Best budget defense/utility rifle?

[AcceptableUserName]

I'm finally looking at getting rifle. As of now I've stuck to the realm of pistols and shotguns primarily because of price. I believe AR-15's to be EXTREMELY nice and they shoot amazing but I feel they're overpriced. I do NOT like the 7.62x39 cartridge at all due to accuracy issues and it just jostles a lot. Follow-up shots are nowhere near as good as the .223's imo. With that much recoil I'd just go full-bore and get an FAL or one of the new Kel-Tec PTR guns.


Given this, what would you recommend? Mini-14's seem to get a bad rap, but they seem like the rifle for me. I'm looking for something that's easy to maintain, durable as all get out, PREFERABLY a .223 or 5.56 and NOT an overpriced AR. Maybe one of the Ak-74 (5.45 or whatever)? Obviously an FN gun is not budget so I've left that out....let me know what you guys think.

 

[rmuzz]

I think that you are probably a bit hasty in immediately discounting the 7.62x39 round, but if you think you would like something in 5.56 I had a chance to try a Remington 7615 last time I was at the range. Its pump action, not semi... but shot well and felt nice, and costs 1/2 the price of an AR.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Well... there is nothing inherently wrong with 7.62x39mm in the accuracy department. A quality barrel + quality ammo = good accuracy. You cannot judge the cartridge by Wolf ammo running in a WASR. I also find the x39 recoil much, much milder than most .308 guns, other than .308 guns that weigh 10lbs and up.

Kel-Tec's new gun is the RFB. The PTR is a completely different design, a clone of the HK91 (semi-auto G3).

If you want an inexpensive and nearly indestructible .223, the Saiga .223 is very hard to beat.

A Mini-14 would be fine too, but is getting close to an AR in price but without the typical accuracy, accessory options, or availability of parts. BTW, the AR looks pretty economic to me when you consider its out of the box accuracy and ergonomics. IIRC when they were introduced there were only like 10 countries on earth capable of doing all the machining required. Obviously time changes and CNC is now common, but I think they are a bargain when you consider the machining and fabrication involved.

Also, if you want a decent number of spare mags, being able to buy quality $10 AR mags by the case quickly adds up in comparison to $20-40 or more for magazines for a Mini or non-converted Saiga. (The PTR/G3 is the absolute champion of cheap magazines, for now at least.)

 

[AcceptableUserName]

I should clarify - not trying to bash the 7.62 round or the rifles that shoot it, it just doesn't feel good to me. I've been shooting them since I was 10 or 11 and I MUCH prefer the .223...it's a lot easier for follow up shots in my opinion. That Remington 7615 IS intriguing...also, that's right, the RFB. Any idea on how hard it is to get one and how quality they are? I've owned Keltec products before and like them....

 

[AcceptableUserName]

The Saiga .223 is pretty intriguing too...what kind of mags does it take? Just proprietary Saiga mags? And are there any compliance requirements?

 

[Z-Michigan]

Saiga .223 takes proprietary mags. You can convert it to take Galil and some AK 5.45 mags but it's a substantial amount of work. It would have to be 922(r) compliant if you either use a magazine over 10 rds or convert it to take any other magazine (regardless of whether you use a Galil or AK mag over 10rds). However, you can get a Saiga .223 for something in the $350-400 range and convert it for maybe $150-200. Budget about $38 each for 30rd US-made magazines that don't require further modification to the magwell area.

 

[cleetus03]

Marlin 336 30-30 for 347.99 New at Wal-Mart

Best budget defense/utility rifle?

Think about it

 

[Birdmang]

Yea but it doesn't look mean, and stuff.

 

[cleetus03]

I know right, a few weeks back my coworker buddy asked why I had a Red Ryder BB Gun in my truck referring to the Marlin propped up against the passenger seat.

 

[Birdmang]

Haha I was kidding, those Marlins are awesome.

 

[AcceptableUserName]

I'd be fine with the Marlin I already have a pre-64 Winchester though.

 

[cpirtle]

I have a Remington 7615p with Wilson ghost ring sights and the Speedfeed pistol grip stock and it's a fantastic gun. Takes standard AR mag's and is chambered for 5.56.

Everywhere I go with it I get asked questions because even though they are not rare, you just don't see a lot of them. I got mine NIB on Gunbroker for $500 despite the ~$950 SRP.

 

[RP88]

the 7.62x39 round has plenty enough accuracy. Give it a try. Sure, I like .223 better, but I'd feel fine hitting anything within average hunting and defense ranges with relative ease with the Soviet round.

With that said, a Saiga in either .223 or 7.62x39, or an SKS is as good as it gets for budget and defense/utility.

From there, I'd either go with a shotgun or a budget increase and grab an AK-47 or lower-end AR.

 

[Gryffydd]

You cannot judge the cartridge by Wolf ammo running in a WASR.

I can bust clays all day long shooting offhand at 80-100 yards with Wolf ammo in my WASR with stock sights. That's all I would ask an "assault rifle" to do for me. I don't ask it to be a varmint gun, I ask it to be a fighting rifle. It's PLENTY accurate for that.

I should clarify - not trying to bash the 7.62 round or the rifles that shoot it, it just doesn't feel good to me.

If it doesn't feel good to you, that's fine. That's a valid reason not to use it. But tossing out comments like "accuracy issues..." is something else entirely.

 

[mcdonl]

DPMS has a few AR's for under $800, and that is only about $200 more then the lower priced Mini-14's I have seen.

 

[cleetus03]

Based on the fact I have no experience or knowledge on AR-15's, could anyone flatter me by answering the following? Whats the cheapest one could expect to be able to play in the AR-15 market? I'm talking about a plain jane classic M16A1 20" type here not a fancy dancy M4gry?

AcceptableUserName, after your comment

I'd be fine with the Marlin I already have a pre-64 Winchester though.

I somehow find myself equally pondering curiously on possibly buying a budget minded .223 defense/utility rifle.

 

[cpirtle]

Right now, probably $800 still a little hard to find the entry level ones - in 6 months assuming they don't ban them, then excess supply will probably drop the price for an entry level AR into the $600+ range.

I think in 6 months the AR market will be a buyers market as dealers are starting to get in 8 months worth of orders at once.

 

[Z-Michigan]

I'm talking about a plain jane classic M16A1 20" type here not a fancy dancy M4gry?

Right now an M16A1-looking AR would actually be considered retro and somewhat special, and an M4gery or at least a 16" barrel with a telestock is about as common as it gets. You could get a DPMS Sportical, which is the latter, for $700-800 depending on your area and how hard you look. That would be serviceable but nothing special. I have seen Smith & Wesson M&P15s, which are a nice, quality AR, for something in the $875 range, and you might also find a Bushmaster, Armalite, CMMG or Charles Daly in about that range as well, all of which are also good solid brands that I would be happy to own.

Check out this dealer for some good deals, especially on the S&W (basic .223 for $860):
http://www.whittakerguns.com/ar.htm

 

[sigma 40ve]

Budget rifle?

IMO, it's hard to beat an sks. I have 3 Yugos. Wish I had bought a bunch when they were $100 or even less. I paid $150 for my expensive one. I know they are more now.

FWIW, I can hit a man size metal "gong" at 210 yds with each of mine with any ammo, from a standing stance. That is good enough for me, given the situation I might be forced to use one in.

 

[Deus Machina]

If you're willing to give x39 another shot, +1 for the SKS.

If you're married to lighter rounds, you can get a stock Saiga for not much more. Don't let anyone tell you the AK platform is inherently inaccurate until you've tried a Saiga.

Plus, if you want cheap full-capacity magazines, someone (I don't feel like digging around) sells parts to convert a Saiga (probably any appropriate AK) to AR mags. I've been considering grabbing one just for that.

 

[Gunther]

Waht are you looking for? A semi-auto, pump, lever. Narrow down your choices by use. If you want a Farm/Hunting/Truck gun in 223 then a Rem pump or bolt gun (Model 7) may be you ticket. If Defense,SHTF,varmint then AR/Mini-14 may be the way to go. Let us know your thoughts so we can narrow it down.

 

[mgkdrgn]

Hows about a nice used lever gun in 30-30? You can pick up a very nice Marlin for under $250 with a little careful shopping.

 

[cleetus03]

He already commented on post #11 he had a Winchester 30-30.


I am assuming like me the OP already has a pump, bolt-action, and lever rifle, and is looking for a "budget defense/utility" high capacity semiautomatic to complete the arsenal.

 

[cpirtle]

Here's a couple of shots of my 7615p..

Short of laying down some rapid fire it covers a lot of bases..

(okay, so it comes with a neutered mag, but AR mag's are cheap and plentiful )

 

[DeepSouth]

I think you are discounting a cartridge base on the inaccuracy of cheap guns and the common use of cheap ammo in that particular caliber. For instance I don't think a Mini-14 would be any more or less accurate than a Mini-30. I'll also say that I believe the Mini-14's get a bad rap because of the company's involvement in the first AWB , not because of the function of the gun.

I think you might want to reconsider the AK-74. If the AK-47's aren't accurate enough for you, the AK-74 won't be either. It is not the caliber that is making it "inaccurate" it is the design of the AK. With that said they aren't as inaccurate as most people make them out to be, if you buy a good one. I hear the Saiga's are fairly accurate from what I understand.