AJC1
Member
As I gander through my Lyman Cast boolit book #4 it appears that most recommended accuracy loads are the start loads. Does this testing match your experience at all.
Cast boolit load performance in rifle
- Thread starter AJC1
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Vern Humphrey
Member
I find it doesn't pay to push cast bullet loads. For example, in .30-06 with a 160 grain Lee bullet, I get best accuracy at around 1600 fps.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
To tell the truth, I didn't notice that. My book is in the basement right now but when I go downstairs I will take a look.
Most times I thought the potentially most accurate load can be anywhere in the charge range.
Most times I thought the potentially most accurate load can be anywhere in the charge range.
Vern Humphrey
Member
I like 27 grains for both .30-06 and .308 with the 160 grain cast bullet.
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AJC1
Member
I wish nossler data had cast boolits, I like how they give a bunch of best tested load data.
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AJC1
Member
When I walked past that powder at sportsman's and they wanted 60.99 plus tax, promptly ended my desire to try it... most expensive powder in the store and I had no idea why. I did buy a 44 dollar bottle of herco.
GooseGestapo
Member
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- 6,157
Good accuracy can be had up to 2,200-2,300fps.
Alloys, sizing diameter, and bullet lube enter into the equation.
Also, chamber, throats, rifling, twist, etc.
Cast bullet accuracy in rifles is a “rabbit hole”!
Here’s the entrance:
Since the latest panic/shortage of components, I’m more committed than ever to keeping primers, powders, and brass on hand. I have about a half ton of lead, and dozens of molds and necessary accessories.
At Georgia hunting distances, cast bullets are no handicap. My .35Rem Marlin kills as good or better with a cast bullet.
Alloys, sizing diameter, and bullet lube enter into the equation.
Also, chamber, throats, rifling, twist, etc.
Cast bullet accuracy in rifles is a “rabbit hole”!
Here’s the entrance:
At Georgia hunting distances, cast bullets are no handicap. My .35Rem Marlin kills as good or better with a cast bullet.
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AJC1
Member
I'm just getting my toes wet with rifle. I have a 165 plain base and a 175 with gas check. I'm feeling it out.
GooseGestapo
Member
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- Jan 6, 2003
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- 6,157
In the .308 there are two different directions you can go.
Hunting loads and target loads. The 175gr GC will give you both.
30.-34.0gr of H4895 or similar will give 1,800-2,200fps and good performance in the field for hunting loads.
13.0gr of RedDot is a universal plinking/target load. Likewise, 15.0gr of Unique.
16.0-20gr of #2400 gives match grade accuracy with proper treatment.
-I recommend sizing to 0.311”.
-Use Wheel weight alloy wit 2% added 95/5 lead free solder. (Tin-antimony). This improves mold fill and bullet hardness.
-Use either SPG or NRA 50/50 lube.
-If you must seat the base of the bullet below the base of the neck of the case, use a filler wad of Dacron pillow stuffing. A loose tuft the size of the tip of your little finger is enough. Tamp it in with a pencil.
Hunting loads and target loads. The 175gr GC will give you both.
30.-34.0gr of H4895 or similar will give 1,800-2,200fps and good performance in the field for hunting loads.
13.0gr of RedDot is a universal plinking/target load. Likewise, 15.0gr of Unique.
16.0-20gr of #2400 gives match grade accuracy with proper treatment.
-I recommend sizing to 0.311”.
-Use Wheel weight alloy wit 2% added 95/5 lead free solder. (Tin-antimony). This improves mold fill and bullet hardness.
-Use either SPG or NRA 50/50 lube.
-If you must seat the base of the bullet below the base of the neck of the case, use a filler wad of Dacron pillow stuffing. A loose tuft the size of the tip of your little finger is enough. Tamp it in with a pencil.
OP
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AJC1
Member
I'm just playing with 308. It's the round I'm most familiar. The serious work is 30-30 because that cartridge is destined for crappy bc bullets...
5744 has always been expensive, but it's a good powder. I still have 2 pounds.
P Flados
Member
One of my first guns to have a couple of full power cast loads that I was really happy with was a 16.25" 357 AR Max (similar to 350L). The gun was assembled from a high quality custom barrel but then mostly low cost generic AR-15 parts and pieces.
Best accuracy was with loads right at the edge of perforating primers. The gun shoots right at 2 MOA at 200 yards with a 200 gr bullet at 2000 fps. It shoots 180s almost as good but with slightly more velocity. I estimate pressure as around 55,000 psi. These are NLG bullets from molds that I made with bullet profiles similar to the Speer 180 FP. I use range scrap lead and then coated them with ASBB HF red PC.
On the other hand most of my TC Contender "rifle type" stuff (7 TCU, 30 Herrett, 30-30, etc.) seems to like loads in the 80% to 95% of max range. Although they were fired in a handgun, these specific loads are more like rifle loads than normal handgun loads (bottle neck brass and barrel lengths of 10" and 14"). For some of these guns accuracy was good at one charge and absolutely terrible with just a little bit more speed.
I also have 357 Max guns (revolver and TC Contender) that also seems to like loads as hot as I am willing to push them.
So the bottom line is "what the gun likes" up to a point. This can be reduced, but it can also be full tilt for some rounds. As you push past a certain point, cast accuracy will quickly go out the door. However, this threshold is probably a lot higher than many folks assume.
Best accuracy was with loads right at the edge of perforating primers. The gun shoots right at 2 MOA at 200 yards with a 200 gr bullet at 2000 fps. It shoots 180s almost as good but with slightly more velocity. I estimate pressure as around 55,000 psi. These are NLG bullets from molds that I made with bullet profiles similar to the Speer 180 FP. I use range scrap lead and then coated them with ASBB HF red PC.
On the other hand most of my TC Contender "rifle type" stuff (7 TCU, 30 Herrett, 30-30, etc.) seems to like loads in the 80% to 95% of max range. Although they were fired in a handgun, these specific loads are more like rifle loads than normal handgun loads (bottle neck brass and barrel lengths of 10" and 14"). For some of these guns accuracy was good at one charge and absolutely terrible with just a little bit more speed.
I also have 357 Max guns (revolver and TC Contender) that also seems to like loads as hot as I am willing to push them.
So the bottom line is "what the gun likes" up to a point. This can be reduced, but it can also be full tilt for some rounds. As you push past a certain point, cast accuracy will quickly go out the door. However, this threshold is probably a lot higher than many folks assume.
BWS
Member
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- Dec 6, 2017
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- 763
A lot of folks are looking for quick answers;
Staying in lower accuracy nodes/zones makes this almost possible. There's still some nuances but it's mostly fit and staying on the "path".
Once you start getting speed hungry,the answers become a touch more vague because you're seeing interfaces of several areas... and the way YOU balance those are now starting to become more dependent on each individual rig.
Get past starting JB loads,up into max JB book loads with cast, the answers just can not be generalized..... they became extremely specific.
Staying in lower accuracy nodes/zones makes this almost possible. There's still some nuances but it's mostly fit and staying on the "path".
Once you start getting speed hungry,the answers become a touch more vague because you're seeing interfaces of several areas... and the way YOU balance those are now starting to become more dependent on each individual rig.
Get past starting JB loads,up into max JB book loads with cast, the answers just can not be generalized..... they became extremely specific.
Charlie98
Member
That's my spin on it, too. For an 'out of the book' recommendation, I can see where the lower velocity recipe might be the most accurate, because without considering the alloy and lube, and very specifically the bullet diameter when matched to the bore... you can lose accuracy very quickly.
AA5744 is a good powder, the trade-off has always been it's cost. Personally, I don't see what AA5744 does that IMR4198 doesn't do at a lower cost per charge.
I have personally experienced near jacketed bullet performance and accuracy in .30/06 using paper patched bullets......at full /06 velocity. Work up can be tedious and you've really gotta pay close attention to detail, but it is possible. Leading, if done properly, is virtually non existent and when you start seeing confetti you will also start seeing a polished bore!
I got it years ago to use in my 7TCU and 357 magnum when I shot silhouette. I am not must of rifle shooter for every rifle round I have loaded I have loaded 30 revolver rounds, so I don't know much about other rifle powders. Back in the 80's it was surplus powder from Israel called XMP5744.
Charlie98
Member
It's not a bad powder... I've used it; if IMR4198 wasn't available, I'd gladly use AA5744... I already have established loading data for it. Actually, I think the old XMP5744 is now Shooters World Buffalo Rifle, and current AA5744 is from a different source.
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AJC1
Member
I'm definitely OK having fun on the bottom to start... better than the frustration I had last trip wondering where the bullets were going...
Charlie98
Member
I feel your pain, brother... I had the same problem with that Savage 99 in .30-30. Gave me fits!
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AJC1
Member
My current plan is to find an OK load and test .309, .310 and .311 in the 308. History shows .310 is good in the 94 but is .311 better????
Charlie98
Member
If .310" doesn't produce reasonable results with a generic handload (think IMR4198 or IMR3031, etc...) then I wouldn't waste any time and move to .311"s.
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AJC1
Member
30-31 might be the only imr powder in the faster range I don't have. I don't currently have use for 4350 and slower but that 6.5x55 will get its turn eventually
Charlie98
Member
H322, RL7, there are more... 
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