Bad Ammo or Gun Doesn't like Heavy's?

[Southernsorrow]

Just got a savage 10, pillar bedded, custom stock the worx. "using factory .308 barrel" with Hornady BTHP 168gr's I'm getting 2inch groups at 100 yards.... with Federal American Eagle 150gr, Federal Powershock 150gr and surplus DAG 147gr I get pretty much ragged/same hole accuracy which is pretty sweet using a factory barrel... put in the hornadys and have to go up 9-10 clicks and left 2 clicks.. "1/4 moa per click" and still crap/inconsistent accuracy

I've never had any problems with hornady they always shoot perfect in whatever gun/caliber I use them in. i evan reload primarily with hornady bullets. but this is rediculous for ammo that's near $27 a box and of course I went and bought 7 boxes "gave me 10% discount" I can't return ammo "nobody lets you return ammo".

This is like the first rifle I've ever used that doesn't like heavy bullets.... unless it's just the hornady batch? everyone on savageshooters.com was telling me how much the factory barrels love 168's or else I wouldn't have gotten so many...

 

[Snakum]

168gr Amaxes and Match Kings worked best in my Savage. But I have found 155gr work well, too. I've never seen a Savage that wouldn't shoot. You just gotta find that sweet spot with the ammo.

 

[Southernsorrow]

starting to wonder if it's just this particular load, found this at midwayusa:
Jeff Bertsch of Bluffton, INDate posted: 4/28/2003

Did not hold a pattern well in my savage 10fp. Shot around 1.5 to 2 inch 3 shot patterns at 100M compared to consistant sub 1 inch patterns with another manufactures similar priced ammo at same shoot. At first I thought it was me until I tried other rounds. I was suprisingly disappointed.Was this review helpful?Yes | No64 found it helpful | 25 did not2 stars

Sol Everett of Augusta, GADate posted: 11/3/2009
This doesn't shoot well in my Savage 10FCP McMillan. Attempted several loads with Varget powder and groups were 2+ inches at 100 yds. This Savage shoots consistent 1/2 inch groups with Sierra Match Kings. All guns are different, so don't let my review discourage you. Quality of bullets seems top notch, just cant get a decent group with my rifle.Was this review helpful

 

[Southernsorrow]

whatever powder hornady used in this load also has a dog crap smell too it.. geez cheap wolf ammo smells better

 

[Birddog1911]

If you reload, best to try different bullets, different powders, etc. till you find a good load. I've been pretty blessed when it came to building loads, since I always do a lot of homework first. We'll see if that holds true for my new load!

 

[Skyshot]

My Savage like's the Nosler 165 grn BT's and 150 grn Sierra's

 

[Southernsorrow]

just would like to know what weight bullets would work best, this hornady obviously won't help me figure anything out. I'd really like to push 165 or higher. I always like ot use heavier bullets in my loads I use 75-77's in my ar-15's.

 

[Southernsorrow]

maybe just doesn't like hollowpoints, might have to try a SP or v-max/ballistic tip style

 

[Al Thompson]

Hate it for you, but, yep, some firearms are picky eaters. The windage and elevation change does not surprise me, in fact I'm surprised the Federal and DAG are close enough for no adjustments.

Only thing I can think of is to try a 200 yard group and see if the 168s "settle down" in flight. Strongly suspect they won't but you don't have any thing to lose.

Another thought is to pull the ammo apart and save the bullets and primed cases for reloading. Dump the powder on the roses.

 

[dawico]

My model 10 has a 1:10 twist, and prefers 175- 178gr bullets. Try going heavier, it may help. Mine doesn't really care for the 168s either.

 

[Txhillbilly]

My Savage 10 FCP will shoot just about any weight of bullet,and most any brand.I mainly shoot 208gr AMax's,and 210gr Sierra Matchkings and Berger VLD's at targets.
For my deer hunting loads I shoot Nosler 168gr ballistic silvertips.

I don't use factory ammo in any of my centerfires,but all of my handloads have always shot great out of my Savages.

Is your rifle new?
Did you break in the barrel?
Is the barrel copper fouled?Check for copper,if it is fouled you will get really bad groups.
The bores in some Savage rifles are pretty rough,and I know from experience that they will shread the soft jackets of a Hornady bullet.I spent a long time trying to get my Savage 110FLP 25/06 to shoot anything other than 100gr bullets.
I had to load/shoot Tubb's Final Finish bullets through it before it finally came around,but now it will shoot 75gr-120gr bullets great.The bore looked like a washboard from the factory,and it would copper up so much,it would take days to clean it.

 

[Southernsorrow]

my savage is 1:10 twist aswell....I might try heavier, slightly lower or simply another brand like nosler or sierra. I think it might simply be the powder/load used in this particular ammo. should have grabbed a box of federal gold medals then I'd have a comparison :-/. supposedly 1:10 .308 is best at 160+ while they have some barrels out there with 1:12's that are best for 135-150's... I know my ar 15 1:7 loves 75's and 55's hate anything in between... spins the jackets off of 50grainers. too much twist for such high fps i guess. I currently have a simmons WTC on there after lapping the scope rings and all I'm exactly 5 clicks up and 3 right from zero. I have a weaver v-24 I might take off my 10/22 and put on it but the WTC is doing fine for now.

 

[Southernsorrow]

broken in, lapped, spaced, go-nogo gauged. bore looks great. gets same hole groups using the above mentioned ammo just freaky how bad the 168's did. 3 inch groups is pretty bad imho for "match ammo" especially when russian wolf, surplus mil and low end federal outshoots it. I shoot better groups than that standing up, and this was from a bench rest :-x. no fouling or copper/lead buildup ran brush and some KG Big Bore solvent through it "that stuff eats copper as good as amonia based cleaners" and came out clean. scrubbed with some rem bore cleaner since that stuff has a sandy texture to it it's more like a polish/cleaner. ran some patch-out through it to get leftover carbon/powder... ran down a patch off eezox, followed by a dry and re-tried and sammmme problem :-\... yeah I use alot of claners lol each has there own purposes and perks. patch-out cleans- eezox protecs, big bore eats, rem bore scrubs.

 

[Southernsorrow]

so the gun/barrel DOES perfom just not with that factory hornady ammo. I'll probably hit Grafs and look into some 175's or 160's. don't know if I'd wanna go up in the 200gr range

 

[Snakum]

just freaky how bad the 168's did. 3 inch groups is pretty bad imho for "match ammo" especially when russian wolf, surplus mil and low end federal outshoots it.

Sounds like my recent Saiga adventure. I mean EXACTLY the same.

 

[sappyg]

just me thinking out loud:

lighter bullets have always performed better for me in cases like this. especially in 308.
usually dirty bores shoot better than clean bores.
If 150 gr. are good then 130's will be better.
there is nothing wrong with shooting a lighter bullet.

 

[courtgreene]

opposite experience. My savage 1:10 308 barrel loves 180's

 

[Southernsorrow]

picked up some Winchester supreme silvertip 168gr and federal gold medal 175grs ...I got pretty much same group size around .54-.62. which is pretty nice coming from a factory barrel at 100yards... so now I need to decide which to buy for reloading pretty much all around same price per 250

Hornady A-max 168
Hornady BTHP 168
Nosler BTHP 175

not planning on doing any real serious shooting so not splurging for the SMKs
but one of the 3 above come in the more price friendly 250packs

100-150yard is about where I'll be shooting at all 3 are pretty much $66.99per250 ea.

which would you choose?

 

[essayons21]

Try Black Hills Gold or Federal GMM 168s. They both seem to work well in most .308 bolt rifles.

 

[Southernsorrow]

I got enough pre-loaded ammo's trying to decide which weight to go with for reloading

 

[essayons21]

A good way to find a handload your rifle likes is to find a factory load it likes. Then use the same bullet, same powder if possible, load to similar MV and same OAL. Then tweak from there. It cuts out a ton of the guess work.

 

[GooseGestapo]

I'm going to suggest a bad batch of bullets. There's quite a lot that goes into manufacturing bullets. Most times the bullets are bad it has to do with the core-seater die adjustment. If the jacket or core is mis-fed, they will be crooked and inconsistent (bullet will wobble). Just a 0.003" mis-adjustment can cause a bad batch of bullets. They will appear "OK", but results on target won't be....
I've seen similar issues with some Hornady bullets of different weight and bullet diameters.
And Hornady isn't the only bullet company the produces "lemons" from time to time. But because they are bigger than most and produce so many bullets, they more often can have some "bad" bullets get away from them.

Hornady does let go of some "blems" from time to time and they are sold by other vendors. Usually due to mis-colored jackets. All have performed as 1st quality bullets, however. Sounds like a bad batch of bullets that didn't get caught by the Q&A folks.

Try another lot# of the same bullets/ammo. Then you'll know if it was the ammo or your gun.

 

[redbullitt]

my 10 has shot everything from 155 to 180 very well. I haven had issues, but I am loading my own and sifting out the junk loads. I bet those hornady ones just are not good. They usually have very good stuff. I gotta go with bad batch too.