Cap and ball concealed carry at 18 in Cali?

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Guess I just have bad luck with 'em. My 1851 Navy gives me fits. I have a new Walker that I loaded only one chamber on Saturday, just a test shot, and damned if that cap didn't lock that pig up too. Had to dig it out with my pocketknife.
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Sounds to me that you might try a different size/brand of caps......:confused:
 
AFAIK, a C&B handgun is considered the same as any other handgun for carry purposes in every state, and is certainly a "weapon" under ADW, armed robbery laws, and laws mandating extended sentences for use of a firearm in commission of a crime. And most state laws don't even address whether the firearm is loaded or not.

So if you think it is legal to tuck that Colt Navy repro in your belt and swagger around town, you may have some time to rethink the idea.

Jim
 
Quiet said:
What Zoogster said.

Also...

An issuing agency in CA needs to approve the "handgun" you intend to carry on your CA LTC permit.
Authorized handguns are listed on your CA LTC permit and the listed handguns are the only handguns you can legally carry concealed.

It is highly unlikely that an issuing agency will aprove a blackpowder firearm.
I know of a few issuing agencies that will deny it and may reconsider issuing you a CA LTC permit, because they will feel that you are not taking the concept of carrying for self-defense seriously.

In CA...
Blackpowder firearms are only exempt from firearm transfer requirements.
That is the reason why a person that is 18 years or older can be mail order it to their door or cash & carry it out of a store.

However, blackpowder firearms are still regulated all under firearm laws.
This includes open carrying, conceal carrying & loaded firearm in public.
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In our county (Mendocino) the handgun to be carried concealed just needs to be listed on the LTC (per California Penal Code), it does not have to be "approved". One just has to qualify with it at one of the monthly CCW renewal classes held at the Ukiah Gun Club. Simple test, just hit the target a certain number of times within the alloted time period (10 seconds I think).

I know of no restrictions against the use of BP guns for concealment in Mendocino County.

Dan
 
BSA1 said:
I am curious as to what set of circumstances would case a 18 yoa to feel the need to carry a firearm?
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Innocent citizens are attacked and/or killed every single day in this country for nothing more than the money in their pockets. The criminals who perpetrate these acts do not care if their victim is 18 or 21 or 79.

Every data set on the subject that I have seen indicates that CCW permit holders are MUCH more law abiding and responsible than the public at large. If you are afraid of an 18 year old man who has gone to the trouble of researching CCW laws so as not to run a foul of the law then you are afraid of the wrong people.

Furthermore, no free citizen should have to explain to you, the government, or anybody else why they should be allowed the "privilege" of bearing arms. The right to keep and bear arms is not conferred by any government; it is an inherent right that all humans are born with. The bill of rights is not a list of rights that the government confers on citizens; it is a list of rights that the people are born with and the government may not infringe upon.
 
Frank Ettin said:
Relevant only in Mendocino County. These sorts of details vary from County to County.
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This is the statement I was commenting on:

"An issuing agency in CA needs to approve the "handgun" you intend to carry on your CA LTC permit."

The issuing agency in California does not need to "approve" any handgun you need to carry. It just needs to list it on the LTC. That's all.

The IA may chose to require qualification but it does not need to "approve".

Dan
 
bergmen said:
...This is the statement I was commenting on:

"An issuing agency in CA needs to approve the "handgun" you intend to carry on your CA LTC permit."

The issuing agency in California does not need to "approve" any handgun you need to carry....
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Actually, you're still not correct. In some Counties, the sheriffs have required that the handgun be on the roster. I'm also aware of a sheriff in one County declining to add a 1911 to someone's LTC. These actions are perhaps vulnerable to challenge, but for now such policies stand.
 
I know I'm picking nits here but my specific point is being missed.

The statement I am challenging states that "An issuing agency in CA needs to approve..."

An IA may choose to approve, in California it is not required that an IA approve. The impllication in the original statement indicates that "approval" by the IA, statewide, is necessary. It is not.

Dan
 
bergmen said:
...The statement I am challenging states that "An issuing agency in CA needs to approve..."

An IA may choose to approve, in California it is not required that an IA approve...
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If a sheriff in a County has adopted a policy that he will only approve certain guns to be added to an LTC that he issues, and some have, it is a true statement that, at least in such County, the issuing agency must approve the gun.

And we are wasting time and bandwidth on this, so drop it please.
 
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afrederick,

While your emotional retort makes a case in general it does not specifically address why a young man feels a need to run the risk to his future of circumventing gun laws.

One of the advantages of old age it it forces you to plan you actions in advance. For example while I am trying my shoes I look for any other thing that need to be done while done down there.

In the case of my misspent youth I only shake my head at stunts I pulled and how much better it would have been it I had had the wisdom to choose another coarse of action. Fortunately in my misadventures a weapon was not involved.
 
bergmen said:
My daughter who rides her bicycle to junior college for one.

How's that?

Dan
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I've taken a couple classes at the J.C. in Santa Rosa, they have a great campus but things do go wrong there. There's a lot of homeless guys that I wouldn't trust, not to mention the drugs kids are getting into these days. There is crime, I'd rather not take my chances by going unarmed if I still went there.

Not to mention public transport. Again, I'd rather be safe than sorry.

I also suspect that the act of legally acquiring a firearm, applying for a CCW permit, and all the legal stuff would be too much for some punk kid who just wants to carry a gun and act like a bad@$$. With people 18 and older legally carrying I suspect that crime will go down.

Problem is, people see the 18 year olds nowadays and think poorly of them. I saw one dude on campus who stretched out his ears and stuck two Copenhagen cans in them. That isn't the kind of person I'd trust to carry a weapon, but still it seems like they'd have no interest in carrying.

~Levi
 
It would be to near impossible to get an LTC in Sonoma County, used to live there about ten years ago. I was a partner in a business at the time and me and the owner inquired at the Sonoma County Sheriff's office about whether we could get LTC's.

They would not comment, said to apply ($200.00 non-refundable fee) and see what happens. We didn't.

I now live in Mendocino County and my daughter attends Mendocino J.C. I had originally thought that the minimum age for LTC was 21, but I learn here that it is 18. She is getting on the waiting list for the LTC class.

Dan
 
rondog said:
Guess I just have bad luck with 'em. My 1851 Navy gives me fits. I have a new Walker that I loaded only one chamber on Saturday, just a test shot, and damned if that cap didn't lock that pig up too. Had to dig it out with my pocketknife.
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Back your powder down. You do not weigh black powder it goes by violin get your self a black powder a measure.
 
Carl N. Brown said:
I think confusion about antique and replica antique firearms stems from cap'n'ball are not treated as modern firearms by federal law for sale and purchase purposes under GCA 68. That does not change state laws on use or carry of weapons.

I don't know California law, but in Tennessee, while a cap'n'ball revolver is not treated as a modern firearm being regarded more as a curio, keepsake or ornament, carrying one as a weapon meets the definition of the act of "going armed" (carrying practically anything as a weapon outside one's home or place of business). The exception is you can get a permit to carry a handgun (open or concealed) in public and carry of a cap'n'ball would have to meet the same rules as any firearm for carry purposes. I can't imagine California being more lenient on the carry of cap'n'ball as a weapon, although in the 1950s Tennessee handgun laws were as strict New York state outside NYC.

New York has that odd law that a cap'n'ball is not legally treated as a firearm until after it has been loaded, to be fired as a firearm. Up to that point, it is treated as a curio or ornament. IIRC once ever loaded, the cap'n'ball is subject to NY firearms laws even after it is unloaded.
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In NY possession of a BP pistol, and the ball, powder, caps, is also a problem, from what I remember living there. Didn't have to be loaded.
 
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