Berger VLD Vs. Sierra HPBT 169 Gr

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I have a Rem 700 SPS Bull barrel that loves Sierra match HPBT 168 grain on paper. I decided to hunt with the rifle and have tried several different hunting bullets (Nosler Accubond, Nosler Ballistic, Nosler Silver Tip, Hornady SST)l but am unable to get the accuracy as I do the Sierra. I finally ordered the Berger VLD in 168 grain. Looks very much like the sierra HPBT. Anyone know what the differences are? If it is just a HPBT like the sierra, I have plenty of those. Sierra does not recommend hunting with the HPBT. Thanks in advance.
 
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I have a Rem 700 SPS Bull barrel that loves Sierra match HPBT 168 grain on paper. I decided to hunt with the rifle and have tried several different hunting bullets (Nosler Accubond, Nosler Ballistic, Nosler Silver Tip, Hornady SST)l but am unable to get the accuracy as I do the Sierra. I finally ordered the Berger VLD in 168 grain. Looks very much like the sierra HPBT. Anyone know what the differences are? If it is just a HPBT like the sierra, I have plenty of those. Sierra does not recommend hunting with the HPBT. Thanks in advance.
What have you tried with the new loads how bad is the accuracy? I assume you aren't just taking you SMK load data and duplicating it for the different bullets. Tiny groups are great, but not exactly neccessary for hunting purposes.

Plenty of people choose to hunt with match bullets too. I have not and therefore cannot offer any experience in that area.
 
I think the biggest difference is that Berger has officially stated that their Hunting VLDs are for hunting. I've used Berger VLDs on 3 deer and 4 pronghorns with excellent results but I'm confident Sierra match bullets would have also killed them.

That said, the hunting regulations in some states dictate that a bullet used for certain types of hunting has to be "designed to expand." Sierra match bullets are not designed to expand.
 
A HPBT Match bullet is a poor hunting bullet, regardless of who makes it. They are not made to expand, and if there is expansion, it is erratic. The hands-down best Match bullet for big game hunting with a .30 caliber rifle I have found, is the Hornady 178gr Amax bullet.

Don
 
Accuracy...

Orange Park Plink--IMX, the Nosler Accubond and the Nosler Ballistic Tip are right behind the SMK in accuracy, and not very far behind, either.

FWIW, there was a ad at one time touting the Nosler BT as "the hunting bullet that thinks it's a target bullet."

The Sierra Game King is no slouch either, in the accuracy department. (Personally I prefer plastic tips to lead tips in a hunting bullet--Not as liable to "pocket damage" but that's the only thing about the SGK that I don't like. They kill deer like gangbusters.)

As 68 W. J. has pointed out, you don't need match accuracy for hunting--The "kill zone" of a 10-ring is MUCH smaller than that of a deer, at any ethical hunting range! While sub-MOA accuracy is nice for bragging, a 1.5-MOA rifle and load, or even 2 MOA, will do nicely for deer-sized critters. Provided, of course, that YOU are up to the task!
 
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USSR;
In most instances, you are correct, but regarding the Berger VLD "Hunting" bullets, you are mistaken.

The Berger VLD "Hunting" bullets use the very thin J4 jackets. Besides being amoung the best in the industry, they are very thin. The VLD's have been extensively studied and do indeed expand, and very well indeed!

The VLD's tend to penetrate ~2" before expanding, and then destabilize and expand violently. Recovered bullets typically retain ~40% of their original weight. Some hunters actually like such performance on thin skin game. I'm one of those.....

I have verified this myself with 3 deer taken with the Berger .257" 115gr VLD "Hunting" bullets. 2 from a .257Roberts and one from a .257WbyMag. All three were "bang-flops", DRT...

On both the deer shot with the Roberts, the bullets exited broadside chest shots. Damage was dramatic. Exit wound was about 3" diameter. Similar to that of a 115gr Nosler Ballistic Tip, which is essentally a hollow-point with a plastic nose cone.

With the .257wby, the angling chest shot ended in the paunch and bullet was not recovered from a very messy gut cavity. The deer look liked it had fallen on an exploding hand-grenade.

Often times, the Sierra's will fail to expand due to nose collapse on impact and penetrate as a FMJ. Occasionally, they will rupture and break-apart and fail to penetrate. Sierra takes a lot of pride in their game bullets, so as such don't recommend the use of their match bullets for hunting...... Though a well placed 169gr of lead will often do the trick on light thin-skinned game such as white tail deer, mule deer, and pronghorn antelope....

The Berger "target" bullets actually use a much thicker jacket than the original match bullets with the thinner jackets. Some rifles shoot better with the thicker jackets, such as semi-auto rifles. Hence, the difference in the various Berger VLD's. Berger does NOT recommend the use of the "target" bullets for hunting.
 
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Well, GooseGestapo, I said 'A HPBT Match bullet is a poor hunting bullet' and you say the 'Berger VLD "Hunting" bullets' are good for hunting. Seems like I am talking about a bullet designed strictly for "Match" shooting, and you are talking about a bullet designed for "Hunting" purposes.

Don
 
All thanks for your insight. For some reason I was not getting notified of threads added. I will check to make sure I did not miss it. I had been trying the same bullets on a 30-06 as the .308. My buddy and I decided to split the costs of bullets until we found the most accurate for each of the rifle. I tried some Berger 168 VLDs in the 30-06 and was able to group under 1/2 inch. I am happy with that. I am going to try them on my .308 next.
68wj: I am getting inch groupings with all the loads, but I know what the rifle is capable of and would really like to duplicate it with a hunting round.
USSR:
I will look into the Hornady's if the Bergers do not pan out.
N4z:
I will try and swap for a few sierras if the Bergers fail. (Probably should have thought of that to begin with)

All thanks for your input. I will definitely stick with a "hunting bullet". The Berger was successful in the 30-06 and hopefully it will also be with the .308.
 
Hornady and Sierra both offer 165 gr bullets made for hunting that have worked very well for my .308. They each make an old fashioned spire point that is time proven in terms of expansion. And Sierra also makes a 165 gr HP Game King that I have shot very well but not used on game. Finally Hornady also makes their 165 gr SST that is devastating on game and quite accurate. I like all of them. I have almost quit using match bullets for my 308 because my 308 is first and foremost a hunting rifle so I only develop loads for it that will be suitable for hunting.
 
I have used the Hornady SSTs in my Ruger 30-06 and I do agree that it is devastating on game. I would like to look into the HP Game king since the match 168 shoots so well out if it now. Thanks.
 
I hunted with the Sierra 165g HP gameking two seasons ago, its accuracy was so good in my .308, I couldn't resist. After loosing a good deal of meat on a shoulder-shot mulie, I would not use it again. Yes, the deer died quickly, but it is a shame to loose edible portions. Now I would take 1.5 MOA and a better designed bullet over .5 MOA and over fragmentaion any day.

On a side note, the Berger "hunting" bullets seem a marketing scam to me. They even seem to condone shooting elk with these almost varmit-type bullets.
 
One of the guys I hunt with will use the VLD this season. He will get plenty of shotts and I will be able to tell.
 
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