Car Fight

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Ghostrider_23

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Last week while driving down the street I saw a mini-van in the left turn lane with an older man in it and a woman hitting him with a bat through the window while her three gang banger kids stood along side the van chanting her on and yelling at him. The woman would yell and then swing the bat at the man through the drivers side widow, then hitting the side of the van too. All of this took place in the turn lane with the man stuck in traffic and of course no one bothered to get out to help him either. The light turned green the the man drove off. All this in a matter of 45 seconds. I turned to my girl friend and said, and you wonder why I carry a gun!

Question for you because it occupied my mind for the entire drive home.

What would you have done in that same scenario?????????????????

:confused:
 
I wouldn't have shot unless I really felt like she was trying to beat me senseless or kill me and not just destroy my vehicle.

A call to 911 would be in order and then I suspect that she and Mr. Kel Tec would have had a formal introduction. I suspect that would have stopped the swinging.

Really hard to say without knowing all the facts.

All of this took place in the turn lane with the man stuck in traffic and of course no one bothered to get out to help him either.
Click to expand...

Including you, I presume. :confused:
 
That's what I am saying Ala Dan! If I wold have been the spectator like you were and all she was doing was hitting his van with a bat, I would call 911 and let them know about it. If she were actually beating him with the bat then I would have gotten out and stopped it. I know I will catch heat for writing that but I live by my morals and ethics and not yours.
Now if I would have been the one in the van then as soon as that lady presented a bat, before hitting my van, she would have been given a good reason to turn around and get back in her car.
 
igpoobah

igpoobah

No I was making a right turn and heading in the opposite direction. I was slowing down to assist when the light turned green and the man drove away.

The mini-vans window was either down or the lady had broken it out, either way she was hitting the man in the face and while yelling was hitting the roof and door.

My question was aimed at both what would you do if you were in the van??

And what would you have done if you were driving by or sitting in traffic???


This is a sad world if one can not help a fellow person from attack, it's like the video of the man in the pizza shop that the lady was arguing with and her boyfriend came in and kicked & beat the heck out of the guy while everyone just stood there and watched. Nobody wants to help until something happens to them and then they cry why others didn't help out.
SAD SAD WORLD we live in!!!!!
 
either way she was hitting the man in the face and while yelling
Click to expand...

That's considered an aggravated battery with a deadly weapon. Legally, in FL, I can shoot. And I thing I would have. Also, in FL, we have the "in their shoes" law, so you can shoot in defense of a third party. Being hit in the head with a baseball bat (I assume it was baseball bat???) is likely to cause death or great bodily harm. Although it would suck to shoot and possibly kill a mother in front of her kids.
 
Or shoot and find out that he had just got done killing another one of her kids or raping her. There would never be enough knowlege in one's head who would find themselves in a 3rd party scenario in that situation. If you decide to shoot you could be in a world of trouble regardless of what the laws are.

I see a lock coming
 
Legally in VA, we could shoot too (if I were the guy being hit in the van). In VA, we are authorized to use deadly force when we believe that our (or a 3rd party's) life is in danger. Though we are required to flee (retreat) if possible first...let me see...I'm stuck in traffic, can't flee...and I'm being hit in the head with a bat...DUH :)
As for property...I don't like someone trashing my vehicle that I worked hard to pay for...and I don't need my insurance going up either.
But then again I believe VA has some law about discharging firearms from within vehicles...don't know if that'd apply.
What I just posted is if I were the guy getting hit with the bat in the van.

I don't know what I would have done if I was just a bystander.
 
I would have stayed in the are trying to maintain a visual on the attacker and phoned it in to PD.

Given the time frame, I don't think you had enough time to engage prior to the victim leaving the area. It sounds like it went down pretty fast and it would have just been you and them, with no victim. Not the best of positions to be in.

I've actually had a gang fight break out right in front of my car at a light. Both parties had weapons like chains and sticks/bats. I kept my firearm in hand and decided I wouldn't engage unless I personally was threatened. I would have been very outnumbered. LAPD responded... 30 minutes later. Sadly I was told that they suspected it was a BS call as I was the ONLY caller.
 
Call 911 is about all you can do. IMO to take on a woman w/ a bat plus her 'banger' kids plus potentially the male occupant in the van is more than I'm willing to confront.
 
How do you know the kids were gangbangers?
Click to expand...


a few kids= gang of kids
shouting encouragement to a person banging on a guy with a bat= bangers.

Gangbangers.

:)

Please tell me you aren't pulling out stereotyping as an attempt to defend this behavior. Their own actions condemn them OF their actions.


-- John
 
Too much is unknown. Even if you knew the full story, and knew the apparent gangbangers were the ones who started it, a handgun would be a dicey thing to bring into play. That's long gun work, as there are simply too many targets hopping around to be sure of a handgun shot unless you get close enough to get jumped yourself.

For all you know, the old man just ran over her baby. Assuming things based on first impressions can put you in prison.
 
ADEE.

Avoid

De-escalate- Disengage

Escape

Evade

The only gunfight you really win is the one you don't have.

lpl/nc
 
Agree that involvement to help driver would be tricky.

For all you know that may have been her ex-husband stealing her van from her drive.

There are two major dangers in getting into a (gun)fight on someone else's behalf. First, you need to know who is right and who is wrong. Second, when LE turns up you need to have them recognise that YOU, the guy with the gun, are not the assailant.
 
always leave yourself an exit in traffic. If someone attempts to car jack you (or beat up your car with a flippin' bat) then your best course of action is to drive off and dial 911. Avoid the fight.

Leave enough room than you can get away when waiting on a train. I'm not a BG, but if I were that would be easy pickins. If you're in the turn lane and someone comes at you with a bat, don't draw....drive! Mash the horn and turn right to minimize your risk of being pounded by another car. If you didn't leave an exit or can't...Mash the horn and start plowing other cars. Cause a massive mess, all the time holding down your horn. Your insurance will cover the damages and you may save your life by causing such a ruckous.

Think about the scenario before it happens, and you're much better prepared. You should know before it happens exactly when you would draw your weapon. Ask yourself now what you would do if someone randomly came up to you and you're in the turn lane that way you don't think when it happens, and you'll make the best possible choice.

If you fire on a woman with a bat, you're going to end up in trouble. You're going to be paying an attorney and you're going to go to trial...at best the DA will say it's justified to kill the woman. Then, you're facing a wrongful death suit from an ambulance chasing lawyer who read about the incident in the newspaper and tracked down the woman's kids and will sue you for 20-30% of the settlement/judgement.
 
as far as shooting a mother in front of her kids. If she was trying to strike me in the head with a baseball bat, and cause great bodily harm, or kill me, I would end her life without hesitation.

Ever seen Kill-Bill? when she kills the little girls mother and neals down and says ..

"It was not my intention to do this in front of you. For that, I'm sorry. But you can take my word for it, your mother had it comin'. When you grow up, if you still feel raw about it....I'll be waiting."


Thats what I would say to them. Personally I could care less about a gangbanger----I would feel sorry for her kids for growing up in that life style, though, that's just a tragic way to grow up as a child. But I'm hardly about to let someone beat me in the face with a baseball bat.
 
Though when I studied law----Kellyj00 said it best. be prepared to avoid any situation and make it possible to get out of a situation where you would be forced to use deadly force (if you didn't leave yourself a way out)

The last paragraph made me laugh, because it's so true.
 
GHOSTRIDER 23 - "All of this took place in the turn lane with the man stuck in traffic and of course no one bothered to get out to help him either."


Where?? State?? City??

L.W.
 
always leave yourself an exit in traffic. If someone attempts to car jack you (or beat up your car with a flippin' bat) then your best course of action is to drive off and dial 911. Avoid the fight.
Click to expand...

A great rule of thumb that I "try" to always follow: make sure you can see the bottom of the rear tires of the car in front of you, whenever at a stop.

This obviously isn't a guarantee that you'd be able to escape (depending on traffic, obstacles etc.), but it's a good baseline for being able to make a turn without rearending the guy in front...without leaving so much room that it's likely someone in an adjacent lane will horn themselves in to the free space.

Once ingrained, it's a habit with no downside and a possibly valuable upside.
 
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