on warranty and the replacement has been back in their shop for 2 months. Too bad, 'cause when it wasn't broken, it's a great pistol. My .02 cents worth.

 

[gbelleh]

Welcome forcefed!
I would recommend the HK P7M8. There is no other pistol like it. The gas system does require cleaning, but it's no big deal, it's not really any harder to clean than anything else. The squeeze cocker is very unique and the trigger is extremely nice. It's also very accurate and just plain fun to shoot. It makes a good carry gun because of its flatness, and follow up shots and magazine changes are fast! Another plus is: if someone manages to get your gun away from you, they probably won't be able to figure out how to shoot you with it, at least not before you can find a pipe or stick or something to bludgeon them with and get your gun back.

Your other picks are nice, but there is nothing quite like the P7. The P7 isn't for everyone, but definately check one out. And if you don't like it, you can sell it. P7s seem to hold their value very well.

hansolo,
What happened to your CZs?

 

[Handy]

I think the P7 is the best overall pistol design going. Look for a slightly used one in the $900 range.

If you don't like it, no big deal. Someone will buy it from you for that much or more. Can't say that of every used firearm.

If you do like it, it's a great gun for all occasions and its all steel construction will last. 9mm bullets are cheap, for your shooting pleasure.

Forgot to say, the P7 is the slimmest of the three and has no levers sticking out on the side. Great for CCW.

 

[Safety First]

welcome to THR

I am fairly new at ccw...I Did a lot of research before I purchased the only handgun I own for delf defense and ccw. The Sig p-239 made the cut for the following reasons: 1-It's a Sig and the reputation for reliability and accuracy is excellent, 2- The p-239 only weighs 25.2 oz unloaded in 9mm.3-The width is 1.2 inches and 4- It comes with a 8 shot ext grip mag..I purchased it in November 2002 and I have had no failures through several boxes of jhp's. I have carried all day many days and it is comfortable to carry in the Wild Bills Undercover holster supported by his 1 1/4" double belt...So do your research and decide for yourself,but give the Sig serious consideration if the primary role for the gun is ccw

 

[PCRCCW]

You have an interesting situation...many many good guns out there...the wheels will always have a place in my heart....a romantic attachment if you will. Especially a nice 357 snub with full house loads...I carried a Rossi for a while...they will easily shoot with many guns twice their price.
Now for your auto question.....the P7 is like sex.......need I say more?
The Kahrs K series is as good as they get....simpy put the steel guns will always be a favorite of mine...
The 239 while a Sig never felt like one in my hands...not if you like a 226/229...just me.
The Springfield is a very nice little gun.....get the loaded version with nights....but its cond 1 which is an acquired taste.....All of them have plus's and minus's.....just different ones...

Ill put CZ's against any gun Ive owned or shot....my SA is easily as accurate as my old mans Les Baer....at 25% of the price.....
Its a bummer about hansolos guns...bad karhma?

Shoot well

 

[Hackworth92FS]

Have you ever considered a Beretta 92FS or a CZ 75, and or a Glock 17. What is wrong with polymer guns( and not plastic as you put it, somewhat of a difference)? Why buy the most expensive gun on the market. That may be a good rule of thumb in regards to other purchases, but for handguns it seems to be a very different matter. All of your choices are very good, but are they worth the price?

 

[Ian11]

SIG P239

SIG P239

Pros: Slim, Relatively Compact, Reliable, Nice DA/SA trigger, and SIG reputation for quality.

Cons: DA/SA might not be something you like but since you're used to shooting revolvers I doubt it. SIGs may be more rust prone but anyone who owns a gun should be properly taking care of them. I haven't heard any complaints about rust from those who do.

SA 1911 Champion

Pros: Cool little gun with a big spout. Cocked and Locked Carry. SA trigger makes shooting easier.

Cons: I generally don't like 1911's that stray from J.M. Browning's original design. They tend to be less reliable though there are exceptions like the Colt Defender. .45 out of short barrels aren't "all that". Will you be willing to train yourself the cocked and locked carry in case you do have to carry it?

HK P7M8

Pros: Yes very accurate, very reliable, and very well made.

Cons: Steep price. Mags are expensive too. The heat does get very uncomfortable after @50 rounds. Squeeze cocker takes some getting used to for some people. P7M8's are just as "rust prone" as SIGS but again with proper care....

Kahr K9

Pros: Slim and compact. The perfect CCW auto.

Cons: Recent Kahr production have been iffy and I heard the after service is not good.

 

[chevrofreak]

P7M8

 

[Quintin Likely]

I did a lot of research, shooting range guns and shooting friends' guns before I settled on my P239. For the time being, my primary concern is CCW...the Sig thus far as been ungodly reliable (except for the first 100 rounds or so; then again, those were cheapy ball reloads I bought from a gunshow) super accurate, more so than I am, its small, slim, and built very well, take down and maintenance is a snap too...mine is in .40, so with the 357 SIG barrel and magazines, I've effectively got two guns in one.

Cocked and locked never really sat well with me initially...kinda turned me off on 1911s for now, not to say that I don't want one eventually.

H&K P7s, I've never shot any, never handled any, only ones I've seen were behind locked glass cases with four digit price tags on them. But from what I've heard, they shoot like gangbusters, super accurate. And like everyone said, they hold their value extremely well.

I've heard mixed feelings about Kahrs...but I've never shot any of those either, so I can't really make a good judgement call on them. <edited>

 

[ACP]

All four are fairly small "belt carry" guns, which is what you'll be doing, since they really won't fit in a pocket. Here are my thoughts:

1. You've already got a gun you shoot great; why not just buy more ammo and attend some classes, or join a club?

2. I like the Springfield in .45 ACP. Tuneable, great cartridge, easy to be accurate with. Check out www.1911forum.com.

3. Second choice is the Kahr. Slim, good trigger, accurate, well-made.

4. HK. Very expensive. What are the real advantages over the Kahr, other than snob appeal?

5. Sig. Had that model, didn't like it. Too chunky, DA/SA trigger takes some getting used to.

 

[Snowdog]

Buy the excellent K9 and purchase 550 cheeseburgers with the savings.

There you go, sound logic in its most succinct form.

 

[Handy]

4. HK. Very expensive. What are the real advantages over the Kahr, other than snob appeal?

Accuracy, split times, reload times, muzzle velocity and safety. The P7 is probably the safest gun to carry loaded, whether in a holster, pocket or waistband. The Kahr is a holster only gun (light trigger weight).


The Kahr is a nice product, especially if you buy an E9 or a used K9 in the $300 range.

 

[10-Ring]

Of the bunch you've listed, I'd go w/ the P7M8. Best trigger, really good pointing characteristics, very safe design, really high cool factor, very accurate & realible. Downside is expense & how ho it gets after a relatively few amount of rounds.

 

[forcefed]

Thank you all

Thank you all for your helpful responses. Although very informative, I think they made my decision harder.

Again, I appreciate the help.
-Michael