Clearing It up on Ny Felony.

[Sharpshooter223]

Well it's over now and I figured I'd let everyone know the facts of what happened since everyone had different ideas and perceptions. Someone even dug up the article from the Watertown Police lol.

Watertown police have made a second arrest as a result of the three-hour armed standoff they had Nov. 4 at 536 Arsenal St.

Jared L. Staggs, 23, Fort Drum, was charged Thursday morning with third- and fourth-degree counts of criminal possession of a weapon. He awaits grand jury action.

Police said he was not present during the standoff, but a gun seized at the scene, a .40-caliber semiautomatic pistol with a large-capacity ammunition feeding device, is owned by Mr. Staggs. The gun is registered in Texas, but is not licensed in New York, making it illegally possessed, police said.

The man in the standoff, Cornelius B. Dickson, 31, who was staying at 536 Arsenal St., faces the same two weapon counts. He is a Fort Drum soldier and a veteran of combat in Iraq.

Well the reason he had to leave them at his friends is because the armory is closed on the weekends and he happened to bring them from Tx to NY on the weekend seeing normal military hours are M-F. Sux that NY has no grace period on registering firearms, he had them in NY less than 2 days before a shot was fired from another weapon around the area and when they came to Dicksons house he wouldn't answer. The man Dickson suffers from combat related sleep problems so he takes prescribed meds so he can sleep. The "3 hour standoff" consisted of the police knocking on his door, him not answering cause he was asleep, and it taking 3 hours for the swat team to get there to raid it. The judge looked over staggs military records, confirms that he has no criminal background not even a speeding ticket, and also is aware that he is going to college as a criminal justice major to be a police officer. The DA offered a class A misdemeanor, he didn't want that either cause it's BS and the judge is lowering it to a class C (similar to a speeding ticket offense). However, they are now all focused on Dickson now to try to nail him. Pretty sad ****, even sadder than Obama is in office now

 

[steveracer]

How did they come to know he had a handgun? I don't know the whole story, but it seems he had to screw up somewhere if they knew he had a pistol.
I like that they said "ammunition feeding device" so I didn't have to slap them silly for saying "clip".
Steve

 

[Prince Yamato]

536 Arsenal St.

Well, there's some irony for you...

 

[moi_self26]

large-capacity ammunition feeding device

gee, is that kind of like a MAGAZINE? That would be too easy to state, as opposed to making it sound like something not in the norm...... gotta add that shock value for mindless dolts who don't have the first clue about firearms. :banghead:

This is just absurd.

 

[eye5600]

Pretty sad ****, even sadder than Obama is in office now

What does the president have to do with it? Adding a illogical complaint about Obama to every story about an addled-brained public servant subtracts from your credibility.

 

[QuietEarp]

I may be mistaken but I believe that the only way to get an out of state handgun into NYS legally is trough an ffl. They can be driven through the state but if that is the destination they must go through an ffl even if they were legally owned in another state by the same person. That person would require a pistol permit to receive possession of their firearm. So as far as a "grace period" the people in question went about it the wrong way, unless I am missing something. Having a magazine that holds over 10 rounds is illegal in NY unless it is pre-ban. I don't think that there is a "grace period" on that.
So this person did break the law by bringing the gun into NYS and any excuse is just that.
I think that the NYS handgun laws are idiotic and should be challenged in courts. Maybe this is a case that can make a change. I feel that second amendment rights are infringed upon by many counties stances on issuing permits to even possess a handgun without even carrying it. This person's right to his property is also at stake in that he can't bring it into NYS. And then there is the whole magazine capacity issue that makes little sense. I am thinking that within 10 years some of NYS's unfounded fear of handguns will erode a little and at least let people own them in their homes easier.

 

[eye5600]

QuietEarp: There are a lot of gaps in the story, e.g. what is the armory in question, but I do have a question. Do you know if active duty military would be allowed (by the Army) to have personal weapons on base? And if they were so allowed, how does that interact with NY state law? If the ultimate destination is a military facility, then it might be more like driving thru NY on your way from NJ to CT. In that case, it could be argued that the weapons were still in transit.

What got the police involved?

 

[skeptiq]

From what I understand (correct me if I am wrong) but if you stop there for the night even if you will be continuing your journey the next day, that place becomes your final destination. You are only "passing through" if you enter and leave without staying the night. I was told once it's important to make sure you know what the gun laws are for the place where you are spening the night on a multi day / night trip. Just food for thought!

 

[Zoogster]

From what I understand (correct me if I am wrong) but if you stop there for the night even if you will be continuing your journey the next day, that place becomes your final destination. You are only "passing through" if you enter and leave without staying the night. I was told once it's important to make sure you know what the gun laws are for the place where you are spening the night on a multi day / night trip. Just food for thought!

Not that simple. If you pull off the highway to sleep in a motel or even in the vehicle near the highway before continuing on your way the following day it is covered by the peaceable journey law.
Spending the night does not make it the destination.
If you travel out of the way to stay at a family or friend's house then it becomes much more questionable. If you stay there to visit especialy for multiple days then you are most certainly not covered.
Think of it this way, if you pull out a map and draw a straight line from your starting point to your destination did you deviate significantly more than required by the roads to stay somewhere? If so its probably your destination.

Further some states while held to the federal statute will not willingly follow it without a fight. New York is known to harass people protected by the peaceable journey statute who have handguns or "assault weapons" as defined by thier laws.

The statute only provides exemption to local law while transporting the firearms in the way the peaceable journey specifies.
That exemption also only exists if the state in question is not the destination, and the possession would have been legal at the destination. Since importing a handgun is not legal in New York without going through an FFL anyone with New York as thier destination is not covered by the peaceable journey law.

 

[QuietEarp]

I am not sure about military laws and protocol regarding the armory and personal firearms, I was just stating my understanding on how handguns can be brought into the state by new residents. I did find the original thread from November here http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=407086 The thread does get off topic. If someone was to somehow have a handgun in NYS that was not legal there I think it would be in their best interest to have said handgun locked up and hidden very securely. This incident sounds like there are some facts that are not clear and some state laws that were basically ignored and not very covertly. As many people stated in the original thread a good lawyer would be the best bet for resolution. I hope for a fair and just outcome for the people involved who did not seem to do anything morally wrong.

 

[p85]

I know the Watertown area well. Grew up there, got smart 15 years ago and moved south.
My 2 cents... accept the misdemeanor charge and chalk it all up to lifes learning experiences. It's your responsibility to know the laws of the states you enter. I wouldnt think of carrying any of my pistols back to NY. felony +10years in jail isnt my cup of tea.

 

[Dokkalfar]

Well i'd have to say hopefully they will challenge the NY laws and get them stricken down.

eye5600:

a shot was fired from another weapon around the area and when they came to Dicksons house he wouldn't answer.

so it sounds to me like they invaded his place without any good reason. just because no one answered the door. makes me wonder if they had a warrant to break into his residence to search for the discharged firearm. Also, being as how the pistol they confiscated was discovered without a warrant specifically for it, i thought it couldnt be used as evidence agaiinst him?

 

[eye5600]

sounds to me like they invaded his place without any good reason

I gotta believe there are facts we don't have. Even if some cop managed to stretch sleeping late into a "stand-off", it's hard to see the department sticking with it without some additional factor.

 

[Speedo66]

"The DA wanted an A Mis., but the judge lowered it to a C".

There are no C Mis. in NYS, only A and B.

If you say it was on the level of a speeding ticket, then it sounds like it was lowered to a violation, which is not a "crime" in NYS.

To go from a D Fel. to a violation would be highly unusual, if not illegal.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

did they go door to door and he was the only person not answering? something(s) is missing from the narrative

 

[winston smith]

Many years ago, a truck driver brought me a pistol with a broken spring he wanted fixed. He had no idea it was illegal in the People's Republic. I told him to get out of the state ASAP.

 

[beatcop]

The original post was beaten like a rented mule when it hit the board a while ago.

This one is par for the course, no facts.

Post the police report when the case is disposed of and we can discuss the merits of the entry.

I think we can all agree that NY laws stink, but there appears to be enough PC to maintain prosecution.

 

[Duke of Doubt]

Very shortly after 9/11, I was transporting dozens of personal firearms from State A to State B one evening. Said firearms were legal in both State A and State B. Accordingly, the Gun Owner's Protection Act of 1986 encompassed me and my transport. However, as sometimes happens, I got lost that evening.

I got lost, in lower Manhattan.

I got lost, in lower Manhattan, very shortly after 9/11.

I got lost, in lower Manhattan, very shortly after 9/11, carrying dozens of handguns, semi-automatic rifles, a gently demilled rocket launcher, a can of blackpowder, and assorted other interesting items including certain war relics and legally-held organic matter.

You best believe I prayed to Brother Martin and to Our Heavenly Father that I be spared getting a flat tire on that particular evening.

If they only knew ...

 

[wcwhitey]

"The DA wanted an A Mis., but the judge lowered it to a C".

There are no C Mis. in NYS, only A and B.

If you say it was on the level of a speeding ticket, then it sounds like it was lowered to a violation, which is not a "crime" in NYS.

To go from a D Fel. to a violation would be highly unusual, if not illegal."
Speedo66

You are correct in that there are no "C" Misdemeanors. Sounds like an offer of "Disorderly Conduct" a violation and not a crime. Only Felonies and Misdemeanors are crimes, has to be punishable of 1 year or more to be a crime. Anyway the "C" might be referring to a "C" summons or Criminal Court Summons written for violations of the Penal Law i.g. Discon, Loitering etc. The description is a little confusing but if I am correct in my assumptions the Judge is doing the right thing here.

 

[winston smith]

An felony in NY is rational behavior in any decent state.

 

[ar10]

"Disorderly Conduct"
That violation is very misleading in just about every state. There seems to be always some other charge added on to it. (Interference, trespassing, resisting, etc).

 

[mp510]

To go from a D Fel. to a violation would be highly unusual, if not illegal.

It happens, but like you said, it is very unusual. There was a Connecticut businessman, who was arrested for 3d criminal posession of a weapon (accidentally) trying to bring a loaded .32 through one of the NYC air ports. He eventually plead out to some violation class offense, likely disorderly conduct.

 

[Jpowers]

When I was in the Army, it was made very clear that you abide by local law. You don't have more rights, you are ruled by local and state statutes and also the UCMJ. So, no cool stuff like having unregistered pistols in NY, military personnel are in fact sanctioned more than citizens of the area.

As far as the search warrant, they wouldn't have probable cause in the first place. My only thought on this is that it was in Fort Drum. Whoever runs that hole may have just rolled over for LEOs when the shots were fired.

As some have said, there is no class C misdemeanor in NY. Lower than B is a violation and not a crime. I have studied a bit of law and have also lived in this stupid sate most of my life. My 2c

 

[X-Rap]

Glad to hear that the guy who had stored them is not going to do hard time. I'd still be worried about the one who brought them to the state. The armory they speak of is the units arms room. No firearms are allowed to be stored in the barracks but I think they can have them in the family housing but they must be registered. There is a provision for bringing a handgun on post if comming from overseas. I don't think it covers any move within the US.
Its still a shame that a person can wake up in a state that allowed you the freedoms to own what you want and drive across a border within your own country and get 10 to 20 for what means nothing at home. Especially when defending those same freedoms or lack thereof.

 

[BADUNAME27]

There's a few things here not adding up.

One if the coppers come banging on your door and you don't answer it how are they able to determine if:

1. no one is home (was this daylight hours or the dead of night?)
2. Your asleep.

When the SWAT team comes bulldozing through the front door and they see you in your skivvies with saggy eyes and a pee woody what then compels them to search the house? Where is the warrant? Is a warrant needed in this case? I don't know but it kinda sounds iffy to me.

Something is just not adding up here. There has to me more to the story.