Bad time at a Gun Shop in CO
- Thread starter Dravur
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leadcounsel
member
Never understood consignment for guns - they would be easy to move IMO, and for more $.
Maybe you can work a deal directly with the owner and cut out the shady gun dealer.
Maybe you can work a deal directly with the owner and cut out the shady gun dealer.
KodiakBeer
member
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There are unethical people in every business out there.
Many years ago I found an old used .22 rifle on a dealer's rack, and made an offer on it. The guy at the counter (owner's son) took my offer, and I filled out the 4473 form while he called in the background check. It was delayed for some unknown reason, so I said I'd be back to pick it up in a few days. I offered to pay then but he said to just pay when I pick it up (mistake!).
When I went to get it, the owner said that his son shouldn't have sold it so cheap, they couldn't make any money at that price, and I would have to pay $15 more if I wanted it. When I protested, he claimed they "lost" my 4473 and background check.
I stupidly went ahead and bought it, but ever since it has irked me. After all, a deal's a deal, and it's especially bad to "lose" a customer's paperwork.
Many years ago I found an old used .22 rifle on a dealer's rack, and made an offer on it. The guy at the counter (owner's son) took my offer, and I filled out the 4473 form while he called in the background check. It was delayed for some unknown reason, so I said I'd be back to pick it up in a few days. I offered to pay then but he said to just pay when I pick it up (mistake!).
When I went to get it, the owner said that his son shouldn't have sold it so cheap, they couldn't make any money at that price, and I would have to pay $15 more if I wanted it. When I protested, he claimed they "lost" my 4473 and background check.
I stupidly went ahead and bought it, but ever since it has irked me. After all, a deal's a deal, and it's especially bad to "lose" a customer's paperwork.
Buck Snort
Member
Dravur wrote: "I guess I will have to limit my business to places I can trust." That's always sage advice.
Sure sounds shady to me. You have every right to be upset. It can't really be about the money, because the dealer is only going to gain the commission on the extra $100. Sounds like this guy gets a charge out of manipulating people.
Moral of the story: The deal's not really done until cash changes hands.
Moral of the story: The deal's not really done until cash changes hands.
Bubbles
Member
That's because 1) you have a good idea of what your guns are worth, 2) you know of places like gunbroker where you can advertise them for minimal fees, and 3) you know how to legally transfer the guns to a buyer.
OTOH there are elderly ladies out there whose husbands pass away, who don't want their husband's firearms, have no idea what they are worth, and don't know anything about gun laws. In those cases consigning the guns nets them more $ in the long run than simply selling them to the dealer.
FWIW if I were the guy who consigned the gun to the shop mentioned by the OP, and found out they'd ****ed around like that with a buyer, I'd go retrieve the gun and consign it elsewhere.
cleardiddion
Member
Guess I'll be trekking up to Ft Collins/Loveland.
I remember that there was supposed to be an alright shop in Boulder but I can't recall the name.
Does anyone know the shop?
I remember that there was supposed to be an alright shop in Boulder but I can't recall the name.
Does anyone know the shop?
CoRoMo
Member
I looked around yesterday, for an email address to their business, but couldn't find one. Surprising that a business... today... doesn't have a website or at least, an email address in their listing. Anyway, I found nothing, but I was going to send them a link to this thread. I've done that before on threads like this, that rant about the shady moves a business makes. I realize that this controversy is none of my business, but it would be good if the upper levels of management knew how many Coloradoans have heard about this one bad decision that was made, and what sort of ramifications it has caused.
Ala Dan
Member in memoriam
Sorry For Your Misfortunes-
You did very well, my friend~! A deal, is a deal, is a deal - regardless, in my
way of think'in. Sounds like the owner collaberated with the seller to screw
you, olut of more money~! I could not, and would not do business with that
shop ever again~!
You did very well, my friend~! A deal, is a deal, is a deal - regardless, in my
way of think'in. Sounds like the owner collaberated with the seller to screw
you, olut of more money~! I could not, and would not do business with that
shop ever again~!
Average Joe
Member
I would call the owner and work out a private sale...I would NEVER set foot in that gun shop again....
Dravur
Member
Naw. I talked to the owner about this and he was cool right from the start. He offered to call them and drop the price back. The gun store did the wrong thing here by calling him after they had a deal on the gun. The owner was cool, and I can honestly say, I hope he gets the money for it. He was a stand up guy.
But I will never go into Green Mountain guns again.
But I will never go into Green Mountain guns again.
.455_Hunter
Member
Gunsport Colorado
Great Shop!
MountainBear
Member
I spent 14 months in the Denver area. I made the rounds at the various shops. The two worst shops in the area were generally Green Mtn Guns (after they moved to their current location, they were okay, not great, but okay, before the move) and the small shop west of Denver (I think it was Lakewood or Golden, can't remember the name). I generally went to The Gun Room and G&G on Colfax (right around the corner from each other).
I don't have as many gunshops to choose from now that I'm back in central Oregon, but the quality of them is great...
I don't have as many gunshops to choose from now that I'm back in central Oregon, but the quality of them is great...
Huh, sorry to hear this. I've been to GMG several times, just to buy small things and to gawk and fondle the used guns. Never bought a gun there, guess I won't now. Their prices always seemed too high for me too. Probably 90% of my guns came from FTF sales anyway.
woad_yurt
Member
If you google "Green Mountain Guns," you'll get the Lakewood part of the Citysearch site. You may want to post your comments and a link to this thread. I think folks may want to know this before giving their money to someone who'll rescind a deal for an extra $100. Here it is:
http://denver.citysearch.com/profile/1857548/lakewood_co/green_mountain_guns.html
http://denver.citysearch.com/profile/1857548/lakewood_co/green_mountain_guns.html
1) The original owner would have to go through and pay for a background check to get his gun back.
2) Even though it sounds like the shop owner is a jerk, the OP did discover the gun at his shop and for the OP and the owner to go behind his back and negotiate a direct sale would be ethically shaky. Although the shop owner probably deserves it.
Why in the world would he have to go through a background check? If you take a gun to a shop to sell on consignment it still belongs to you. You don't have to have a background check to get your gun back. You don't get one when you drop it off to have it worked on.
The dealer tried to screw the buyer. No loyalty is owed there.
budiceman
Member
Should of put cash down to make it binding. He said, she said pretty much means nothing now days. How do you know the gun owner is telling you the whole story? As far as small claims court you have nothing without anything in writing! Sorry about your loss!
While I understand your position, there's the little matter of Federal law:
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/licensees-conduct-of-business.html#consignment-records
"Q: Must a dealer record firearms received on consignment?
Yes. Firearms received for sale on consignment must be entered in the dealer’s “bound book.”
Sales of the firearms are handled in the same manner as other firearm sales. Return of the remaining firearms by the licensee to the consignor is entered in the dealer’s disposition record. An ATF Form 4473 and a NICS check must be completed." (emphasis added)
Returning a gun after gunsmithing is different legally. No NICS check is required.
While I agree, with this the gun owner still has a consignment contract with the shop owner and selling the gun to someone who discovered the gun while on consignment violates it. At least technically.
If the shop owner wanted to he could take the gun owner to court. "Yeah, a customer was interested in the gun, but we were unable to agree on a price." Which is at least technically true. "Then the gun owner made a deal with my customer behind my back." Which is true. It certainly sux, but there you are. The dealer has a contract and the customer has nothing.
Bubbles
Member
Maybe so, maybe no. The seller dictates the price on our consignment agreement. If the buyer makes an offer in line with that price then the gun gets sold.
For example, suppose the seller comes in with a gun and in the contract he states he wants at least $400 for it. We add our consignment fee, potential auction fees, markup (because in doing research we find it's worth more than $400), and offer it for sale.
To keep the math easy, assume the consginment fee is $35, auction fees around $10, markup is $55, so advertised price is $500. If we get offered $475 in the shop, the gun is sold, we get the $35 consignment fee, and the seller gets $440. Not selling the gun in that instance violates the consignment agreement.
rocky branch
Member
A man's as good as his word.
I'd never go back.
I'd never go back.
It's not a question of price, it's that if the shop owner wanted to be a jerk, and there's ample evidence to support that, he could claim that the customer and gun owner are dealing directly in order to cut him out of his commission.
I agree that a consignment sale should operate like you have described.
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