bill2
Member
Over the Memorial Day weekend, I attended Front Sight’s 4 day tactical shotgun course. First, my background in shotguns – I have competed in several 3 gun competitions with shotgun/pistol and have taken a local 1 day course in self defense shotgun but other than that I have not had any training or experience in shotguns. I have never been in law enforcement.
Except for the first day when we started at 7:15 am, we got going at 800 am and ended the day at around 600 pm. On the third day we had our night shoot and ended around 1000 pm. There were lectures every lunch time and some in the evening – levels of competence, combat mindset, using deadly force, civil and criminal liability, choosing a handgun (anyone could attend the lectures on any of the subjects), and the reality of the streets.
The first day we checked in, had our shotguns checked out by the instructors, and then had a short lecture in the main hall. We started shooting that morning starting, as we did with every new teaching point, with practicing with no ammo.
The second day had us shooting in the morning, attending a lunch time lecture on various subjects (mind set, legal realities, and tactical movement). Some of the students had a chance to shoot in the canyon walk (you walk through a canyon with various metal silhouette targets painted to signal a bad guy or a hostage).
The third day we sighted in our guns with slugs at 35 and 50 yards, and also did the canyon walk. I liked this as it was so different from being on a range all the time and shooting on line with a bunch of people. We also had a “shoot house” that had various posters in it signifying a bad guy or a good guy, and in the last room we had a hostage situation poster (guy holding a woman with one arm and the other hand pointing a pistol at her head). I was so engrossed in taking him out that as I moved closer and shot the guy in the head (a great shot by the way in my opinion!) that I forgot about the small room on my left – as I shot the bad guy the instructor punched me several times in the left shoulder, shouting bam! Bam! Bam! as he did. When I looked to my left, I noticed that there was another bad guy poster in that room, which I had completely overlooked because I was so intent on ending the hostage situation. Point taken. While you’re going through the house, the instructor is yelling in your ear – things that the bad guys are saying and things that your spouse/children might be saying – in order to help make it a bit more realistic. That evening around 600 pm we had some more lectures on shotguns and rifles and what are good accessories for them. That night we had the night shoot, ending at around 1000 pm.
The fourth day we reviewed all the subjects we had done, going over malfunction drills, movement, staying on the target after the first shot, etc. We had our skills test in the afternoon, and did some slug shots on steel silhouettes at 100 yards (I had some trouble with the rear sight but after fixing it I hit 4 out of 6 shots dead on the center of the target.
All the instructors (there were four of them), were very good. They could all demonstrate the skills they talked about quite well. The head range instructor had 20 years in the Marine Corps as a ground pounder and as a small arms instructor.
I liked all the lectures, the first one was on Front Sight itself and many people sat off on one side or the other and didn’t pay attention to that one, but many other people listened to the other lectures on tactical subjects. There were several classes going on at the same time, 2 and 4 day classes on rifle or pistol or shotgun all started on the same day - Friday. All 2 and 4 day courses have the same course of instruction for the first two days; 4 day courses have the student competition shoot offs and the night shooting.
The course lists required ammo load for the four days as 300 birdshot, 250 buckshot, and 75 slug. I actually used around 250 bird, 210 buckshot, and 60 slug. I got the correct positioning of the stock in the hollow of my shoulder correctly and all that firing hurt a lot less than it would have if I had done it incorrectly.
Things I learned:
• Shooting from prone with slugs hurts – no way around it.
• My competition mentality from 3 gun (take finger off of the trigger while looking for the next target, not moving tactically) will hurt me in an actual self defense situation. Yes, it may be obvious to you reading this – it was to me too after being told about it, but the habits I had ingrained in myself were hard to break.
• I have a Benelli M1 12 gauge, and used full power buckshot, no low recoil, and had no trouble at all with my shotgun. I had trouble previously with low recoil buckshot, jamming numerous times.
• Dry practice at home with no ammo/empty hulls is quite helpful, especially with malfunction drills.
• I enjoyed the shoot house and canyon walk the most, since they were the most realistic and got me out of the range mentality, which is the only place that I have shot (in competition and general practice), forcing me to check for bad guys (and good guys also) in almost a 360 degree circle.
• I would not like to have to end a hostage situation with a shotgun. We practiced against these posters with a guy with a pistol to the head of a woman, but instructors explained that this was an unrealistic situation with the bad staying completely still so we could off set our aim with the buckshot to just take him out without hurting the hostage.
• I need more training.
I will go back and attend the 2 day skill builder when I get a chance.
Also, one guy flying in had two shotguns stolen. He landed in Las Vegas airport and the airline (can’t remember which one) said they couldn’t find them??!! He said they had offered a bit over half of their actual value for reimbursement – he told the airline that the amount was unacceptable and would see them in court. Not a good way to start a course.
Except for the first day when we started at 7:15 am, we got going at 800 am and ended the day at around 600 pm. On the third day we had our night shoot and ended around 1000 pm. There were lectures every lunch time and some in the evening – levels of competence, combat mindset, using deadly force, civil and criminal liability, choosing a handgun (anyone could attend the lectures on any of the subjects), and the reality of the streets.
The first day we checked in, had our shotguns checked out by the instructors, and then had a short lecture in the main hall. We started shooting that morning starting, as we did with every new teaching point, with practicing with no ammo.
The second day had us shooting in the morning, attending a lunch time lecture on various subjects (mind set, legal realities, and tactical movement). Some of the students had a chance to shoot in the canyon walk (you walk through a canyon with various metal silhouette targets painted to signal a bad guy or a hostage).
The third day we sighted in our guns with slugs at 35 and 50 yards, and also did the canyon walk. I liked this as it was so different from being on a range all the time and shooting on line with a bunch of people. We also had a “shoot house” that had various posters in it signifying a bad guy or a good guy, and in the last room we had a hostage situation poster (guy holding a woman with one arm and the other hand pointing a pistol at her head). I was so engrossed in taking him out that as I moved closer and shot the guy in the head (a great shot by the way in my opinion!) that I forgot about the small room on my left – as I shot the bad guy the instructor punched me several times in the left shoulder, shouting bam! Bam! Bam! as he did. When I looked to my left, I noticed that there was another bad guy poster in that room, which I had completely overlooked because I was so intent on ending the hostage situation. Point taken. While you’re going through the house, the instructor is yelling in your ear – things that the bad guys are saying and things that your spouse/children might be saying – in order to help make it a bit more realistic. That evening around 600 pm we had some more lectures on shotguns and rifles and what are good accessories for them. That night we had the night shoot, ending at around 1000 pm.
The fourth day we reviewed all the subjects we had done, going over malfunction drills, movement, staying on the target after the first shot, etc. We had our skills test in the afternoon, and did some slug shots on steel silhouettes at 100 yards (I had some trouble with the rear sight but after fixing it I hit 4 out of 6 shots dead on the center of the target.
All the instructors (there were four of them), were very good. They could all demonstrate the skills they talked about quite well. The head range instructor had 20 years in the Marine Corps as a ground pounder and as a small arms instructor.
I liked all the lectures, the first one was on Front Sight itself and many people sat off on one side or the other and didn’t pay attention to that one, but many other people listened to the other lectures on tactical subjects. There were several classes going on at the same time, 2 and 4 day classes on rifle or pistol or shotgun all started on the same day - Friday. All 2 and 4 day courses have the same course of instruction for the first two days; 4 day courses have the student competition shoot offs and the night shooting.
The course lists required ammo load for the four days as 300 birdshot, 250 buckshot, and 75 slug. I actually used around 250 bird, 210 buckshot, and 60 slug. I got the correct positioning of the stock in the hollow of my shoulder correctly and all that firing hurt a lot less than it would have if I had done it incorrectly.
Things I learned:
• Shooting from prone with slugs hurts – no way around it.
• My competition mentality from 3 gun (take finger off of the trigger while looking for the next target, not moving tactically) will hurt me in an actual self defense situation. Yes, it may be obvious to you reading this – it was to me too after being told about it, but the habits I had ingrained in myself were hard to break.
• I have a Benelli M1 12 gauge, and used full power buckshot, no low recoil, and had no trouble at all with my shotgun. I had trouble previously with low recoil buckshot, jamming numerous times.
• Dry practice at home with no ammo/empty hulls is quite helpful, especially with malfunction drills.
• I enjoyed the shoot house and canyon walk the most, since they were the most realistic and got me out of the range mentality, which is the only place that I have shot (in competition and general practice), forcing me to check for bad guys (and good guys also) in almost a 360 degree circle.
• I would not like to have to end a hostage situation with a shotgun. We practiced against these posters with a guy with a pistol to the head of a woman, but instructors explained that this was an unrealistic situation with the bad staying completely still so we could off set our aim with the buckshot to just take him out without hurting the hostage.
• I need more training.
I will go back and attend the 2 day skill builder when I get a chance.
Also, one guy flying in had two shotguns stolen. He landed in Las Vegas airport and the airline (can’t remember which one) said they couldn’t find them??!! He said they had offered a bit over half of their actual value for reimbursement – he told the airline that the amount was unacceptable and would see them in court. Not a good way to start a course.
