CO to go way of AK, VT? re no CCW permit required

Status
Not open for further replies.
One, was a near perfect bill, the other was a really, really crummy CCW bill

SB24 isn't as crummy as previous CCW bills that have been bandied about before. Previous bills had a LOT MORE criminal safe zones. Eventually CSSA and others learned that they needed to play ball with RMGO and strike all the planned restrictions. Schools were added only because there was zero chance of passage without it.
 
Lonnie,
The CCW law they passed last year was worse than the one it replaced, except for reciprocity & having "Shall Issue" in front of it.

Scroll back up & click the link in my previous post. It's an analysis of the three CCW bills from last year.
 
Reciprocity and shall issue are pretty significant differences, though. The only negative difference the new law has made for me personally is that I can't go into K-12 schools. But I don't very often anyway. And if the teachers weren't willing to fight for their own right to carry, but instead came out opposed, what could we hope for from the governor?

On the positive side, there's preemption, which gives one a much stronger case for carrying at CU, where I did go almost every day for a few years.

Vermont style would be wonderful, but I'm not holding my breath, at least not this year.
 
Reciprocity and preemption far outweigh the elimination of K-12. My sheriff already was pretty much "shall issue", but one of his regulations for CCW was no carry in K-12 schools. We didn't lose a thing.
 
Owens would not sign without the K12 restriction, which is the one that I have a major problem with. My youngest daughter goes to school in Littleton, I used to be able to be armed when I was in her school for conferences, to pick her up, whatever. I don't think that the politicians realize the consequenses of their actions, it's just not thought through. As far as sheriffs go, mine is pro 2A, his wife is a teacher who taught both my daughters, they are family friends. The other side of it is the reciprocity and the de-fanging of Denver gun laws. I think that it's maybe two or three steps forward, and only one back. *disjointed thoughts..*
 
I'll make a couple posts before I go off to never-never-land...

"Schools were added only because there was zero chance of passage without it."

But we already had Sheriffs who "ponied-up" without any of the "no "school restrictions." We were making huge progress w/o this latest "safe school zone" legislation. It has been on the books for years, no problems with "us" killing our own kids - nada. & really, wherein lies the problems for a "certified good-guy" to ever carry a gun into a school, a post office, a grocery store, a whatever .... a licensed CCW_carrier, in CO, was also previuously licensed to ccary into any school - there were zero, zip, nada, problems, butthis latest legislation"fixed" that "problem."

BS!

Besides, the "current" law already stated that, if one had a CCW, they could legally carry within any school boundaries, & there has NEVER been any incident of any of "us" ever causing any harm whatsoever.

& I'm fully aware of this "school zone" thing, but really? *** has that got to do with legal-carryig/already proven-safe folks?

Just a question, & zero flames intended.

Addressing a "problem" that never existed in the first place, to allow a "political solution." Thanks for nothing.

Publicola,

Thanks.

"We didn't lose a thing."

Yes, you (we) did.

You lost your liberty to carry, as the constitution described, & to defend, & protect those absolute things your life is to describe! & nothing less.

If you cannot defend these absolutes, there's nothing I can say to you.

You either have the right to hold, to carry, & legally defend your own - or you don't.

Simple as that, my man.

AA
 
"The US and Colorado Constitutions ensure our right to keep and bear
arms, and in our modern society bearing arms for self-defense is best
envisioned by thinking of a woman with a revolver in her purse," said
Brophy, a first-term lawmaker from Eastern Colorado. "Alaska and
Vermont citizens aren't required to jump through the hoops and hurdles
of a bureaucratic and expensive permit system. Colorado legislators
need to trust citizens as much as Alaska legislators do."

Man, I wish I lived in America and had politicians like that representing me... :(
 
I read somewhere, maybe a blog, that there was slim chance of it passing and less of a chance of NRA/affliate support because if it passed it would trigger the anti's to even more action. :banghead:

Can't we just send the populace of Denver and Boulder to France? :scrutiny:
 
What a concept. Carry a weapon whenever and wherever you want to, just like the criminals get to! Do something illegal with it, go to jail. Sounds reasonable, which means a lotta people are gonna hem & haw. Should be a nationwide policy. Is there any way to get some kind of Ammendment which has "keep and bear arms" in it? Should've been done years ago if you ask me...
 
Labgrade, try not to be so pompous. "my man" ?? In my opinion, the folks in my county didn't lose a thing. If you'll read my post, my sheriff already forbad K-12 carry already. So, without the rhetoric, tell me specifically what did I lose? Those "rights" you speak of weren't ours to start with according to the law. They were privileges. ( Note that I said "according to the law." If you really believe in those rights, you'll know they are still mine (ours) whether the law recognizes them or not. We just pay consequences if caught exercising them.) If I felt a family member was in danger anywhere, I wouldn't let a law stop me from doing whatever I felt necessary.

I would rather have shall issue without the K-12 prohibition. Since it didn't happen that way, and we knew it wouldn't, I'd say we did well, especially compared to being subject to the whims of a new sheriff or chief of police every few years, and putting up with the "home rule" politicians that thought they could override state law at will.

The law we have is one of the least restrictive in the country so far as where we can carry. Note that I didn't condescend to you in my reply.
 
Org,

The only way you can view it as an equal exchange (i.e. not losing anything) is if you only look at a very narrow set of provisions.

Your sheriff imposed no carry in schools, so the new law didn't do any more damage to you. However other sheriffs did not impose such restrictions, so other Coloradans who had permits did lose something on that deal.

Also a sheriff could refuse to issue any permits under the old law, but a person was not limited to dealing with just that sheriff. You could shop around till you found a sheriff that would issue you a permit - or issue you a permit w/o school zone restrictions. The new law makes issuance mandatory, unless you can be hit with that "naked man" provision. That makes it in theory not much better than may issue, since the sheriff can still deny you a permit if he can dig up the right stuff on you. But your choice is now limited to the sheriff of your own county. No more shopping around.

Also there was at least one sheriff who was issuing permits for cost. Compare that $50 or so to the minimum $125 or so the new permit costs.

As a permit holder you're now listed in the CBI's criminal database (if the sheriff chooses to send the info in to them - & a lot of them have been).

The only thing really gained was reciprocity. & considering the price I really don't think it was worth it just to add "shall issue" on the title of a may issue law.

For more on the differences twixt the old law, the new law & the proposed but tabled law, I again refer you to this link .

& a few people here mentioned the preemption law. That was a seperate item. It passed around the same time as the CCW law but they two were not connected. So saying preemption is a good thing (which it is) isn't really relevant to a discussion of whether a CCW law was good or not.

Now getting back to the topic, I wrote a little somethin' somethin' about the proposed no permit required law & you can find it here

Short version is its coming to a comittee vote tuesday, So contact Rep Sinclair (who heads the comittee) & politely tell him to support the Colorado Freedom to Carry Act.

Here's his contact info

"Call Rep. Sinclair toll-free at 800-811-7647 (or
directly at 303-866-2965) and POLITELY urge him to live up to his
pledge
and support House Bill 1281. You can only call the toll-free number
during work hours (a live operator transfers you to Sinclair's office),
but you can call the direct line and leave a voice mail at any time.
You can also e-mail Rep. Sinclair at: [email protected] "


Call. There's some speculation that e-mail won't reach him in time (i.e. he's probably so swamped with e-mail that he won't wade through it till things slow down for him.)

But call. & call any & every firearm related orgs in Colorado & explain to them that unless they get off their tail & support this bill you'll withdraw all support from them. & mean it. Same applies to politicians - especially republicans.

It'll be an uphill fight, but we can either start making our way back up the hill or keep sliding to the bottom.
 
Preemption was actually included in both SB24 and SB25, one specifically for CCW, and the other for all gun laws.

While I don't like the naked man provision, I haven't heard of any sheriff abusing this language. It seems like somewhat of a non-issue.

As far as reciprocity, I've only left the state once since the new laws went into effect, and I went to Ohio. But I bet significantly more tourist dollars now come to CO than in the past, when out-of-staters couldn't carry. Of course with VT/AK style, even more people could carry here on vacation.

Don't get me wrong; I don't think the new law is perfect, but it's still better than almost anywhere else in America. I used to live in Denver, and it wasn't as easy as some would make it seem to get a permit from another jurisdiction. Besides Stratton, I don't know of any place that routinely issued to people from elsewhere. Heck, even lots of sheriffs wouldn't issue to residents of their own county unless they lived outside city limits. Certainly for people who already had permits, we lost K-12, but lots of people gained everywhere else.

BTW, even if your sheriff said you couldn't carry in K-12, this wasn't the law. If caught by someone who new that the issuing authority considered these schools off-limits, then your permit might have been revoked. But no charges would have been filed. The sheriff doesn't make the law.
 
Justice4all just made my points for me. I'd add that although the sheriff "can't make law", when I got my permit, I agreed to his rules.

All the arguments about how good the old law was ignore the fact: the old law DEPENDED on the whim of the sheriff. For cause or no cause, he could not issue or revoke.

My recollection on shopping for an issuer is different than some. The Stratton chief of police is the only one that springs to mind (there may have been another or two) and his office was either backlogged or not issueing at various times. You didn't just wander in and walk out with a permit.

For anyone fixated on the K-12 issue, what good is a state law saying you can carry in a school when your local law enforcer says you can't carry anywhere?

If anyone can show me a state with less restrictive CCW than ours, I'd like to hear of it. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but if so there are very few.

All that said, I'd like to see improvement....and there is room for improvement.
 
"The US and Colorado Constitutions ensure our right to keep and bear
arms, and in our modern society bearing arms for self-defense is best
envisioned by thinking of a woman with a revolver in her purse," said
Brophy, a first-term lawmaker from Eastern Colorado. "Alaska and
Vermont citizens aren't required to jump through the hoops and hurdles
of a bureaucratic and expensive permit system. Colorado legislators
need to trust citizens as much as Alaska legislators do."
Man, I wish I lived in America and had politicians like that representing me... :(
Ditto!
 
The latest from Dudley Brown, Director, RMGO

From : Dudley Brown <[email protected]>
Reply-To : <[email protected]>
Sent : Saturday, February 7, 2004 2:21 PM

Subject : Pass a Vermont law in Colorado: Call State Rep. Bill Sinclair today!

Friends of the Second Amendment,

This Tuesday, the House State Affairs Committee will hear HB1281, State
Rep. Greg Brophy's "Colorado Freedom to Carry Act." It's a
Vermont/Alaska concealed carry bill, and it is by FAR the most pro-gun
bill ever offered in Colorado.

Before Tuesday, we need everyone -- repeat, EVERYONE -- who cares
about our right to keep and bear arms to call a key member of the
committee.

State Rep. Bill Sinclair
http://www.state.co.us/gov_dir/leg_dir/house/members/hou16.htm is the chairman
of the State Affairs committee, and THE key vote to getting this bill to the House floor.

Representative Sinclair isn't running for his seat again, but he has
pledged -- in GOA's 2002 Candidate Survey -- to support a Vermont
concealed carry bill.

You see, Gun Owners of America and Rocky Mountain Gun Owners put out
candidate surveys every two years. We ask tough questions, not
softballs (asking politicians if they "Support the Second Amendment" is
the definition of a softball -- only the most rabid anti-gunners are
going to answer it negatively), and we keep those records on file
forever. One of the questions we always ask candidates is whether they
will support a Vermont law, allowing law-abiding citizens to carry
concealed without a permit.

Often, politicians need to be reminded that they've made a promise.
And, from what we gather, Rep. Sinclair is very likely to vote for this
good bill. Since he is the key vote, however, we do not think it wise
to leave it up to chance.

What you can do? Call Rep. Sinclair toll-free at 800-811-7647 (or
directly at 303-866-2965) and POLITELY urge him to live up to his pledge
and support House Bill 1281. You can only call the toll-free number
during work hours (a live operator transfers you to Sinclair's office),
but you can call the direct line and leave a voice mail at any time.

We want Rep. Sinclair to know that gun owners want real freedom, without
the burden and expense of a permit system. This bill is NOT being
supported by the institutional gun lobbies (who are usually AWOL when
strong pro-gun bills aren't watered down to include mild forms of gun
control), and so we can't expect them to help pass this legislation.
It's up to us!

You can also e-mail Rep. Sinclair at:

[email protected]

But please also make the phone call. Many legislators are so inundated
with e-mails that they ignore e-mails (how many people do you know who
send a daily e-mail that is cc'ed to every member of the legislature,
the Governor, the President, and Rush Limbaugh? I know DOZENS), or get
to them when they have little else to do. We can't expect that Rep.
Sinclair will get his messages before Tuesday's committee hearing.

If you're not sure about whether you want to pass this bill, please read
the following fact sheet.

---------------------------------------------------------------

House Bill 1281
The Colorado Freedom to Carry Act

Overview: While Colorado has recently passed a new law requiring
sheriffs to issue concealed handgun permits under certain conditions,
another state has taken a bolder approach to freedom. The Alaska
legislature passed, and their Governor signed, a law that keeps its
concealed handgun permit process in place but allows law-abiding
citizens to carry concealed without any hurdles.

As expected, the permitting process is extremely expensive. Virtually
every sheriff in Colorado charges the maximum $100 fee, plus $30.50 for
the CBI NICS check and statewide fingerprint check (some counties charge
more). Permit applicants must also pay for specific handgun training,
which ranges from $500 to $75, with the average being around $125. This
doesn't even consider the cost of the handgun itself and the holster to
hold it. All of this expense is merely to practice your rights to self
defense.

Why Colorado should pass this bill: Colorado citizens are as
trustworthy as Vermont's and Alaska's citizens. In Vermont, where their
"no permit" policy (actually, Vermont simply has the absence of a law
prohibiting the carrying of concealed handguns), the data is clear: at
the very least, it is not abused by the citizens, and it is arguable
that it makes Vermont a safer state.

What about training? The issue is not training versus no training. The
issue is private, voluntary training versus government certification and
control. The constitution recognizes the right to KEEP and BEAR arms.
There is no training required in the 2nd Amendment. Once government
controlled mandatory training is forced upon the right to bear arms, can
government controlled mandatory training for the right to keep arms be
far behind. The two go together.

Some concealed carry advocates buy into the argument of the anti-gunners
by advocating government-mandated training. They argue that if the
government doesn't certify or control your education, learning and
skills development, then what you've done on your own or through your
family doesn't count.

These are the same arguments used to attack home schooling and other
freedoms secured by our Founding Fathers in both state and federal
constitutions. And look at how well the government is teaching reading
in its own schools: illiteracy soars and respect for persons and
property (aka morality) declines.

Training and safety are intensely personal matters that must be based on
moral upbringing as well as individuals needs and circumstances. Given
that training and education is a personal and family matter that should
be left to those institutions rather than turned over to government, how
have private citizens performed? Are citizens incompetent?

Consider this report by nationally syndicated columnist George F. Will,
not considered pro-gun, in Newsweek on November 15, 1993:

"A nationwide study by Don Kates, the constitutional lawyer and
criminologist, found that only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved
an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The 'error
rate' for police, however was 11 percent, more than five times as high."

"Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck, using surveys and
other data, has determined that armed citizens defend their lives and
property over 1 million times a year. In 98 percent of these instances
the citizen merely [displays] the weapon or fires a warning shot. Only
in 2 percent of the cases do citizens actually shoot their assailants."

"In defending themselves with firearms, armed citizens kill 2,000 to
3,000 criminals each year, three times the number killed by police."

The point is all these people have acquired the skill and training to
successfully defend themselves without Big Brother Government breathing
down their necks and certifying their ability. Your right to have a gun
for self-defense should not depend on some government officials opinion
of your ability to handle a gun safely.

Over the last few decades private voluntary firearms training has
drastically reduced firearms accidents almost in half without government
involvement and control.

This bill does nothing to the existing permit system (passed in the 2003
Legislative Session), it's government-mandated training provision, nor
does it affect permit holders, now or in the future.

Summary of House Bill 1281:
. Gives only law-abiding citizens the ability to carry without a
permit
. Gives those citizens the same rights as permit holders in
Colorado
. Does not provide for reciprocity with other states
. Does not affect the 2003 concealed carry law
. Does not affect existing or future permit holders in any way


Is this bill Constitutional?

Article II Section 13 of the Colorado Constitution says "The right of no
person to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person and
property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned,
shall be called in question; but nothing herein contained shall be
construed to justify the practice of carrying concealed weapons."

Senate Bill 03-24 was a bill that "justified the practice of
carrying concealed weapons", and HB1281 seeks to do the same. If
HB1281 is unconstitutional, so is the existing concealed carry law passed in
the 2003 session. To argue that one statutory change is constitutional
but another is not is logically inconsistent.

--------------------------------------------------

Gun Owners of America has also put together a great sheet on why
Vermont-style Concealed Carry is smarter than a permit system.

http://www.gunowners.org/vtcarry.htm

Dudley Brown
Executive Director

Toll-free line 888-874-3006
Direct Office Line 970-842-3006
Mobile Phone 970-380-3006

------------------------------------------
Rocky Mountain Gun Owners
Colorado's Largest Gun Rights Organization
PO Box 3114
Denver, Colorado 80201
Phone & Fax (888) 874-3006
http://www.rmgo.org [email protected]
 
Rep. Sinclair's voicemail box seems to be full. I don't think I'd be too incorrect if I assumed it was because of people calling to urge him to support HB 1281.

The 800 number would be the best bet for those of you who haven't gotten in touch with him yet. Call between 9a.m. & 5p.m. & ask for Rep Sinclair. Odds are you'll be directed to another voice mail box, but leaving a message (If that one ain't full) is almost as good as chatting with him, as at the end of the day he'll know how many people have called & it probably won't take much math skill to total those is support v. those against the Freedom to Carry Act.

So on behalf of me & mine, I wanna thank all y'all who have already left a message & encourage everyone who hasn't to do so betwixt 9 & 5 tomorrow. & thank yourselves as well, cause we're doing this for our freedom, not just a select few's freedom.

& don't breath easy - if it does get passed out of comittee then we'll have to make calls urging our house members to support it, then if that works rinse & repeat for our senators.

But with enough support (i.e. Coloradans who remind their congresscritters that they want this law to pass) we might be able to pass this bill & join Vermont & Alaska in being a state whose citizens have the Right to carry - not to be confused with those states who allow their subjects to excercise a privilige.

Keep up the good work, & keep up the pressure.
 
First off.

org,

You're correct in my attitude towards you & I'm sorry for that. I do appologize. No call for being condescending, as you put it.

& I do agree that the current law is likely better for much of Colorado - the major cities - but can't for the major portions of the state. I did forget that even Sheriff Anderson/Colorado Springs - El Paso County had a restriction against CCW in schools, but a Publicola pointed out, it wasn't a violation of the law - "merely" a renig of your conditions on the issuance of the permit.

Not even being able to get one did not fly with many folks at the time.

I'd say we collectively took a step back & now have to regain what we did lose.

I was invited to an executive meeting with The Guv a couple years back - TRT days - & he told us flat out the reason he was the first to sign Amenment 22/gun show loophole initiative was that if "we" didn't give in there, the antis would try to eat us with even more restrictive stuff.

In essense, what he said, was they're gonna get it anyway, so why not support it. Nothing said from our side could convince him to stand on principle, use his bully pulpit to perhaps sway folksaway from the nonsense of it all - it passed 70/30% pretty much across the state.

Owens was also very big on removing the status quo allowance of CCW on K-12 school properties, as well as literally shooting down any CCW reform just after the Columbine incident - when a state-wide CCW bill (just as"good" as last passed) bill was all but certain to fly.

Good thing theh 'Pubs are in charge or we'd be up the crick. :rolleyes:

Again, org, sorry.

& BTW, The Mom's are pushing heavy for SB158, "a bill in the State Legislature which would require parents to store their guns safely away from children!"

Just a heads up.
 
It's dead in committee. A committee with 7 Repubs & 4 Dems who passed a bill onto the house a few weeks back about naming a specific rock our state rock couldn't gather enough intestinal fortitude to allow a vote on a bill about an individual's Rights.

I'll have more on this when I get over my disgust - or when I find someone who'll sel me a few barrels of tar & feathers wholesale.

Thanks again to everyone who tried calling Rep. Sinclair.
 
Are there transcripts or recordings of the committee meeting online anywhere?

Which members voted it down?


Also, I've been wondering, would it make any sense to ask a congressperson to propose a law that specifically says that open carry of a holstered firearm never constitutes any of the things people tend to get harassed about? It wouldn't stop the harassment, but perhaps the cops/DAs wouldn't bother if they knew they were that much less likely to get a conviction. Since he just proposed Alaska CCW, perhaps Brophy would go for something like that.

Does that make sense, or am I crazy?
 
Last edited:
labgrade, apology accepted. Here's one in return: I apologise for getting ruffled up. Generally I agree with your positions posted on the board. I guess I hadn't had my coffee or something.

Hopefully we can make some progress in the future toward elimination of restrictions on CCW and firearms in general. It appears New Hampshire is also considering going "Vermont". Maybe the momentum is building and by next year things will go better.
 
This from Dudley Brown, Executive Director, RMGO

Yesterday the Colorado Freedom to Carry Act, HB1281, was killed by
political maneuvering.

We'll detail the whole thing, but suffice it to say that what truly
killed the bill was a deal cut between the NRA and Republican Leadership
(at least in the House).

The House State Affairs Committee, where HB1281, is an 11-member group,
with 7 Republicans and 4 Democrats. What used to be considered a very
conservative committee has changed drastically, as you will see below.

Many of the usual suspects testified against the bill: Ron Sloan, who is
the Arvada Chief of Police (he actually cited Handgun Control Inc in the
hearing -- thanks, Chief Sloan, for keying us into your political
leanings) and who testified on behalf of the Chiefs of Police, the
County Sheriffs of Colorado and the Denver Police Department. Also
testifying against the bill was the head of the League of Women
Vipers...er, Voters, and the Colorado Coalition Against Domestic
Violence (apparently, their director thinks a piece of paper bearing the
letters "Restraining Order" are better protection to a frightened woman
than a Glock).

State Rep. Mike May boldly rebutted the claims of the anti-gunners, and
other pro-gun committee members joined in on the fun. RMGO Executive
Director Dudley Brown and a few other private citizens testified for the
bill.

Unfortunately for Colorado gun owners, one member of the committee is on
a trip to the Far East (Rob Fairbank), and one was sick (Shawn Mitchell,
someone who has routinely supported gun rights issues). While some
might claim shenanigans with the two absences, that is unlikely -- the
true shenanigans have yet to be revealed.

House Speaker Lola Spradley, who is already running for Governor,
appointed a replacement for Fairbank: State Rep. Bob Briggs, a
Republican from Arvada. That was a sure sign that things were going
wrong for HB1281. Briggs is well known as a big government, lefty
Republican.

Remember that State Rep. Bill Sinclair, the term-limited Committee Chair
from Colo. Springs, had signed a written pledge to support a Vermont
bill. And Rep. Sinclair told HB1281's sponsor, Greg Brophy (who did a
bang-up job presenting and defending the bill), that he would vote for
the bill.

But House Speaker Lola Spradley had a deal to live up to: there has been
growing talk, confirmed by many sources, that the NRA isn't pushing any
gun bills in Colorado because it is an election year and they don't want
to hurt Republican's reelection efforts, primarily those of the State
Senate.

We'll explore this issue fully in another e-mail. But we wanted proof
that this was the case, and so Rep. Brophy contacted Dave Gill, VP for
the Colorado State Shooting Association, to ask them if they were
supporting this bill.

Dave Gill's response was that CSSA "is not going to work on 1281 - I'd
support it next year." What this means, along with other evidence, is
that CSSA and the NRA agree that gun issues are harmful to Republicans
in an election. Once you've agreed to that proposition, you might as
well fold up shop and build a throne in the State Capitol to Tom Mauser
and Sarah Brady -- now they've got supposed "gun rights" leaders
believing their lies.

Back to the House Speaker: Lola Spradley was spotted talking to Rep.
Sinclair seconds before the committee hearing. The fix was in.

Rep. Sinclair voted with the solid members of the committee (Dave
Schultheis, Mike May, Kevin Lundberg, and Bill Cadman) to pass the bill,
but that failed on a 5-5 tie (Republican Bob Briggs voted with the Dems
against the bill). Usually, the Chairman would hold the bill over until
a member returned later in the week. Rep. Briggs then did the Speaker's
bidding and moved to "Postpone Indefinitely" the bill (i.e. kill it).

Briggs joined the Democrats, and rather than sticking to his guns, Rep.
Sinclair voted to PI the bill. In other words, he figured he could have
his cake and eat it, too. It's entirely too bad that Rep. Sinclair
isn't able to run for re-election, as we'd relish letting voters know of
his shell game.

That means Vermont/Alaska concealed carry is dead for yet another year.

In our next e-mail, we'll fully explore this deal cut between leadership
and the NRA/CSSA. In the meantime, stand by for more fireworks.

And, remember the above names: all politicians are ambitious. When the
Speaker begins her run for Governor in earnest, she may just find that
gun owners aren't so keen on these kind of political games.

Dudley Brown
Executive Director

Toll-free line 888-874-3006
Direct Office Line 970-842-3006
Mobile Phone 970-380-3006

------------------------------------------
Rocky Mountain Gun Owners
Colorado's Largest Gun Rights Organization
PO Box 3114
Denver, Colorado 80201
Phone & Fax (888) 874-3006
http://www.rmgo.org [email protected]
------------------------------------------

This message is from the Rocky Mountain Gun Owner's E-mail Alert
Network.
Direct any replies, comments, or concerns to [email protected]
To unsubscribe from this network, send an e-mail to
[email protected] with the following text body:
Unsubscribe RMGO
To subscribe to this free list, send an e-mail to
[email protected] with the following text body:
Subscribe RMGO
 
Vermonter here.

Vermont style would be wonderful, but I'm not holding my breath, at least not this year.
It is wonderful to be able to carry open or concealed and if you want a CCW for traveling outside Vermont, New Hampshire offers all 'law abiding' Vermonters a non-resident CCW without jumping thru any hoops.

As a side note: The NRA's rating of Dr. Dean is so much bull it would be laughable if it was not so serious an issue. While he was the gov he spear headed two laws to ban the carry of firearms (one for the city of Burlington and one for the capital, Montpelier). Both laws were passed and then voided by the Vermont Supreme Court.
 
"Yesterday the Colorado Freedom to Carry Act, HB1281, was killed by
political maneuvering.

We'll detail the whole thing, but suffice it to say that what truly
killed the bill was a deal cut between the NRA and Republican Leadership
(at least in the House).

The House State Affairs Committee, where HB1281, is an 11-member group,
with 7 Republicans and 4 Democrats. What used to be considered a very
conservative committee has changed drastically, as you will see below.

Many of the usual suspects testified against the bill: Ron Sloan, who is
the Arvada Chief of Police (he actually cited Handgun Control Inc in the
hearing -- thanks, Chief Sloan, for keying us into your political
leanings) and who testified on behalf of the Chiefs of Police, the
County Sheriffs of Colorado and the Denver Police Department. Also
testifying against the bill was the head of the League of Women
Vipers...er, Voters, and the Colorado Coalition Against Domestic
Violence (apparently, their director thinks a piece of paper bearing the
letters "Restraining Order" are better protection to a frightened woman
than a Glock).

State Rep. Mike May boldly rebutted the claims of the anti-gunners, and
other pro-gun committee members joined in on the fun. RMGO Executive
Director Dudley Brown and a few other private citizens testified for the
bill.

Unfortunately for Colorado gun owners, one member of the committee is on
a trip to the Far East (Rob Fairbank), and one was sick (Shawn Mitchell,
someone who has routinely supported gun rights issues). While some
might claim shenanigans with the two absences, that is unlikely -- the
true shenanigans have yet to be revealed.

House Speaker Lola Spradley, who is already running for Governor,
appointed a replacement for Fairbank: State Rep. Bob Briggs, a
Republican from Arvada. That was a sure sign that things were going
wrong for HB1281. Briggs is well known as a big government, lefty
Republican.

Remember that State Rep. Bill Sinclair, the term-limited Committee Chair
from Colo. Springs, had signed a written pledge to support a Vermont
bill. And Rep. Sinclair told HB1281's sponsor, Greg Brophy (who did a
bang-up job presenting and defending the bill), that he would vote for
the bill.

But House Speaker Lola Spradley had a deal to live up to: there has been
growing talk, confirmed by many sources, that the NRA isn't pushing any
gun bills in Colorado because it is an election year and they don't want
to hurt Republican's reelection efforts, primarily those of the State
Senate.

We'll explore this issue fully in another e-mail. But we wanted proof
that this was the case, and so Rep. Brophy contacted Dave Gill, VP for
the Colorado State Shooting Association, to ask them if they were
supporting this bill.

Dave Gill's response was that CSSA "is not going to work on 1281 - I'd
support it next year." What this means, along with other evidence, is
that CSSA and the NRA agree that gun issues are harmful to Republicans
in an election. Once you've agreed to that proposition, you might as
well fold up shop and build a throne in the State Capitol to Tom Mauser
and Sarah Brady -- now they've got supposed "gun rights" leaders
believing their lies.

Back to the House Speaker: Lola Spradley was spotted talking to Rep.
Sinclair seconds before the committee hearing. The fix was in.

Rep. Sinclair voted with the solid members of the committee (Dave
Schultheis, Mike May, Kevin Lundberg, and Bill Cadman) to pass the bill,
but that failed on a 5-5 tie (Republican Bob Briggs voted with the Dems
against the bill). Usually, the Chairman would hold the bill over until
a member returned later in the week. Rep. Briggs then did the Speaker's
bidding and moved to "Postpone Indefinitely" the bill (i.e. kill it).

Briggs joined the Democrats, and rather than sticking to his guns, Rep.
Sinclair voted to PI the bill. In other words, he figured he could have
his cake and eat it, too. It's entirely too bad that Rep. Sinclair
isn't able to run for re-election, as we'd relish letting voters know of
his shell game.

That means Vermont/Alaska concealed carry is dead for yet another year.

In our next e-mail, we'll fully explore this deal cut between leadership
and the NRA/CSSA. In the meantime, stand by for more fireworks.

And, remember the above names: all politicians are ambitious. When the
Speaker begins her run for Governor in earnest, she may just find that
gun owners aren't so keen on these kind of political games.

Dudley Brown
Executive Director"
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top