Ballistic gelatin test results - .45ACP

[Brass Fetcher]

45ACP +P 185 grain Cor-Bon DPX

Calibration = 9.8 ± 0.05cm BB penetration at 608 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

Recoil operated semi-auto pistol with 5.0” long barrel.

Shot 1 penetrated 16 ± 0.031” and exited the back of the block. 0.613 ± 0.0005” average diameter. Impact velocity = 1057 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

Shot 2 penetrated 16 ± 0.031” and exited the back of the block. 0.603 ± 0.0005” average diameter. Impact velocity = 1031 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

Shot 3 penetrated 16 ± 0.031” and exited the back of the block. 0.608 ± 0.0005” average diameter. Impact velocity = 1048 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

Shot 4 penetrated 16 ± 0.031” and exited the back of the block. 0.577 ± 0.0005” average diameter. Impact velocity = 1063 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

Shot 5 penetrated 12.6 ± 0.031” and exited the side of the block. Bullet was not recovered. Impact velocity = 1051 ± 0.500 ft/sec.

http://www.brassfetcher.com/subpage3.html

 

[tg_26101]

this looks to me like all you have recovered is the jacket. did this have a lead core, and what happened to the core? or is this a total copper bullet, and the jacket is all there is to the bullet? thanks.

tg

 

[DirksterG30]

this looks to me like all you have recovered is the jacket. did this have a lead core, and what happened to the core? or is this a total copper bullet, and the jacket is all there is to the bullet? thanks.

tg

Corbon DPX is an all-copper bullet.

 

[Bobarino]

wow! when they say deep, they mean deep! this would be a good carr load for inadvertant run ins with bears in the wildreness and the like. thanks for you work and for the info JE223.

Bobby

 

[HighVelocity]

Pretty impressive results from the 5" barrel. Would it be possible to get some test results fired from a 3" barrel? I have been considering this load for my little Kimber Ultra.

 

[Brass Fetcher]

When I test gelatin for someone, I charge $100 per (16x6x6)" block if I have to use a gun here locally and recieve your ammunition via UPS.

But sometimes this is not practical, like when the customer wants to find out how their particular ammunition will work with their particular gun. In this case, one block can be shipped to your location for $50, with the buyer paying the shipping fees. This is also where things can get expensive - to insure the best results, the gelatin should be shipped in an insulated and/or cooled container. This adds weight and cost, depending upon the carrier.

 

[bigmike45]

JE223,

How far away from the muzzle was the block of gelatin. I would really like to try the same brand in 230gr. from my Wilson Professional 4".

I currently carry Federal HydraShok's in all my .45acp guns. My three Wilson's really like them for accuracy and reliabile feeding.

I also have a stupidly analytical question. How far into the block did the expansion occur? Is that something that could be measured at all? My thinking is, if penetration happend halfway through the block, then that would be usless as a defensive round as it would have exited the body before expansion, per your tests results, making it literally a FMJ.

Mike

 

[Brass Fetcher]

The distance from the guns muzzle to the front of the block is usually 6 feet.

"I also have a stupidly analytical question. How far into the block did the expansion occur? Is that something that could be measured at all? My thinking is, if penetration happend halfway through the block, then that would be usless as a defensive round as it would have exited the body before expansion, per your tests results, making it literally a FMJ."

Thank you for the questions. On the picture of the block, just past the entrance point, you might be able to see a hole that is much smaller in diameter than the region just beyond it. In my testing, I cannot recall seeing the track maintain this hole diameter for much greater penetration than one bullet length.

In fact, if a person could design a bullet to initiate expansion, deep into the block, that would be an almost ideal bullet design. This is because an attackers vital organs (assuming this is the 'target' of the design) are located deep within their body. I have heard this depth range anywhere from 6-8" into the chest cavity. Retarding the expansion of the bullet until a deeper penetration would produce something more like that disruption visible at the front of any shot block - deeper in the body and closer to the vital organs. This is because the unexpanded bullet should encounter less resistance to penetraion, due to it's smaller diameter.

JE223

 

[ghost squire]

Nice tests, but WTH are you guys talking about? The penetration is good but the expanded diameter is terrible. And you realize it would be even worse at range. IMO its barely worth the tradeoff of reliability in some guns with this round... There are many far better JHPs.

 

[MrChicken]

Nice tests, but WTH are you guys talking about? The penetration is good but the expanded diameter is terrible. And you realize it would be even worse at range. IMO its barely worth the tradeoff of reliability in some guns with this round... There are many far better JHPs.

It appears that the bullets have reached full expansion. It looks like the petals have folded as far as the skives will allow. It may be that Corbon designed them this way to get deeper penetration, or it may be a limitation imposed by the all copper bullet. Increased range may not limit expansion as much as you think. It would be interesting to see at what velocity does the bullet fail to expand.

The blocks appear to be showing bullets expanding to the widest diameter shortly after entering the block, followed by a narrower track as the petals fold over to a final and smaller diameter.

 

[runninmike]

Sorry if I'm thinking silly here, but doesn't shooting into a block of gelatin just prove to someone how far a bullet will penetrate a block of gelatin?
I mean a bullet never deviates much from it's intended path right? -when fired into a block of gelatin?
Wouldn't it seem more realistic for whoever came up with this idea of gelatin block tests, to strap shirt or jacket around 2 big racks of ribs with some beef entrails and major beef organs and a piece of spine to see what really happens? I think you could say if a gun of any caliber can penetrate a 4"x4" piece of wood fully, it would certainly pierce a human or game animal @ least 4" right? Who knows? As a 4"x4" piece of wood contains no bone or organs-and a .22 magnum will penetrate a 8"x8" oil soaked railroad tie, yet a .38 special won't, does that make a .22 mag a more wonderful defense or hunting round? I don't know. Things to ponder. Gelatin isn't really that interesting of a scientific bullet catching medium to me-no offense to those who think it is.
Best-MC

 

[MrChicken]

Just as gelatin isn't human flesh, neither is beef.
Beef ribs are larger than human ribs, much larger.

Shooting blocks of wood doesnt give you a good idea of how bullets perform in humans.

Gelatin isnt perfect, but it's what we have....

 

[runninmike]

I guess.

 

[280PLUS]

Nice job, Thanks for the info. I'll put a block or two on my wish list.

 

[Brass Fetcher]

You're welcome. There is a difference between the terms 'expanded diameter' and 'average expanded diameter', although the two are sometimes confused.

ghost squire mentioned the term expanded diameter. If you measured the extreme expanded diameter of these bullets, you would see that that is about 0.66". The expanded diameter of the 'typical' JHP is 1.5 times its original diameter. Thus 0.451" * 1.5 = 0.677". Bullets with a smaller average expanded diameter penetrate deeper, all else being equal. These bullets have a smaller expanded diameter than some conventional JHPs, giving them deeper penetration, hence the label 'DPX'.

Average expanded diameter, the diameter that I list on my websites test results, is the average of two measurements for each bullet: one measurement is across the furthest points on the face of the bullet (extreme diameter) and the other measurement is across the nearest points on the face of the bullet, often between the 'petals' of the deformed jacket. This second smaller measurement makes the average expanded diameter smaller than the extreme diameter, but is more conservative in nature and should provide more meaningful results to the end user of the information.

JE223

 

[RyanM]

Sorry if I'm thinking silly here, but doesn't shooting into a block of gelatin just prove to someone how far a bullet will penetrate a block of gelatin?

There've been about a million tests comparing bullet penetration in properly calibrated gelatin to anesthatized swine muscle tissue. There've also been some studies comparing actual gunshot wounds in humans to gelatin results. Both have shown that gelatin results have a very high correlation with real life shooting results, in terms of penetration depth, expanded diameter, and temporary cavity diameter.

 

[runninmike]

There've been about a million tests comparing bullet penetration in properly calibrated gelatin to anesthatized swine muscle tissue. There've also been some studies comparing actual gunshot wounds in humans to gelatin results. Both have shown that gelatin results have a very high correlation with real life shooting results, in terms of penetration depth, expanded diameter, and temporary cavity diameter.

Thanks- I have also read about some caliber test shootings on several live goats, which they said had "about" the same physical makeup of a human, and I thought that was intesting too, it just seemed to me kind of odd that they would be testing in gelatin vs flesh and bone tissue, but after learning that these gels have kind of a similar elasticity, wound channel and such of the human abdomen, it is understandable.
Best-MC