brass/bullet help

[Axis II]

I just got my reloading bench set up and brass tumbled. I seen something about sorting brass and bullets.

how do you sort brass, based on weight, head stamp, etc?

I'm loading 55gr sp and 55gr v max for 223 bolt action. do you weigh each bullet and group them?

do you weigh a loaded round as I seen someone do on youtube? what's the reason behind that?

 

[trentcwwilson]

You're getting into a massive bag of worms. Kinda the reason I'm avoiding .223 at the moment. Separate by bullet weight, case weight, bullet centricity, case volume, headstamp. It's a long list.

 

[LiveLife]

I sort .308 cases by resized internal volume (used to sort by weight but not anymore) as military cases with thicker wall will have less internal volume than commercial cases with thinner wall.

When I sort .308 projectiles by weight, I group them by same weight and keep them in different 100 round boxes after they are loaded (I will note bullet weight along with load data on piece of paper inside the box) so rounds in the box will have the same case volume/bullet weight (yeah I know, kinda OCD ... it's my reloading mentor's fault).

For my plinking AR loads, I won't sort brass by headstamp or bullets by weight. But for your bolt rifle, you could sort brass/bullets to increase consistency of your loads.

 

[macgrumpy]

If you want max accuracy then you need to start to get in to the weeds and start sorting all of your components, but...

Is your rifle so accurate that it will make a difference?
Are you such an accurate shooter that it will make a difference?

In general, I find it best to keep the lot numbers together until the number of components in each lot gets so low that it's too much work to keep them separated. At that point I just clump them together and use them for general shooting use (as opposed to precision target use).

For my rifle that I use for sub-MOA work I actually separate the bullets by weight and ogive length. I separate the cases by volume first and then headspace dimension.

 

[trentcwwilson]

Ogive?

 

[macgrumpy]

OCD? NOT!

I record;

1. Bullet brand, weight, part #, ogive dimension, and overall length
2. Case brand, weight, part #, headspace dimension, overall length, primer pocket diameter, flash hole prep procedure, new/or how many times fired/ cleaning technique, and if I've turned the necks.
3. Primer brand and part #
4. Powder brand, part #, charge weight.

 

[macgrumpy]

Ogive

http://www.accurateshooter.com/ballistics/tangent-vs-secant-vs-hybrid-ogive-bullets/

 

[trentcwwilson]

Thank you sir.

 

[jmorris]

What is the intended use and what do you need/expect as far as accuracy?

 

[Reloadron]

I just got my reloading bench set up and brass tumbled. I seen something about sorting brass and bullets.

how do you sort brass, based on weight, head stamp, etc?

I'm loading 55gr sp and 55gr v max for 223 bolt action. do you weigh each bullet and group them?

do you weigh a loaded round as I seen someone do on youtube? what's the reason behind that?

You are starting out so I would keep it simple. I would not weigh bullets. If you buy a box of any reasonable quality 55 grain bullets they will all be close enough to 55 grains that unless you have a really hot target rifle it won't matter. I would not start weighing and sorting bullets just yet in the learning curve.

You don't mention what brass you have? New factory? Once fired? Twice fired? I would tumble my brass and get it clean. That done I would maybe sort by the head stamps. Just put all like brass together. The problem is nobody here knows what you have or how much of it you have. Even sorting by head stamp can be a pain because if you have military brass you could, for example, have Lake City (LC) by year as in LC 93, LC 05 and you get the idea, you could have 6 of this and 5 of that and... The bottom line is you want your brass as uniform as possible and trimmed uniform.

In the beginning I suggest keeping this as simple as possible. You don't need a dozen U tube videos that have you weighing bullets, brass and trickling powder.

Just My Take....
Ron

 

[trentcwwilson]

This makes me reconsider. Usually new guys are told all or none.

 

[macgrumpy]

I agree, keep it simple, learn how to use your tools and equipment, after that, if you think it's necessary then get in to the details.

 

[Reloadron]

This makes me reconsider. Usually new guys are told all or none.

My thinking and just my thinking is I really don't want to take the new hand loader or reloader into a swamp where he or she finds themselves ass deep in alligators as we try to recall our primary mission was to drain the swamp. Initially I like to focus on simple. There is room for all the add on stuff later, but the new enthusiast needs to only get the basics down to make good ammunition. That being my thinking anyway.

Ron

 

[LiveLife]

+1.

This is "handloading" in addition to "Reloading" category.

While many new may work on consistency of their reloads to produce better than factory ammunition, those more experienced and looking for utmost accuracy will focus on "handloading" aspects that could be mind blowing for new reloaders (it sure was for me, especially having a reloading/shooting mentor who was a bullseye match shooter) and handloading practices of long-range precision bench rest shooters are even beyond them (punching holes at 1000 yards takes a lot of work).

What I do, I do for "minute of gong" at 300-400 yards (occasionally to 600) for .308 and 1-2 MOA at 100 yards for .223.

Yup, I consider myself newbie to rifle reloading and I have been reloading over 20+ years.

 

[Walkalong]

how do you sort brass, based on weight, head stamp, etc?

Headstamp for everything but my Benchrest gun where I sorted same headstamp brass by weight as well. Just get some decent brass all the same headstamp to start.

I'm loading 55gr sp and 55gr v max for 223 bolt action. do you weigh each bullet and group them?

Heck no.

do you weigh a loaded round as I seen someone do on youtube? what's the reason behind that?

No reason to do this.

That said, without knowing what kind of gun you have and what kind of accuracy you expect, it's hard to give advice.

 

[gojuice101]

For general shooting ammo, I don't sort anything. Different headstamps, lots, etc....doesn't matter for my regular plinking ammo. When loading near max, it is probably a good idea given different internal volumes of cases and all that, but I don't load near max. On the other hand, when loading super accurate rounds for my brother's 243, I sort everything. This is mainly to make sure that the cases are all the same and the bullets all have the same weight, length, etc.

When starting out, I wouldn't worry about any of it. Too much to process when just starting to reload. The simpler the better until you have it down good.

 

[Mostly Lead]

Wanted to concur with not sorting anything until you can prove the differences. I've seen pistol shooters worry over the tiniest details - and then proceed to shoot six inch groups at 15 feet...

However, it does build confidence and pride to put some level of care into reloading. My 45 Colt only gets Starline brass, my 38 Specials are all sorted by headstamp and my 45 ACP just gets whatever little "brass buckets" I can find off the ground. The 45 ACP is what I usually shoot my best groups with though.

I don't shoot rifle, but the guys certainly have a reputation for detail and many can back it up with cloverleaf/one hole targets. It's all part of the fun!

Crazy hobby we share.

 

[Axis II]

I apologize guys for not giving all the info.

The gun-- savage axis 223 heavy barrel 1-9 twist if I remember right. right now with factory hornady v max which is the only thing I can get that gun to shoot great with it will clover leaf at 100yards if not better on front bipod and rear bag. I would like to copy that in my reloads. the gun is for target shooting to 200yards and varmint hunting coyotes and woodchucks to 200yards.

Powder--H335, CCI 400 primers.

Brass--New Remington brass, once fired Hornady, Winchester and some other mixed head stamps. I have probably 200-300 cases.

I'm using a RCBS FL size die, Lyman quick trim in the drill, debur and chamfer the case mouth with lyman tool. after all that I drop it in a lyman case checker.

 

[BigBore45]

I wouldn't sort anything to achieve what you are wanting.

just do a ladder test, find the most accurate charge of powder and don't mix match the bullets.

I load up mixed brass for my DPMS LR 308B and using 155 gr. SPMK bullet and shoot 3/8" to 1/2" groups at 100 yards.

I have sorted lots of thing for accuracy ( bullet by weight, case by h2o capacity, powder lot, ect.) don't really notice anything till you get out to 300-500 yards. YMMV of course

 

[jmorris]

I apologize guys for not giving all the info.

The gun-- savage axis 223... the gun is for target shooting...

I would get a neck size die (might save a little work down the road and cases will last a tad longer) and some SMK's and get a few different powders (varget being one of them). Sort brass by head stamp and weight if I felt like it once and keep them that way. Not like they are going to be thrown around a shooting bay and mixed with others like ammo for a 3-gun AR would be.

 

[Axis II]

I would get a neck size die (might save a little work down the road and cases will last a tad longer) and some SMK's and get a few different powders (varget being one of them). Sort brass by head stamp and weight if I felt like it once and keep them that way. Not like they are going to be thrown around a shooting bay and mixed with others like ammo for a 3-gun AR would be.

what's SMK? im almost out of my 1lbs of h335 so once that's gone ill try others. I loaded a couple hundred rounds over the summer for the kids to plink with. id say my jugs about half full. the bullets are used in 2 different axis 223. one heavy barrel and one regular barrel so I was told FL size them.

 

[Bart B.]

In perspective,

Sierra Bullets testing their stuff in their 100-yard range at their California plant got sub 2/10ths inch groups with their best unsorted 22 and 30 caliber Sierra Match King (SMK) bullets from unprepped and unsorted full length sized cases metering powder to a 3/10ths grain spread with 10-shot groups. Time after time after time.

 

[WelshShooter]

I wouldn't bother if I were you. I use only Lapua brass and after spot checking case length and weight they are in an acceptable enough range for me to not bother grouping based on weight. I keep my brass segragated by number of firings because I don't have to worry about inconsistent case lengths from round to round. My groupings are typically <0.5 MOA for .308, .223 and 6,5x47. I don't bother with sorting of Sierra/Lapua bullets either. For my application this accuracy is fine for me. If I were competing in F-class then I would spend the extra money on Berger bullets rather than sort through the bullets I had.

 

[BigBore45]

SMK= Sierra Match King ( its a type of bullet ). if loading for different rifles you do need to FL size 90% of the time. So you should continue to do so.

If you want accuracy as you described all you must do if pick a few powders and do some ladder testing to find a load that suites your needs.

You should have no problem finding one within your requirements without sorting brass or any of the other "accurizing" load steps you read about.

most of the brass sorting weighing bullets and brass stuff is reserved for longe range shooting and will not be worth while or even noticed most of the time at 200 yards.

I would take your 55 grain vmax bullet and load mixed brass at a COAL of 2.200 with minimum starting load per hornandy and load at least 12. shoot 4- 3 shot groups. get an average group size then work up in .2 grain increments, repeating the group process until you have a max load or stop when you find your groups are what you want at a velocity you would want for hunting. I would guess that the load will become more accurate at mid to upper range of the load data. so if you are shooting at mid range already with H335 you could start the ladder testing there.

If that does not get you an accurate enough load switch powder and start the same process with that powders starting load. never go over max load

I do not own savage guns but I have heard they are pretty accurate out of the box and a heavy barrel one should be. Shouldn't take much time to get it where you want it. How do the plinkers you loaded shoot? have you even grouped them? they might do what you need?

 

[Reloadron]

SMK is Sierra Match King a family of target bullets. Good stuff!

If you load for a semi auto or if you load ammunition to be used in any of several rifles for now I would just full length re size my brass. Even neck sizing will eventually need a full length re size anyway. You could re size to a few thousandths shorter than your shortest need but I would not worry about that. For your needs right now I would just full length re size.

Ron