Bluing Salts Removal

[Jennison]

Hello: I recently purchased a new condition Norinco Model 1897 Trench shotgun. When I took it apart to inspect and clean it, I was surprised to find red rust on the inside of the magazine tube, inside the receiver and in the trigger group. The rust was glistening under oil and factory grease. After hearing similar stories, I am convinced the factory didn’t properly remove all the bluing salts. Is there an effective home remedy to completely remove these leftover salts and stop the rust? This is the only gun I own that has this problem.

thank you very much, Jennison

 

[entropy]

Pics? I don't believe that's the problem. Bluing salts rust blue. Left on, they tend to cause pitting instead of red rust. They use selenium to effect the blue coloring. Red rust is caused by something else. My guess would be high humidity conditions when the cosmoline (preservative grease, the 'factory grease' ) was applied.

 

[DocRock]

That's just garden variety rust. Kerosene and wiping off as much as you can with shop towel and cotton. Once you get as much as you can off, hit it with Barricade and keep an eye on it.

 

[Jennison]

My apologies for not having pics; I tried, but failed and couldn’t capture the problem. There is pitting in the areas where I removed that rust, especially in the tube. Looks like “spotted putting” (patterned more like water spots) as opposed Is typical clusters of pits I’ve seen from rusting. If plain old rust, that would obviously be “better” but it looks different. The magazine tube was a smooth reddish throughout, too. I’ll try my best to follow up with better photos.
I really appreciate the help and advice.

Jennison.

 

[Jennison]

These photos aren’t so hot, I know, but hopefully they’ll be somewhat illustrative. One photo (hazy) shows (sort of). the putting inside the magazine tube. Another shows the type of pitting. Two others are of the inside of the slide (through the end and through the slide slot); the last photos are of the trigger group. I’d cleaned away the rust inside both tubes with steel wool and Flitz on a hand drill. The trigger group still has most of its rust:

 

[entropy]

Degrease it first; it's so covered in cosmoline it's hard to tell what's what. I do see some of what you mention inside the trigger guard, shows that either they were hot blued with parts in place, or cold blued with parts in place. Either way, not a quality method of bluing. But then, it is Norinco, so don't expect a deep Colt Blue.

 

[Jennison]

Thanks. Sorry, I should've mentioned that I did clean and degrease everything. I cleaned out the rust inside the magazine tube and on the inside of the slide with steel wool & flitz on a drill.. I haven't cleaned the rust off the trigger group yet. The oil you see now was applied by me. There's no red left inside the tube or slide. I also noticeed on the outside of the blued trigger guard there was some crud that was the same color as the bluing. I had to scrape it off with my finger nail. If these are left over bluing salts, how can I get rid of them?

 

[Clemson]

Bluing salts are white.

 

[Jennison]

Sorry, I was referring to the rust and pitting on the inside of the parts, not the stuff I scraped off with my nail. To be clear, Norinco did indeed use hot salt-bluing for the Model 1897 shotgun reproduction. I was told that leftover bluing salts on the inside of these guns is common and will continue to cause rust if not completely removed. I am diligent about cleaning and oiling my firearms and don't normally have a problem with rust; this is unsettling. These Norinco trench shotguns, especially the last ones made are not at all cheap now and routinely sell for $1,000 and up. Given the possibility of these salts being present, is there a step I can take to completely remove them?

Thanks again, Jennison

 

[Clemson]

Salts are removed by boiling the parts in water. After that you use a water displacing oil. Finally, you wipe off the water displacing oil and coat the gun with gun or or grease to prevent corrosion. In my experience, salts left on a gun generally show up as a white line where two parts join (as at the barrel-receiver joint). I have seen them bleed out over several weeks time. They can be wiped off with an oily cloth and will cause no harm. They do not generally cause rusting.

 

[Jennison]

Thank you Clemson! Last question: Does tap water work, or should I use distilled water?

Jennison

 

[Clemson]

We use tap water, but our water supply has very few minerals.

 

[Jennison]

This is great info and I appreciate it. One very last question: For water displacing oil can I use WD-40, PB Blaster or Ballistol? Those are the three candidates on my shelf right now.

 

[Clemson]

Use the WD 40, but be sure to remove it and replace with Gun oil (Ballistol will work) after the water is removed. (WD stands for "Water Displacing". It is good for that, but has almost Zero other uses in gunsmithing.

 

[Jennison]

Got it. Thank you Clemson, for your patience and kind replies.