BSA 36X "dot reticle" inquiry

[Remander]

Midway has a BSA Platinum Target Scope 36x 44mm with a dot reticle on sale for $59.99. http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...lastID=9720061

The next cheapest at 36X looks to be in the $400 plus range, but I sure do like the looks of the fine crosshair on scopes like this Weaver that goes for $429.99. http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...eitemid=620856

I'd appreciate hearing any experience you may have shooting a dot reticle on a hi-power scope on a .22 at 50 yds.

It's hard to pass up that price, but I don't want to get something I won't be happy with for my intended purpose.

Thanks

 

[Justin]

I run a Nikon 6.5-20x on my Team Challenge rifle. It's good for out to 90 yards.

With optics, you really get what you pay for.

 

[Majic]

36X for $60 means keep your hands in your pocket and pass on by. Also you don't need that much power for such a short range. Parallux (sp?) may be a small problem. Spend as much as you can afford because it's true that you get what you pay for when dealing with optics. A good quality 6x scope should do everything you want. A varible that goes up to 12x would be a decent second choice. Before going to the higher power scopes you really need to learn about scopes and what kind of shooting you will be doing because you then will be looking into investing some serious money.

 

[Remander]

I already have a number of variable-power scopes at ranges between 3 and 20X, and I have shot plenty of bricks of ammo in 3 .22 rifles at 50 yds doing informal benchrest.

I am just thinking of getting a 36X, which I have never had, to play around with and compete with myself.

My question is aimed more at the BSA dot reticle and how decent or poor it is for that purpose.

 

[MacPelto]

Without going in to the quality of BSA optics, I would want to know how much of the field of view is subtended by the reticle. Benchrest targets are pretty small, and if the dot covers the entire target, it would seem pretty useless.


Upon looking at the ad, I see that it subtends 1/8 MOA, which doesn't seem prohibitive, but in the illustration (which is just an illustration, I know) the dot is not centered where the crosshairs are. This would be a serious problem in any scope, since your eye will be fighting between recognizing the center of the dot as your aiming point, or the place where the crosshairs should cross.

Just things to think about...

Mac

 

[taliv]

I run a Nikon 6.5-20x on my Team Challenge rifle. It's good for out to 90 yards.

was taht a typo? sarcasm? i thought nikon had pretty respectable optics

 

[spooney]

Taliv I think 90 yards is a long ways on .22lr benchrest.

 

[taliv]

ah, you're right. i missed the 22 @ 50 yrds in the first post

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

36x? Wow, that's a spotting scope with a reticle! lol


Seriously though, I can't imagine how bad the view would be out of a $60 36x. Even high end, high quality scopes on 36x get dark and shakey.

 

[MacPelto]

Even high end, high quality scopes on 36x get dark and shakey

Plus, high magnification like that seems to exaggerate mirage. At a recent high power match, one of the competitors was using a 40x spotting scope, but couldne't see his holes because of the mirage. I could see mine with a 25x, however.

Mac

 

[hksw]

IMO, BSA still has a ways to go to achieve even slightly above average optics. Magnification is not everything. There is a reason the other benchrest scopes are over $400. It should work for you and should hold up for a while as there s much less (moving) parts inside than a variable. At 50yds, you should have any problems "focusing" on the target. Eventually, though, you'll bump into someone with a more serious benchrest scope and regret the purchase. (My biggest criticism of the Chinese scopes is their lack of resolution - image sharpness) It is, though, only $60.

I regularly shoot off the bench with rimfires (.22lr and .17HMR) at 50 yds. I find that 20-25X is more than enough.

 

[GooseGestapo]

At only $60.00, you really ought to try it. I've considered one.

I have a BSA "Contender" 4-16x w/mildot.

I've had it on a Ruger m77/22 Hornet, a Heavy BBl Flat-top AR15,, and now its on a Stevens m200 in .243 where it will stay.


I must have gotten "lucky" as its a decent scope. A tad dark on cloudy days at 16x, but has consistent adjustments and minimal hysterisis. (Parallelax is adjustable 10yds to Infinity), and it's a tad heavy, but just right on the little .243.

At 50yds, the 1/8 dot will be almost invisible unless you are using a white center bullseye target.

The 1/8min dot is intended for the 100 and 200yd BR targets where the "dot" appears to "float" within the center circle of the BR targets. For wind doping, you can see the "waves" of mirage, and "shade" the dot onto that side or "corner" of the target for wind compensation.

For general target use, or plinking you'll be dissappointed. It may be useful for a long range prararie dog rifle scope.

I'm familiar with this magnification and reticle and it's use as a friend had a Weaver 36x w/ 1/8min dot on a Sako 75 "Varmint" in .22PPC.
It would regularily shoot 0.2's and occasionaly 0.1's on a good-calm day.
I really "understood" the BR target and the Scope/reticle once I had a chance to "shoot" one.

 

[Remander]

Thanks for all the info, guys.

I don't really need a 36X for competition. I just kind of want one to play around see what scores I can shoot against myself with one on my stock Cooper and stock CZ 452 with the 36X.

Still not sure if I want to buy the BSA. That dot in the middle makes me balk a bit for 50 yard shooting on tiny bullseyes that are 25 to a page.

Thanks again for the info. It is helpful, as is most advice on this great board.

 

[hksw]

IMO, I don't think a dot is too bad for rimfire BR. The current targets are usually concentric rings and the dot naturally just fits in. I've had not problem at all using a dot on the USBR targets I use (25/score, 3/spotter). The scope with the dot is an older Leupold M8 2.5-8X32 (now known as a VX-III) on top of a Browning Buckmark Unlimited. At 8X, the dot covers most of the 8 ring (~17/32" dia). At 36X, the dot should be well inside the 9 ring (~5/16") if not inside the 10 ring/X (~3/32") and getting it to fall in concentric with the rings it covers should be easy.

(I do, though, generally use duplex or MilDot reticles on my rifles, simply because I like the looks of these better than dots and, when shooting groups, the crosshairs cover the center of the target less than a dot. I also like to have my crosshairs zeroed on the target instead of 1¼" below my groups as the regular convention for centerfire BR targets.)

 

[iamkris]

I have no comment on BSA and the dot recticle...however, if you've never shot with a 36X I'd HIGHLY recommend staying away. I have a 6.5-24 and it is nearly unusable at 24X. I never take it above 16X. I'm going to trade it in on a lower power scope.

 

[Jackal]

My BSA Classic rattled itself apart after about 200rds from my 10/22. I kept trying to figure out why the reticle was turning. Turns out, it was no longer attached to anything inside. I'll never own another BSA.

 

[270Win]

It takes a lot of practice and getting used to, shooting very high magnification. I have a Tasco 10-40X on my Rem 700 VLS in .223. The optic quality is surprisingly good, but as others have stated, darkens noticeably (but not tremendously) above 25X or so. Still, for punching paper in broad daylight - or even reasonably cloudy days - there are no problems with brightness at all.

But at 40X, your EVERY body movement, even the very smallest, are magnified incredibly. It really becomes a study in self-control - which I like. I mean, if you clench your toes, the scope shifts. Nevertheless, it's quite useful. I imagine 36X is the same way.

I also am tempted for just $60... but I hesitate only because BSA has such a damned bad reputation. I don't know if their Platinum line is made somewhere else, or by better technicians, or made for them by others, or what ... but I want to know before I buy. Also, what kind of warranty do they offer?

 

[Blackfork]

BSA Platinum

I took a stock 10/22, swapped out for Volquartzen trigger components, added a Titan stainless target barrel, Houge overmolded stock and a BSA 8-32 Platinum scope that Midway had on sale for 89 bucks. I have no complaints. It's sharp. You can watch your bullet going downrange and see your bullet holes at 100 yards while shooting.

Now...scoping the Army's M14s from the Anniston Depot for units going to Iraq..was different. Most units used their credit cards to let the individual squads buy the accessories. Some of the troopers showed up with BSA scopes.

M14s were NOT intended to be scoped. By the time you scope them the optics sit way up high which I believe adds stress and vibration.....a LOT. They would frequently destroy scope innards on a cheap scope by the time we had shot through a 20 round box of 118LR. Even some GOOD scopes died, most notably some Springfield Armorys and Shepherds. (No Leupolds died, and no Nikons.) But that's an acid test. We probably scoped 200 rifles, using all kinds of mount/scope combinations, since the units had to find and buy their own.

This was in Squad Designated Rifleman schools at Ft Hood and Camp Bullis in Texas.

But I am very happy with my 10/22 BSA Platinum combo. It's got normal crosshairs, not the dot. I use it for my kid and newbie gun, so they can shoot and see their own bullet holes at 100 yards. The Ruger is NEARLY good enough to shoot smallbore metallic silhouette....but I have an Anshutz MS64, so I use that. Fun gun. With Wolfe Match Target it shoots about 2 MOA at 100 yards. The Anshutz with a Weaver on it shoots 1/2 MOA with the same ammo.

OK, now you know everything I know.

 

[Blackfork]

36X FIXED

That's a lot of power all the time. (I think it might be more fun to have a little zoom in there, but you are going to double your money.) How wrong can you go for 60 bucks plus shipping? That's lunch money! I'd buy it.

BSA Platinums consistently get higher customer satisfaction than their regular scopes.

But not for anything but .22, IMHO.

Highpower Long Range shooters usual rule of thumb is that you spend a dollar a yard for the distance you are going to shoot.

Shooting 1000 yards? You are going to need a 1000.00 scope. My LR scope is a Leupold 16X fixed. Ebay.

 

[cmb3366]

Well, I actually own a pair of BSA Platinum 36X scopes. One is a dot (1/8th moa) reticle, the other is a fine-crosshair. Believe it or not, both are pretty good scopes for the money. Optics are decent, adjustments are accurate, and both hold zero. Currently the dot reticle scope sits on my T/C Benchmark .22 (I use it at 25 and 50 yds) And the fine-crosshair sits on my 6PPC Benchgun. Good scopes for the money.



ETA: even with cheapo glass the 6 has been banned from the local turkey shoot

 

[Gewehr98]

I took the plunge and bought a BSA Contender scope a while back.

This one's the 6-24x, mounted on my FrankenRuger. I own Leupold, Burris, Bausch & Lomb, Weaver, Redfield, and Sightron scopes, so I've seen what clarity of optics and repeatable zero look like in a higher-dollar riflescope. I expected the BSA to be cheesy, like one of those 3/4" Tasco things we used to mount on our BB guns as kids.

Oddly enough, the darned thing works, and works well. I always try the 8 clicks up, 8 clicks right, 8 clicks down, and 8 clicks left trick on every scope I buy. The BSA moved the groups exactly where the turrets said they should go, the last movement putting the group right over the first group. Clarity of optics is a subjective thing, with the biggest howling of cheap scope inferior image quality usually coming from those who spent the most on different optics. They have to justify that Swarovski somehow, and don't want the wife to know they could've gotten good usable optics for less money.

My Sightron beats my Leupolds in brightness and clarity out to the periphery, so that stereotype was broken in my world fairly soon, no longer am I an optics snob. Suffice it to say that the BSA Contender on my FrankenRuger is pretty darned clear, just a smidgen of coloration out towards the edges. Since I concentrate most of my time shooting looking at the crosshairs and not doodling out there at the edges pontificating my next gunrag article, the scope serves the purpose quite well.

36x is a lot of magnification for a scope, btw. You're going to see your breathing, heartbeat, digestion, outgassing, mirage, Coriolis Effect, precession, tectonic plate movement, and lunar land tides when cranked up to 36x all day. A variable power scope that can dial back down to 10x is a wonderful thing when the above factors make you lose your lock on the target of interest.



On a side note, I've since gotten rid of a lot of the high-magnification/big objective lens scopes in my gun collection. Besides the BSA Contender, the most magnification any of my rifles has now is 16x, and the majority of scoped guns seldom exceed 12x. I've also rediscovered the joy that is the older Weaver steel-tubed family, with the K4 being an absolute favorite. Likewise, I go nuts for stuff like the Lyman Alaskan and All-American scopes, and the Denver Redfield models. I retrofit a bunch of the older scopes to my hunting rifles, and found out that Australians really like to buy used Simmons Pro-Hunter and Whitetail Classic scopes on e-Bay! (Evidently, they're in short supply Down Under)

 

[Gewehr98]

Blackfork, I hear you loud and clear on scoping the M14 rifle.

I actually broke a Leupold Vari-X III 3.5-10x Law Enforcement model after mounting it on my M14NM. (low mount, ARMS #18, which sits even lower than the Brookfield Precision mount) 80 rounds later, it was kaput. It turned out the counter-recoil of the oprod was the culprit, and the late, great Gale McMillan cautioned me about it to no avail. Leupold was great, they fixed it quickly and at no cost to me, but that scope now resides on an AR-15. The M14NM now wears a Weaver V16, and hasn't had a lick of trouble ever since.

 

[Rimmer]

I picked up one (36X) and put it on a 17HMR last year. I can't comment how it would do out in the field as this is strictly a bench gun.

The dot works great and that's what I have on all my scopes except for the high-power rifles.

For the price it's worth a try, however, eventually you'll end up spending money on a Weaver, Burris or Leupold. Huge difference all the way around.