Colorado: "Columbine killer warning came 2 years before shootings"

[cuchulainn]

from the A.P. via the New York Daily News

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/breaking_news/story/131873p-117691c.html

Columbine killer warning came 2 years before shootings

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS


GOLDEN, Colo. — The two students who gunned down 12 schoolmates and a teacher at Columbine High bragged about making pipe bombs and said they were looking for a “ground zero†two years before the bloodbath — and authorities knew it, the sheriff said Wednesday.
Authorities have said they knew about violent rants by Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in 1998, a year before the shootings, and that a search warrant was not acted upon.

But Jefferson County Sheriff Ted Mink, who took office in July, said Wednesday that someone had called the sheriff’s office a year earlier, in 1997, to tip off authorities about a Web site run by Harris.

A deputy investigated the tip and forwarded a report and printouts from the Web site to a sheriff’s investigator in charge of computer-related crimes, Mink said.

The investigation of the Web site apparently stopped there, Mink said. The report was not found until last week, when a deputy came upon it as he was leafing through a training manual, the sheriff said.

On the Web site, Harris and Klebold described building pipe bombs from scratch.

“Now our only problem is to find the place that will be ‘ground zero,â€â€™ they say, according to the report.

Some families have been sharply critical of the sheriff’s office and Mink’s predecessor — Sheriff John Stone — for the handling of the Columbine investigation. They have accused authorities of ignoring or missing warning signs that Harris and Klebold planned to kill.

Sue Petrone, whose son, Daniel Rohrbough, was killed at Columbine, said she was astonished to see the year 1997 on the report.

“That’s another chance that someone had to keep my son alive,†she said.

Some details about the Web site were released in the months following the shootings, including nonspecific threats of violence and boasts about the teenagers’ ability to build pipe bombs.

Mink said he had asked Colorado Attorney General Ken Salazar to investigate why the 1997 report had not been included in the hundreds of pages of documents that were reviewed as part of the probe into the massacre.

“The obvious implication is that the sheriff’s office had some knowledge of the activities of Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in the years previous to the Columbine shootings,†Mink said. “It is difficult to believe this turn of events, and difficult to stand here and discuss them with you, but I feel it is the right thing to do.â€

Mink and Salazar met with families of the victims to discuss the report before it was released.

Originally published on October 29, 2003

 

[NIGHTWATCH]

What if....

the authorities acted on the warrant? :banghead:


Sheriff: Columbine Killers Bragged 2 Years Before
Wednesday, October 29, 2003
Associated Press


GOLDEN, Colo._—_The two students who gunned down 12 classmates and a teacher at_Columbine High School (search)_bragged about making pipe bombs and said they were looking for a "ground zero" two years before the bloodbath -- and authorities knew it, the sheriff said Wednesday.

Authorities have said they knew about violent rants by_Eric Harris (search)_and_Dylan Klebold (search)_in 1998, a year before the shootings, and that a search warrant was not acted upon.

But Jefferson county Sheriff Ted Mink, who took office in July, said Wednesday that someone had called the sheriff's office a year earlier, in 1997, to tip off authorities about a Web site run by Harris.

A deputy investigated the tip and forwarded a report and printouts from the Web site to a sheriff's investigator in charge of computer-related crimes, Mink said.

The investigation of the Web site apparently stopped there, Mink said. The report was not found until last week, when a deputy came upon it as he was leafing through a training manual, the sheriff said.

On the Web site, Harris and Klebold described building pipe bombs from scratch.

"Now our only problem is to find the place that will be `ground zero,"' they say, according to the report.

Some families have been sharply critical of the sheriff's office and Mink's predecessor -- Sheriff John Stone -- for the handling of the Columbine investigation. They have accused authorities of ignoring or missing warning signs that Harris and Klebold planned to kill.

Sue Petrone, whose son, Daniel Rohrbough, was killed at Columbine, said she was astonished to see the year 1997 on the report.


"That's another chance that someone had to keep my son alive," she said.

Some details about the Web site were released in the months following the shootings, including nonspecific threats of violence and boasts about the teenagers' ability to build pipe bombs.


Mink said he had asked Colorado Attorney General Ken Salazar to investigate why the 1997 report had not been included in the hundreds of pages of documents that were reviewed as part of the probe into the massacre.

"The obvious implication is that the sheriff's office had some knowledge of the activities of Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in the years previous to the Columbine shootings," Mink said. "It is difficult to believe this turn of events, and difficult to stand here and discuss them with you, but I feel it is the right thing to do."

Mink and Salazar met with families of the victims to discuss the report before it was released.

LINK http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,101595,00.html

 

[BigG]

I don't know if you can prosecute people for something they may do in the future. We have an imperfect system but it's better than all the rest.

Die Gedanken sind frei.

 

[TarpleyG]

There is no crime against thought, yet. However, they may have stopped these two but at what price???

GT

 

[Morgan]

The police can do nothing about "non-specific threats" and bragging of ability to build pipe bombs.

Parents can.

 

[TheeBadOne]

 

[grampster]

Tarpley,

What do you mean that there is no crime against thought? Have you not hear of anyone having been charged with or having charges upgraded because it was a "Hate Crime"?

In Michigan if I getted PO'd at you and cuff you about a bit and only grunt as I knock your teeth down yer throat, I am charged with Assault and Battery if I do it with my fists; a misdemeanor. If, instead of grunting, I verbally exclaim, "take this ******, or kike or queer" the A & B is elevated to "Hate Crime" and a felony. My language may be disgusting and reprehensible, but it was my fist that broke your mouth.

Thus your thoughts openly expressed are treated as a worse crime than the actual assault itself. If this is not criminalizing thoughts, then please explain what it is. I am at a loss to understand why my improper thoughts are considered worse than my improper deeds. "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me". Yeah, sure.

grampster

 

[Langenator]

Harris and Klebold had also, apparently on multiple occasions prior to their killing spree, made specific personal threats against one of their eventual victims, a fellow student by the name of Blair Brown, IIRC. Brown's parents had complained of the threats to police

The combination of the threats, the proclaimed ability to make bombs, plus the video of them shooting (IIRC, they showed it in one of their classes; at least one, possibly two illegally sawed off shotguns are visible in the video) should have been sufficient to get a warrant to search the homes of one of both of them.

Whether or not said search would have found anything I can't say.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I don't know if you can prosecute people for something they may do in the future. We have an imperfect system but it's better than all the rest.

I'll concur with that; I also believe, however, the two wannabe killers could have been dissuaded from murder, first by their parents, of course, and failing that, by teachers and law enforcement officers. It isn't necessary to throw people in jail to alter their perspective.

 

[TheeBadOne]

grampster

What do you mean that there is no crime against thought? Have you not hear of anyone having been charged with or having charges upgraded because it was a "Hate Crime"?

Yes, but there must first be an actual crime. The "hate crime" part of the law is an enhancement and does nothing by itself.

 

[Standing Wolf]

...bragged about making pipe bombs...

Too bad the B.A.T.F. was busy.

 

[vitiaz]

"fellow student by the name of Blair Brown"

I think his name is Brooks Brown(IMHO). Isn't Blair Brown an actress? The Browns have been on local talk radio pointing this out ever since Columbine. JeffCo Sheriff (& the School District) have been denying this ever since this happened.

 

[CGofMP]

I hadnot yet seen the video....

I searched it out on MSNBC.com and found an interview with some guy named Brooks and the father of a victim of the twisted brats that murdered the kids....

Dad of victim says there are many more videos (10?) that he is trying to get released.

I predict that we see a steady diet of newer and more twisted words from these two dead pariahs before the AWB sunset is voted on in 2004. The best will of course be held for last so as to make a sheeple stampeede to the phones to tell their congress-droids not to let the ban sunset.

It's gonna get dirtier.

Charles

 

[WvaBill]

should have been sufficient to get a warrant to search the homes of one of both of them

On one of the news updates about 9-930, the anchor stated a warrant had been issued, but not executed. Didn't say where the warrant was for or what was to be sought. Only heard it the one time.

 

[Hardtarget]

I thought building a pipe bomb is a crime, even if you don't detonate it. That would be enough to get a warrant on. Just as if I told someone I had a sawed off shotgun...even if it never left the house it still could get me arrested. I think several things have come to light that show "someone dropped the ball" on this whole event. On the other hand, none of us want to see the police start arresting people"just because". Real crime...actual criminal activity...thats what I like to see the police making arrests on. The main problem are the punks themselves.Next are the parents. Does anyone really believe they were totally clueless about what these guys were doing? My two sons had only been out of school a short time when this happened. It made me sick to my stomach when I thought how something like this would have affected me and my wife.
...sorry...I think I lost track of where I was going with this....
Mark.

 

[Tamara]

Merged duplicate threads...

 

[Jeff White]

I don't think anyone here wants to go down the road to proactive policing. We're getting this story in pieces, most likely for political purposes either to help pass renewal of the AWB or to influence a jury pool for another round of civil lawsuits.

Several years ago (long before Columbine) we had a scare in the community about a group of kids in the high school who were into the goth lifestyle. The complaints we recieved on these kids were unbelievable. It got so far that half of the people in town believed they were going to steal an infant and sacrfice the child in a Black Easter ritual. (I may be wrong about the name of the ritual, it was a long time ago, but it was to coincide with Easter) The juvenile officer and detective interviewed the kids, the city paid overtime for officers to shadow them around town when they were out and about. Parents gave consent to search a couple rooms. Nothing was found and the entire panic was over a bunch of hearsay.

Police departments nationwide get complaints about things like this all the time. How many resources do you spend on them? What would you have the police do. Lock up everyone who is accused as a preventative measure?

What about the website investigation. How many THR members should we lock up for all the SHTF threads or the not so well disguised threats of armed insurrection? Are you guys all ready to turn yourself in for protective incarceration?

You can't stop this kind of stuff from happening. There are bad, evil people in the world. It's quite possible good parenting may not have helped. I have seen kids grow up to be honor students and good as gold citizens from home environments that would make most of us cringe. And on the other hand I have seen people who have tried hard to be the best parents in the world raise kids who the best thing you could do for society is just quietly execute now, before you put everyone through a lot of trauma.

Columbine happened. I don't think anything but a very lucky break would have stopped it. It's an anomoly. It's not the norm for what's going on with our youth, no matter who's agenda it serves to say that it is.

It's time to move on. Learn what we can from it. Change our response methods. Try to make things easier for parents to do a better job with their kids....But we will never be able to predict this. It will happen again, maybe not in our country, but it's about time we stood up and accepted the fact that there are some people who are evil and they will do evil things.

Jeff

 

[WvaBill]

I don't think anyone here wants to go down the road to proactive policing.

I've got to agree with that. That's where these ridiculous zero tolerance Polcies come from. Isn't there a thread on this board about a student suspended for innocent drwings. Have any of you parents had to go to school because your child had nail clippers? I did. They wanted to suspend a first grader with no history of aggressive behaviors/speech.

Learn what we can from it.

IIRC Dylan, Klebold, or both were on some sort of probation/"diversion" program. IME, this would raise the level of awareness and seriousness of their activities to a higher level. In my County, a juvenile on probation must make reports to their JPO at least once a month and there are systems to identify possible escalation of behavirs. Doesn't mean that it would have been caught here, but does beg the question lets' find out how to catch it if, God forbid, there is a next time.

We're getting this story in pieces, most likely for political purposes

I agree. The former sheriff appears to have been trying to cover up some problems within the system. Mink is playing clean-up. A big problem when aparatchiks(sp?) serve the sysyem rather than people. IMO, public ed is the most blatant offender. When the initial post-shooting reports came out, I remember how I thought that the prior offense reports sounde too generic to have been the result o proper interviews.

How about someone making a true documentary, maybe "Surfing for Columbine" to learn, rather than blame?