Cat defense?

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Logistar

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On a recent hiking trip after dark (I know, I know...) I was greeted by a "cat". Both of us heard the low pitched growl and I saw his eyes briefly looking over a cliff.

I grabbed my 9mm and for the first time in my life thought "JAM"!

I didn't need to use the 9. However, at my next range trip the original carry mag was fine but the spare had a misfeed on the 3rd round. - I thought about the cat. Then I thought... REVOLVER!

ANYWAY... I KNOW there are a lot of threads on this subject. I had planned to buy a S&W 329PD (Scandium) but decided against it after reading posts here. I figure with that either it or my wrist will do a "kaboom"!

What is the latest thinking here? I would LIKE to have a revolver that would double as a trail/city carry gun. Light weight is good but I need a decent caliber and a CHANCE for a follow up shot. I already have "deep-concealment guns" I can wear when necessary.

Any specific recommendations? I prefer a NEW gun but would consider used.

THANKS!
Logistar
 
You could fix your 9mm autoloader, or buy a reliable one. 124gr+P 9mm should be enough. Otherwise there are a variety of reliable autos in 10mm and .45ACP which ought to be enough.

-z
 
Easy! Three inch Model 13 or 65 (preferrably a 65LS)--slap a Hogue Bantum Grip on it and stoke it with 145-grain Silvertips. I carry mine concealed in an El Paso Saddlery "C-Force" (IWB and a loose tuck on my shirt) or open in an El Paso Saddlery "Tortilla." It's just about as perfect of city gun/country gun as you could want. There's a lot to be said for "six for sure!"
 
We were encountering big cats out west while working and my solution was a glock 20. Ultra reliable, 16 shots of 10mm silvertips. Never used it, but it sure made me feel safe for hiking and working.
 
Well, there's cats, and then there's CATS ... :what:


A S&W model 13 (even one stoked with .357 mag ammo) or the typical piddly 124gn 9mm will be adequate for putting down your neighbor's pet cat, "Bo-Bo," who's been knocking over your garbage can lids at 3 a.m. every night for the past week. Should be a one-shot-stop. :scrutiny:

But for using a pistol round against the BIG CATS (like the ones causing problems out west), you're going to need something having more substantial knock-down power, which means a cartridge having the capability to propel a fairly heavy slug at high velocity. In other words: "heavy & fast."

The 10mm AUTO is the only autoloading caliber that gives you that capability, and it does so in pistols of reasonable size and weight. (No pants-drooping behemoths need apply, e.g., Wildeys, Auto-Mags or Desert Eagles).

Various ammo-makers (e.g., Double Tap and Texas Ammo) produce 10mm loads with premium bullets that are more than sufficient for this task.

As Peter Eick suggested, a Glock 20, using a "pre-ban" mag, gives you a 15+1 capacity of no-nonsense 10mm firepower. Although a full-size pistol, the G20's light-weight polymer frame makes for easy portability in the back woods and mountain areas. Add Trijicon night sights and a good holster - one worn in such a way as to give you IMMEDIATE access to the gun - and you're good to go.

:cool:
 
Actually, if you really want heavy and fast, there are several .357 Magnum factory loads available that will actually top (very slightly) the hottest 10mm loads from Double Tap and Texas Ammo. I don't really think they're needed for cats--they're just not that big, and the real trick is knowing their coming and having time to react--chances are you won't.

The Silvertip (whether .357 Magnum or 10mm) should be adequate (though the Partition Gold in .357 Magnum might be better than either Silvertip--it's not available in 10mm). Since you wanted something to "double as a trail/city carry gun," the Silvertip is probably about as good "all-round" as they get.
 
I would guess my "cats" were about 85 to 150 lbs, and did not purr much. They liked to "piss" on the equipment which shorted out the connections and frankly it really reaked in the hot sun. I would say we were invading their territory. Thus the 10mm was about the base case taking one out then.
 
Go find a clean used S&W Mod 58. A .41 mag with the right loads should get you through any encounter..and, you will be one of the few kids on the block to have one.
 
Ha Ha!

You guys should have been in NYC this afternoon. Story just coming over the AP wire service advises a 450 lb white Siberian tiger escaped from the Circus in town and then went for an incident free stroll though some residential areas.

The tiger was recaptured without incident, but evidently wandered through a local park in full view of a church goup picknicking there causing some degree of...er...consternation (it would spoil MY lunch!).

Terrorists, criminals and now tigers in NYC. Man, I'm glad I call Galveston Tx home!
 
They liked to "piss" on the equipment which shorted out the connections and frankly it really reaked in the hot sun.
Click to expand...
Boy, I bet it did--better you than me. You're about right on the weight--they're not really big animals. The .357 Magnum/10mm is about the threshold of what I would feel comfortable with as well--I wouldn't want to go below it for sure.

I think the guy asking the question was more interested in self-protection more than anything and specifically asked for revolver information which pretty well leaves the 10mm out (except for the 610, and it's pretty big). Of course, the 10mm would do the job as well as the .357 Magnum, and if he was asking about an autoloader, it would be a good answer.

Hey, Shootist, it wasn't too many months back that a gorilla got loose in Dallas and hurt a couple of people. I believe the cops ended having to shoot it.
 
I like the idea fo a 10mm semi auto, however, a mountain lion often attacks from behind and grabs your head or neck with its teeth. This means I would be flopping on the ground with the cat. I worry about a semi-auto getting pushed out of battery or jamming after the first shot because it wouldn't have room for the slide to cycle correctly. I would trust a compact revolver. I think one of the all stainless models would be easier to control with one hand. Maybe a S&W 640 or 649 with hot .38 SP loads.

If you are planning on shooting a mountain lion that isn't already on you then I'm all for a 10mm or even a 9mm. Maybe a .357SIG? :)

Rich
 
Yeah, a .357 SIG will work. When he was still president of SIGARMS, Ted Rowe reportedly took a cougar or two with the new round from a P-229. Government trappers and hunters out west have used even lesser calibers, but usuallly pick their shots on a cat already treed by dogs.

Obviously, a .357 Magnum will work, too. And I suspect a 9mm with a deep penetrating load that expands some will suffice. Learn cougar anatomy.

I know of one guy in British Columbia who killed a cougar with a lockblade folding knife about 2 years ago. It was the Schrade version of the Buck No. 110 style.

By the way, Schrade went out of business last week. Sad.

Lone Star
 
Back when I still had a 357 Mag revolver, I used the Winchester/ Nosler Partition Gold 180gr HP load. Expensive as heck but should have been perfect. Never got to use it on a cat. Put a major hole in a feral dog however. Now that I just have a 1911, I use hardball or my hardcast handloads.

The problem in my neck of the woods isn't cats, it's meth labs. The idiot cranksters will set up on a dead-end landing and they don't like visitors. Been carrying an SKS or a M38 Mosin to deal with that problem. The Mosin will pretty much stop anything that roams in the woods around here including the vehicles those morons drive.

ZM
 
If you're worried about cats attacking from behind, then wear a hat or mask that has "eyes" on the back. It seems the big cats won't charge if they think you're looking at them.
 
I don't want to jump-start a controversy, but there have been a lot of posts recently about revolvers failing -- breaking transfer bars, ejector rods unscrewing, lock parts coming out of alignment, grit under the ejector star, and so on.

That ties in with Army experience with revolvers in Viet Nam -- they didn't shine as brightly as expected.

Carry a revolver, if you wish, but keep it clean and well-maintained. If you decide to stay with an auto, do the same.
 
Not one mention of the .44mag???

Get a Smith 629 or Ruger Redhawk and you can handle most anything out in the wilds of the lower 48.
 
I have a .38 special that has never failed in 20+ years.

My semi-auto RARELY has a problem. The jam was odd. The empty cartridge lodged between the slide and the top of the chamber. The slide wouldn't move forward into battery. (Never seen that one before).

- But I was moving around a bit and may have limp-wristed the round.

My idea with the cat was that:

1. I likely wouldn't get many shots off. (Semi - no advantage)

2. If hiking, might "limp wrist" gun and get jam depending on situation.

3. If cat attacked me... I'd have a serious "limp wristing problem"!!!


I feel in love with the idea of the new Smith 329PD but after kabooms and reports of harsh recoil and bad follow up shots... I gave up on it.

I can carry some weight when hiking (but I know how bad weight can get.)

Thanks for all the posts. I know this has been floating around and I appreciate not getting "read the existing" messages from you guys. (I already have been.)

I have never hiked in the western US before but plan to hike all around the US in the next few years. I just thought I'd see what the current concensus was. (Rifles are out of the question!)

THANKS!

Oh, Mrstang01, I was in the Badlands of South Dakota. This was after dark. Everyone heard the cat. I saw it's eyes briefly. When I visited my sister later I saw her cat in the dark. SAME LOOK! Really spooked me. From descriptions I gave everyone has said Cougar. I wanna say Bobcat because I know they are there. - Eyes awfully far apart for a Bobcat though.
 
They're sure enough here in Arkansas. One was actually caught inside the city limits of North Little Rock a couple of years ago, and my neighbor saw one a couple of weeks back within a hundred yards or so of my house.

A neighbor on the other side has lost a couple of goats to what we belive is a mountain lion.
 
A 4" K frame S&W with boot grips loaded with 125's for ccw and a 145's for kitty cats. Swap on a set of Hogue grips for hiking trips and you'll have a nice trail gun.

If you choose an auto go with a 10 mm in something like a Glock.
 
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