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Can you legally register a WWII weapon

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DblGonzo

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Not sure how to ask this, But here goes. I have a friend (wish it were me) that his uncle has a German weapon that he brought back from WWII. He told me that the weapon will be pass to him upon his uncle's death. He is trying to find out if he can legally transfer it. Not sure if it is registered now or not. It is a handgun a Broomhandle model 712.
 
The machinegun registry is closed. If it wasn't previously registered, it is now too late. At this point, their concern is turning it in without facing any charges.
I'd give serious thought to just destroying it. I wouldn't be happy about it, but it isn't worth the risk of going to prison and losing all your firearms rights just to hang on to a gun that you can't fire without attracting attention.
WWII bringbacks have sentimental value, but the reality is that GI's traded them vigorously among themselves and just plain bought and sold them. Most of the "Grampy took this off a Kraut officer he kilt" stories are just hooey.
 
You can't legally register a full auto weapon if it wasn't already registered prior to 1968. If it isn't registered prior to 1968 there's 3 choices. 1. Drop it in the nearest lake. 2. Turn it in to the BATF for destruction, or 3. Keep your mouth shut and risk going to prison if you ever get caught with it. You can't even de-activate the auto mechanism because "once a machine gun, always a machine gun".

If it is registered, it's relatively easy to transfer the firearm to a new owner.

If it isn't registered, I'd disassemble it and drop the parts in the proverbial lake.
 
If it isn't registered, I'd disassemble it and drop the parts in the proverbial lake.
Click to expand...

More accurately, detail strip it and cut the receiver/frame in half with a torch or hacksaw. The receiver is the only part that is considered a machine gun; the rest of the parts may be very valuable to someone who has a 712 with papers.
 
Does your friend have a brother-in-law he doesn't like?

Mayby he could talk the Uncle into leaving it to him instead?

Mayby tell Uncle about the issues and have him dispose of it in that lake prior to debarking.
 
If this really is a 712, then it is a machine gun according to the definitions of Title II of the National Firearms Act of 1934.

If that weapon was registered as a legal machine gun when imported, or during the very brief machine gun amnesty period in 1968, then it can be transferred to a new owner on a "Form 4" or to an heir on a "Form 5."

If it was not registered, then it CANNOT be registered. It is illegal contraband and its possession can mean 10 years in jail and a $250,000 fine. (As well as the loss of all firearms rights, forever, if you do manage to put your life back together after 10 years in the "pokey" and the loss of a quarter of a million dollars.)

Probably the safest route is to have an attorney contact the ATF and investigate how the weapon may be surrendered without incurring the legal penalties. Or, wait until the uncle's passing and have the estate's executor clear the matter up (surrender the weapon). Whatever your friend does, he should not ever take possession of it. That would be a "no-fooling, life changed forever" kind of mistake.
 
FYI, it just MAY be possible to paper that gun........assuming that there's "bringback" papers it could be entered in the NFA transfer register.

Most strongly suggest OP check with AR15.Com, NFA section for mod. Tony. I have read extensive conversation on that site relative to this very issue and he's weighed in with some knowledgable and expert experience and opinion.

Mighta missed it, but DID the OP state that the firearm is a 712??? Yeah, just noted it.
 
Tell your friend to make sure to get the proper licenses. Owning a full auto firearm is highly illegal without the proper permits.
Click to expand...

This (from a deleted post) is incorrect. A private citizen can own any full-auto weapon that was in the registry before it closed in May of 1986. There's a $200 tax, paperwork, and a background check run for each weapon, but no license that gives you permission to own unregistered guns.

The "licenses" that do apply to Title II weapons are the Class 02 Special Occupational Taxpayer FFL for manufacturers of these, or the Class 03 SOT FFL for dealers of these. Those are both strictly for folks in the business of making or selling -- not for collectors.
 
FYI, it just MAY be possible to paper that gun........assuming that there's "bringback" papers it could be entered in the NFA transfer register.
Click to expand...
The registry has been closed since May of 1986. Do you have evidence that it has been opened to allow unregistered weapons in since then?
 
The Hughes Amendment to the "Firearms Owners' Protection Act" (the McClure-Volkmer Act) of 1986 closed the registry.

The GCA of 1968 ended importation of machine guns for civilian sales, but for the next 18 years, you could still purchase a new US-made new machine gun.

The 1986 FOPA did a whole lot of good things, and fixed a lot of the messes that the GCA'68 had created. But it had one pretty dark flaw.
 
It's too bad that the internet as we know it didn't exist in 1986; then they wouldn't have slid that one by on us, I think. Or maybe they would have. Gun owners generally weren't as militant and vigilant then as they are now. I was a kitchen table FFL at the time and used to get tons of advertising circulars in the mail along with subscribing to SGN. The prices for full-auto stuff in those days weren't astronomically higher than the prices for conventional stuff. IIRC, an M-16 would have ended up costing 2x or so what an AR-15 ran. They didn't seem to be flying off the shelves. The '92 AWB was what really galvanized everyone and the web let them connect with each other.
 
SAM.............correct, the registry IS closed for new FA registrations..........my suggestion relative to the fellows on 15.com tho dealt with the issue of PAPERED bringbacks............There was an extensive thread on the NFA site just a couple of weeks past on this issue.........I also was not aware of the fact that BATFE will enter authorized bring backs from WW11.......several members of that forum cite various precedent and name attorneys who've accomplished just that for clients..............Doggone SURE worth checking out.

Less those bring back papers tho, my guess is that the piece is contraband and no worth the risk of keeping....

According to my recollection on the papered bring backs, mod Tony_K, cited several cases wherein the precise circumstances listed by the OP resulted in a positive result.
 
now assuming the gun is illegal, theres no paperwork, and theres no possible way of making it legal......

would it be possible to make it legal by destroying only the firing pin ......or filling the receiver and or barrel with epoxy so it cannot fire......but keep the "form" of the gun rather than chopping up the receiver...

because the guys uncle brought it back from WW2......i really cant imagine him being too happy about destroying something that important.
 
would it be possible to make it legal by destroying only the firing pin ......or filling the receiver and or barrel with epoxy so it cannot fire
Click to expand...
No. Nothing that simple would pass the test, as it could easily be restored to firing condition.

You might be able to plug the barrel with a steel rod, welded in place so it could not possibly be removed.

There are ATF regulations covering what is considered a DEWAT (Deactivated War Trophy) or DE-MIL (De-militarized, or cut in half with a cutting torch in several key places) machinegun.
See this:

http://www.mil-veh.org/archives/03-01/1122.html

rc
 
Thanks for all the great info. I talked to him, and his uncle is looking for all of the paper work. His uncle told him he would have to pay the $200 transfer fee. So if he knew that then I am assuming the gun is registered, and he should be able to transfer it without any problems.
 
Well I am glad to hear that. It's a shame to think about having to destroy a bringback heirloom like that.

There have been a couple of amnesty's proposed over the years but they never seem to get any traction. That's too bad as well.

We'll call this one dealt with.
 
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