Bought my first revolver.

[Trent]

Cleaning revolvers can take a little while, especially if you lose track of which charge hole you started cleaning first. Ha.

Oh, I don't know if it was because I shot some 38's out of it, but those chambers were a real pain to get scrubbed out.

Also, when that one 38 +P Remington case split, I caught a little bit of material in the face. I felt something impact my lip and eyebrow (stung a bit), didn't think much more of it. But, I noticed last night when I went to clean my glasses that I'd got a new chip in them that wasn't there last time I cleaned them. Evidently my glasses stopped SOMETHING from hitting my eye!

Good thing my glasses are made of that resilient shatter resistant stuff.

 

[Naybor]

Glad you didn't get hurt, Trent.

I have only one good eye, so I ALWAYS wear shooting glasses. I started doing this when a black powder Kentucky Rifle had a cap sluff off some fragments and hit me about 1/2 inch from my right eye. I've wore shatter proof glasses ever since.

 

[HKGuns]

Congrats on a nice pistol, I can pretty much guarantee it won't be your last one!

(Double action is a LOT different feel than my semi-auto handguns)

Yep and even before I owned a revolver I found the incessant whining of the DA/SA DA pullers a bit hard to take. Every trigger is different and not everything will pull like a 1911. I suspect most of the whiners have shot nothing but gLoCk's but that is just me being mean spirited. It takes a bit of perspective to think about it differently I guess.....That and the realization no-one makes a perfect trigger and they're all different from model to model so you best adjust. I'm betting you shot that DA pull just fine and you adjusted to the tool.

I've never had an issue with a pistol's trigger at typical pistol shooting distances. I'm far more sensitive to a bad trigger in a rifle as I feel it has far greater impact on your ability to be accurate.

 

[rswartsell]

Having a case split ALWAYS indicates some kind of malfunction. It is never "usual" or "supposed" to happen.

I would call it HIGHLY UNUSUAL for factory new ammo, especially Remington. I would save the case and the box it came in and write to Remington. They need the lot number, without it they are helpless. I cannot imagine a defect in the Ruger that could have caused this in a single round. What does the rest of the spent brass look like? I would try to completely eliminate the possibility that 1 chamber out of 5 is defective in your Ruger.

Congrats, great choice.

 

[rswartsell]

To add;

Case splitting as you have described in my experience has always been the result of brass reloaded past it's useful life. Not the only way it can happen though.

The chances are very much in favor of defective brass used by Remington.

Other POSSIBILITIES may include, as stated before a defective chamber, or an overpressure round. All are alarming. I would spend more effort and attention in getting to the bottom of this than the thread currently suggests. I WOULD NOT brush it off.

 

[Trent]

Whoa, roger that. I have the box of ammo and the brass, will upload a picture in a minute. NO other brass looks deformed or showed any signs of overpressure.

 

[Trent]

Using ORIGINAL size images for quality (means you'll need to scroll around a bit in your browser).

 

[Trent]

I found two more split 38's when I went through the box of empties that I didn't notice at the range.

Also, a good portion of the 357 Winchester shows some odd carbon deposits; definitely not consistent; one side is "burnt". Only shows up on some shell casings (MIGHT be 1 out of 5, but I haven't counted yet).

That might lend some credence to the bad chamber theory...

 

[Trent]

One last note -

None of the 357's were split; only 3 of 50 of the 38's were.

 

[HKGuns]

Whoa that is quite a split! I'm too new to revolvers to offer advice, but I've never seen that with any of my revolvers. (Even on my reloads)

Where are you getting 50 rounds of .38 +P for $12 a box? Perhaps I reload too much and that is a "normal" price for standard Remington ammo, but it sounds pretty cheap to me at first glance.

 

[rswartsell]

I don't like the way those .357s look either. Someone with some revolver smithing experience is called for. I think the chances of a problem with your Ruger have gone up.

Where are you rcmodel?

 

[rcmodel]

The split cases on the .38's I would attribute to a bad lot of brass.

I've seen it before in different calibers.

Once fired & reloaded Federal 9mm.
Some of them split the first firing of factory ammo.



The case head leaks on the .357 look like the heads are cracked and leaking gas.
Inspect them right under the rim where the carbon deposit is and see if they are cracked or not.
(Pour some rubbing alcohol or lighter fluid in them and see if it runs out)

It could also just be normal cylinder gap flash fouling following the topstrap back over the cylinder and ending up deposited on the outsides of the rims like that.

If they are in fact cracked case heads?
Hmmmmm?

You either got real unlucky in picking out ammo?
Or have rough chambers and excess headspace and the .357's can't slip back against the recoil shield so are stretching & cracking to make up the difference.

But even then, I would expect the cases to seperate about 1/2" in to the chambers where the tapered case web ends and the thinner neck section starts.

rc

 

[Trent]

Whoa that is quite a split! I'm too new to revolvers to offer advice, but I've never seen that with any of my revolvers. (Even on my reloads)

Where are you getting 50 rounds of .38 +P for $12 a box? Perhaps I reload too much and that is a "normal" price for standard Remington ammo, but it sounds pretty cheap to me at first glance.

2006 or 2007 pricing. I've had those since I stocked my old gun shop. They are absolutely factory new, never left my possession - I picked them up myself from Zanders in downstate Illinois on an ammo run.

Remember, this was back when my wholesale pricing on 9mm was 5.87/box of 50, while 45 ACP winchester white box was $7.50/50 round box...

Everything went up and STAYED up after 2009. I used to have to sell 45 ACP at $11.00 or $11.50 a box to be competitive in gun shows, up to 2008.

 

[Trent]

The split cases on the .38's I would attribute to a bad lot of brass.

Safe to continue shooting the rest? I have 8 more boxes of the stuff.

The case head leaks on the .357 look like the heads are cracked and leaking gas.
Inspect them right under the rim where the carbon deposit is and see if they are cracked or not.
(Pour some rubbing alcohol or lighter fluid in them and see if it runs out)

It could also just be normal cylinder gap flash fouling following the topstrap back over the cylinder and ending up deposited on the outsides of the rims like that.

If they are in fact cracked case heads?
Hmmmmm?

You either got real unlucky in picking out ammo?
Or have rough chambers and excess headspace and the .357's can't slip back against the recoil shield so are stretching & cracking to make up the difference.

But even then, I would expect the cases to seperate about 1/2" in to the chambers where the tapered case web ends and the thinner neck section starts.

rc

Will check tomorrow. Will mineral spirits work? Out of rubbing alcohol and have no lighter fluid.

 

[rswartsell]

Trent,

At this stage I don't think anyone can say they are safe or not over the internet definitively. I would examine the chambers closely with good light. If they appear uniform and "regular", I would obtain fresh relatively low pressure ammo. Something like a reputable manufacture of 148gr wadcutter and test it in your gun a bit, paying close attention to the spent brass.

No guarantees mind you, just what I would do.

If the brass looks pristine with new ammo, do you feel lucky? I would then shoot a few 158 gr magnum new manufacture semi-wadcutters and look closely again. You get the idea. I wouldn't trust the situation fully until "proved", but if rc thinks it's likely the ammo that would mean something to ME.

 

[Dirt Diver]

Some questions.

...This double action pull REALLY throws me off, I'm shooting low and left by a few inches when firing on double action, even giving it my maximum attention (good group, but off center) . When I fire single action it's centered perfectly. When I try rapid fire with double action I'm all over the place (but rapid fire with other handguns I'm centered and hold good groups).

I'm assuming with sufficient practice I can learn to tame the double action....

Great buy, Trent. Yes, that transition from pistol to revolver can be a bit frustrating at first. But in the end, what you master from your revolver experience will make you a better pistol shooter.

I'll pass along some advice given to me from a wheel gun man from many years ago:
Really, really focus on that front sight as you pull the trigger. You'll see the sights waver a bit as you continue your trigger pull. Concentrate on maintaining your hold on target with that front sight. The gun's finally firing should surprise you just a bit, but because your focus has been on keeping proper sight alignment on the target, your shots will become more consistent.

Don't worry about speed, it will come in time. The technique I talked about above will help you improve and develop a smooth trigger pull.

 

[Trent]

Trent,

At this stage I don't think anyone can say they are safe or not over the internet definitively. I would examine the chambers closely with good light. If they appear uniform and "regular", I would obtain fresh relatively low pressure ammo. Something like a reputable manufacture of 148gr wadcutter and test it in your gun a bit, paying close attention to the spent brass.

No guarantees mind you, just what I would do.

If the brass looks pristine with new ammo, do you feel lucky? I would then shoot a few 158 gr magnum new manufacture semi-wadcutters and look closely again. You get the idea. I wouldn't trust the situation fully until "proved", but if rc thinks it's likely the ammo that would mean something to ME.

Yeah I realized at some point after I posted that "No one is going to answer that question given the potential consequences; it's not their hand holding the thing."

I have another 38 (a S&W snubbie) I can fire the ammo out of for comparison. I can also get the measuring tools out and check the chambers of the SP101 for concentricity and proper alignment (checking chambers is much easier to do on a revolver, than on a rifle or semi-auto..).

Another possibility that I was thinking of is if at some point a piece of foreign matter small enough and hard enough had got in to one of the chambers (grain of dirt, whatever). That would prevent the casing on that side from expanding flush with the chamber, allow gas up that side. That would deposit lead and other undesirables along the chamber wall, potentially giving future shots the opportunity to do the same. At the point the brass casing split, then additional materials would have been deposited there, further compounding the issue.

The reason I say that, is by the time I'd fired 150 rounds and broke it down for cleaning, those chambers were DIRTY. I literally had to scrub them with a brass brush and bore solvent for a good 25-30 minutes to get them clean and mirror smooth.

Wonder if the splits will happen now that the chambers are 100% fully cleaned?

 

[Trent]

Great buy, Trent. Yes, that transition from pistol to revolver can be a bit frustrating at first. But in the end, what you master from your revolver experience will make you a better pistol shooter.

I'll pass along some advice given to me from a wheel gun man from many years ago:
Really, really focus on that front sight as you pull the trigger. You'll see the sights waver a bit as you continue your trigger pull. Concentrate on maintaining your hold on target with that front sight. The gun's finally firing should surprise you just a bit, but because your focus has been on keeping proper sight alignment on the target, your shots will become more consistent.

Don't worry about speed, it will come in time. The technique I talked about above will help you improve and develop a smooth trigger pull.

Great advice, this is something I've been working on all year. The problem I'm having with the DA pull is that it's so strong, once it breaks, during the time the hammer is dropping the nose of the pistol down and left about 2" on target. My *groups* are great, just off center.

Try as I might I haven't been able to correct this. The force needed for my trigger finger, suddenly releasing, makes my finger travel back as the hammer is falling, throwing my shots off slightly. It happens so fast that there's no way I can tell my finger "stop moving damnit!"

I think the ONLY option I have is to hold at the 3 O'Clock about 2-3" when firing double action; as when I do that, my shots fall dead center.

This phenominon is something I never noticed in semi-autos, I've always been inaccurate when firing double action (say, on the Taurus PT92, or other SA/DA semiautos). I've gotten VERY little practice at double action over the years, typically only the first shot from the draw, and I never stopped to practice it regularly.

My training regimen with semi-autos will now change. Instead of focusing on split times and mag change times, I'll be focusing on getting that FIRST shot dead on center. The rest, I'm already fairly solid at (avg. .24 split time on major auto, .17 on minor).