Brazil's personal disarmament law

[tiberius]

Another banana republic strips its citizens of their RKBA. I can only assume that genocide of some sort is next.

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/World/ap20031222_1354.html

BRASILIA, Brazil Dec. 22 — President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva signed a sweeping gun-control law Monday in an effort to rein in what he called "an epidemic of murder by firearms."
Under the so-called disarmament statute passed Dec. 9 by Congress, only the armed forces, police, prison guards and private security personnel can possess firearms in Brazil.

The law was "a landmark for Brazilian democracy," Silva said. "An important aim of the law is to choke off one of the sources of organized crime by denying them access to firearms."

According to World Health Organization data, a Brazilian is murdered every 12 minutes, with more than 90 percent of murders committed with firearms, the president said.

"This is a disgraceful record for us," Silva said.

Exceptions to the no-guns rule can be made as long as an individual is at least 25 years old and can prove he needs a weapon "because his physical integrity is in danger," according to the new law. Gun owners have 180 days to petition police for such status.

The new law provides for prison sentences of up to four years for illegal possession of a firearm.

The law also provides for a national plebiscite, set for October, 2005, in which voters may choose to eliminate all exceptions.

 

[armoredman]

Can they vote to eliminate the whole law?

 

[longeyes]

Whatever Lula wants, Lula gets.

This was inevitable. Lula's a hard-core leftist. All of us on this board know what this presages for Brazil and who the cultural antecedents for this kind of action are. The good guys are disarmed; the bad guys ignore it.

All the more reason for us to fight harder for our RKBA.

 

[longeyes]

Lula has a lot of plans for eliminating "disequity." We've heard that before, with the usual baleful results.

 

[PeteyPete]

Taurus can't be too happy.

 

[dance varmint]

Exceptions to the no-guns rule can be made as long as an individual is at least 25 years old and can prove he needs a weapon "because his physical integrity is in danger," according to the new law.

One's physical presence in Brazil clearly qualifies someone for an exception, but what does my opinion matter to the ruling elite of that country. What the ban did for the UK and Australia, it will do for Brazil in spades.

 

[BlackManWithAGun]

road trip

Think I am going to try to see what is happening with this from the ground level in Brasil. Does anyone know of any organized gun clubs there? Would love to hear their perspective, crime in the "ruas" is off the hook.

Anyone want to go with me on a road trip there around February for information purposes?

Kenn

 

[Standing Wolf]

Brazil is about to discover the obvious: when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. Its violent crime rates are going to soar.

 

[Blackcloud6]

The law was "a landmark for Brazilian democracy," Silva said. "An important aim of the law is to choke off one of the sources of organized crime by denying them access to firearms."

Doublespeak par excellance!

Doubleplusungood.

Off to Room 101 wit hme....

 

[spacemanspiff]

that cant be right. the USA is supposed to have the highest ratio of gun-deaths. WHO's estimates would put Brazil at 39,420 homicides per year. not overall gun-deaths, just homicides.
5 murders per hour = 120 murders a day x 365 = 43,800 x .90 = 39,420.

 

[longeyes]

Like the idea of a Cuba with 180 million people? Well, you got it.

 

[WonderNine]

Won't be long before the U.S. and Middle Eastern/African countries are the only places in the world where people can own guns.

Come on ya'll....embrace the new world order....

 

[HBK]

I wonder how long it will take them to realize this is a mistake? Silva IS a hardcore leftist. I was disappointed he was elected, but I don't live in Brazil so that 's as far as it went. I wonder if the people there will take action when this law flops?

 

[Ol' Badger]

Yea. Like the band matters to the large gands of homeless street retchs with shivs running amuk!

 

[Wildalaska]

Who cares..their country their rules.....

WildhohohoAlaska

 

[HBK]

good point...

 

[enfield]

Who cares..their country their rules.....

I care, dammit!!

This is the same kind of attitude that allowed the Holocaust to happen! Disarmament of the citizens doesn't mean that genocide is going to occur, but it IS a prerequisite.

 

[ny32182]

I doubt that genocide in Brazil is a likely outcome.

It just gives the leftists here one more country to point at... "see? even BRAZIL is disarming its citizens. The US is the last 'civilized' country in the world to allow its citizens to OWN FIREARMS. How can a civilized society permit such violence..."

etc.

 

[enfield]

I doubt that genocide in Brazil is a likely outcome.

It's now a POSSIBLE outcome.

Nothing good will come of this.

 

[longeyes]

Genocide maybe; tyranny certainly. Lula thinks people with guns are bad for tourism. A disarmed society is a predictable and controllable society.

 

[LiquidTension]

Current statistics: 1 murder every 12 minutes, 90% with firearms
Future statistics: 1 murder every 9 minutes, 80% with firearms

"We've experienced a significant drop in the percentage of homicides committed with firearms!"

 

[MeekandMild]

Been to Brasil recently?

They crowd their poor in huge slums without any hope of advancement except by prostitution, drug running and violence. In Sao Paulo I have seen huge 30 story high rise buildings devoted entirely to prostitution and in Rio I have seen entire mountains covered with slum tenements without basic running water and electricity service. They are crowded in like rats.

 

[longeyes]

"They crowd their poor in huge slums without any hope of advancement except by prostitution, drug running and violence. In Sao Paulo I have seen huge 30 story high rise buildings devoted entirely to prostitution and in Rio I have seen entire mountains covered with slum tenements without basic running water and electricity service. They are crowded in like rats."

Bad situation. But the question arises: Is the kind of leftwing government espoused by Lula the answer? I think not.

 

[Pawcatch]

I bet that the vast majority of people in Brazil either support this law or just don't care.It's not like Brazil was a gun friendly country before this.
Very few people had firearms licenses to begin with and they severly limited in thier choice of guns.

It's now a possible outcome.

Enfield,genocide was possible in Brazil before this.Very few people owned guns legally and they were only allowed semi-auto pistols up to .380 and revolvers up to .38 special.All the legal firearms were already licensed and registered,so the government already knew who owned the legal firearms.

BTW,I doubt that the farmers in the rural areas with unregistered rifles and shotguns could care one bit about this new law.They will continue to own guns illegally just like they've done for decades.

It also should be noted that Bolivia has refused to institute a national registery for firearms and the only thing Paraquay has done is make it harder for tourist to buy guns.Both of these countries have resisted attemps by the U.N. to disarm thier populace.

 

[Roadkill Coyote]

In the country,

BTW,I doubt that the farmers in the rural areas with unregistered rifles and shotguns could care one bit about this new law.They will continue to own guns illegally just like they've done for decades.

Perhaps they should. The problem for farmers will come from the "landless workers movement" or MST. If, as seems likely, the government's land reform policy doesn't give them what they want, the MST will be using the gun ban against its potential targets. Look at Zimbabwe for a gilmpse into Brazil's future.

However, the MST has recently been invading farms and imposing blockades to try to force the government to adhere to its election promises of land reform...He said the MST march was not intended as a protest against Lula's government, and added that he hoped the movement could help the government implement its plan.

Brazil landless arrive in capital - Wednesday, 19 November, 2003

Mr Stedile questioned whether the president's commitment to eliminate the big estates and fight for land reform would be effective and insisted that Lula's government was a "transitional government, in permanent dispute".

Property rights to help Brazil's poor - Tuesday, 23 December, 2003

as well as the city,

As for the cities, the principal danger of this law is that it will not work. Brazil does not appear to have time for an infinite parade of failed leftist solutions. According to the BBC, whose numbers are a bit more conservative that some, There are 500 shantytowns in Rio. Some of them are beyond the control of the police.

There are still favelas which are no-go areas and the Correspondent team witnessed a violent shootout between police and traffickers in one of them, where the idea of introducing community policing would be a suicidal waste of time.

On the Rio beat - Friday, 11 May, 2001

Three gunmen stopped the vehicle, believing the occupants were from a rival gang and took them into the slum, where six were shot dead. There is still no word of the missing 12.

Rio party trip ends in bloodbath - Sunday, 2 November, 2003 - (Check it out, a Johnny Bravo cameo and Community Policing with an FAL)

The report details how the gangs employ teenagers to guard their domains. Sometimes they are even given ranks and called soldiers...There are estimated to be between 5-6,000 armed children in Rio.

Rio 'worse than a war zone' - Monday, 9 September, 2002

What the "for the children" crusaders are ignoring about (or at least overlooking the significance of) the 5-6000 number is that it implies that there are a lot more armed "soldiers" in these out of control shantytowns.

its a bad idea.

• widespread poverty
• a flat out communist movement in the countryside
• armed criminal militias maintaining "no-go" areas in the capital
• a government instituting solutions that won't work

I hope that we hear from someone down that way, who can tell us that the prospects are not so bleak as they appear. Because all the information available suggests that Brazil is on course for a national bloodbath.
The interesting thing will be whether this disaster gets used as a laboratory for "smart gun" technology...