Colt Combat Commander - I want to beat my head against the wall

[Texasbagman]

Been awhile since I've been on here, good to see some folks are still around.

The issues:

Colt Combat Commander XSE NIB

I bought a commander last year and had some issue with failures to feed and lock the slide back after last round. I didn't mess with it much as I was rather busy through the fall with work and hunting.

The failures to feed would happen with any mag I had. Be it Wilsons or factory Colt or SA mags. The round would be a high angle feed jam with the pick up rail catching the cartridge in the middle of the case instead of the base. It didn't matter what round it was in the mag, in other words, it might be the second, or the fifth or anywhere. This would cause a jammed up round that would also be damaged.

And it would also fail to lock back about 50% of the time.

I started looking at it recently. By hand cycling the slide I found I was not getting full travel of the slide. It seemed to bind up and not come back full against the frame. I found the factory recoil spring to be out of shape thus it was not all going up into the spring end plug. It came from the factory with a full length guide rod.

I replaced the factory recoil spring with a Wilson 20# spring. It then got full travel, but still seemed rough. I fired about 100 rounds like this and it never jammed...except on the last round. Same high angle FTF. And it would NEVER lock the slide back.

So I order an Ed Brown standard guide rod and plug and get a Wolf 18# recoil spring. Install all of it. Very smooth and getting full travel.

Same failures, only less and more. It now locks the slide back about 80% of the time, but FTF the last round about 90%. The pickup rail is still catching the cartridge in the middle.

So I'm thinking maybe mag springs are weak, even though my Warrior and Milspec are very reliable with these mags. So I buy a new Wilson 7 rounder. Now locks back almost 100% but is now stovepiping the last loaded round. Swear on my pups rotten head, the rim of the cartridge will be hanging on the feed lips and the bullet sticking out the ejection port pointing up like a nice middle finger.

:banghead:

Sorry for the long post, hopefully someone here can bail me out. I would hate to admit defeat and take it to a smith.

 

[Shootcraps]

I would call Colt and let them fix it under warranty.

 

[1911Tuner]

Colt Headache

Kudos Tex! You've already correctly diagnosed one of the more common and easily corrected problems...The Bolt-Over Base misfeed. Yours is a true rideover misfeed, and the weak magazine spring is the usual cause. An overly strong recoil spring is the next most common suspect...with limp gripping a
far distant third.

 

[GunDog44]

I had the same issue with a Para P12. Got alot of advice but to no avail.

My own opinion was: Considering the 45ACP has the same force on a standard slide, as it does on a shorter slide, the sorter slide will cycle faster and have a shorter travel. A standard mag spring tension is designed to feed a round at a rate fast enough for the standard slide to pick it up and feed it into the chamber, (cycle rate / timimg). When you go to a shorter slide travel, the timing of the round from the mag to the chamber is more critical, the mag spring must be strong enough to quickley move the round up into the slide, also compact 1911's have a stronger recoil spring to slow down the cycling rate enough for this operation to happen. So, the recoil spring and mag spring are the two areas of concern on micro's with feed problems.
If the mag spring is just a bit week, follower drags, dirty mag, less than perfect recoil spring - the timing is off and you get these issues.

I did get my Para running after I replaced all the above, polished the feed ramp / chamber. but after about 500 to 1,000 rounds it started again.
I gave up on the compacts out of fustration :banghead:

This is my opinion, and may not be the case with your issues, good luck !

 

[1911Tuner]

re:

Gundog wrote:

>...I replaced all the above, polished the feed ramp / chamber. but after about 500 to 1,000 rounds it started again. I gave up on the compacts out of fustration.<
************

I feel yer pain. The compacts can be a real pill...but the Commander-length pistols are generally pretty reliable, and any issues that do crop up usually respond...with sometimes just a bit more hair loss than the 5-inch guns.

Polishing feed ramps can often be detrimental...

The first thing to clear up is...Has the recoil spring been changed for a heavier number? That'll speed up the slide on the return to battery, and ride over the rim. If not, there's a 99.9% probability that it's the mag springs.
8-round magazines aren't known for the best reliability, especially on that critical last round...and especially with a slide shorter than 5 inches.

 

[Texasbagman]

Thanks for the replies folks.

I have replaced ALL of the factory recoil parts. I have a new standard guide rod and plug and a Wolff 18# recoil spring in place now.

I think Tuner is correct that mags are the main issue. The new Wilson 7 rounder spring feels weak to me. Just my opinion, but it appears that I'm right.

I will order some Tripp kits for my Wilson mags and I will order some Metalform mags with the flat, dimpled follower and see what happens.

 

[1911Tuner]

re:

Quote:

>I have a new standard guide rod and plug and a Wolff 18# recoil spring in place now.<
************

That there could be a clew!

Did you check it for coil bind when you installed it? That's important. If the spring goes into coil bind, it shortens the slide's travel...puts impact stresses on the spring plug and barrel bushing...and can damage both, and even the slide in some circumstances.

I've also found that the packaged Commander 18-pound spring are too heavy. The quick trick...and cheaper to boot...is to clip a standard 16-pound, 32-coil GM spring down to about 25 coils, and check for bind...trimming a half-coil off at a time until it binds no more. Most readily accept 24 or 24.5 coils. The gun will run smoother, and the magazine timing isn't as critical as it is with heavy recoil springs.

Note: Trimming the GM-length recoil springs won't work with Officer's Models, or in any Commander that has a reverse-plug recoil system.

 

[HSMITH]

The 16 pound spring advise is good advise, stock Commander springs from Colt also work well for me and as near as I can tell are 16 pound springs no matter what they tell me. The 16 pound spring lets me shoot faster and more accurately, felt recoil is down a little while a little sharper feeling.

Wolf +10 mag springs work well.

 

[Texasbagman]

Thanks for the replies folks.

I tried the Government model 16# spring cut down. It appears to have helped some, but not solved the problem.

It now will cycle through all seven rounds out of a metalform mag, but still will fail to lock back about 30% of the time.

With the Wilson and Kimber mags it still chokes on the last round a bunch by overriding it.

Funny thing is, the new spring guide appears as if it is new, after almost 300 rounds. Not a mark on it as if the slide isn't ever making it back all the way??? But when I hand cycle it is not binding.

Don't know if it matters, and I think should help, but I'm running it with a 20# hammer spring.

 

[1911Tuner]

re:

Tex wrote:

>It now will cycle through all seven rounds out of a metalform mag, but still will fail to lock back about 30% of the time.<
*************

The Metalform magazine....Does it have the proprietary Metalform spring?
The top coil will have a dogleg in it, with the open end pointing forward.
Those mag springs are fairly weak, and I can't figure why Metalform uses'em...but there it is.

If the mag spring is weak, it may not be lifting the slidestop lug fast enough to lock the slide. Try a Wolff 11-pound/7-round spring.

20 pounds is too light for the mainspring. 23 pounds is standard.

The unmarked guide flange...dunno. Could mean that the gun is short-stroking, which isn't likely...or it could mean that the other spring was too long, and going into coil bind...which means that the barrel bushing and spring plug were taking the hit. Check for damage on the bushing lug and its raceway in the slide. I've seen coil bind break slides adjacent to the raceway...Check for a crack with the slide locked to the rear against the recoil spring.

 

[Texasbagman]

Hey Tuner,

The bushing lug and raceway are fine. I'm getting full travel of the slide when I cycle by hand. I checked this by removing the spring plug and spring and marking where the slide stopped in relation to the slide stop. Then I reassembled with spring and plug and am getting the same travel.

It feels solid when the slide is all the way back, not like a binding it was originally doing with the factory parts.

Yes, the metalform mag is factory and has about 5000 rounds through it. I'll try the Wolff spring you recommended.

 

[Winger Ed.]

I want to put in a 2nd on the limp wrist thing.

I've had autos- mostly 1911's that worked perfectly for me.
Then let some else fire them,
and they can't get 2 shots out of 20 that don't fail to feed, or not to stovepipe.

I'd tinker with the gun until I thought I was going crazy,
until I watched them shoot and saw the pistol sort of jumping around in thier hand,
or they'd let the recoil move thier arms up and over their head.

Just gripping it tighter made the difference, and the gun was 'fixed'.

Not that this is your problem, but it may be worth considering/checking.

.

 

[HSMITH]

I have a recent production NRM Commander that will perform 100% with just two fingers on the handle sideways, upside down. Anything you want to do it runs and runs 100%, I would accept nothing less, I vote to put limp wrist at the botom of the list of possible causes. Limp wrist to me is a vauge excuse for a gun that just doesn't run right.

 

[1911Tuner]

Limpy

HSMITH...+1. While I will concede that there are some few pistols that will
produce a malfunction when gripped wrong, I'll go on record and say that if this is the case, that there's something else wrong, and the limp grip is the proverbial straw. I have a small 14 year-old stepdaughter who has small hands. She necessarily grips my 1911-pattern pistols necessarily low on the frames, and she hasn't experienced a short-stroke malfunction...or any other type, for that matter...when firing attenuated ammunition (200 grains/750fps) with standard springs (16 recoil/23 main) with the small-radius firing pin stops in any of my pistols...be it 5-inch or Commander-length.

 

[sm]

I must be the only idiot that runs a bone stock firearm, be it 1911 or otherwise.

I bought a NIB Steel Combat Commander in '73, and from the get-go it fed , extracted, and ran with 230 hardball, Flying Ashtrays, 200 gr SWC and whatever else we had at the time with Colt 7 round mags.

It did this with two fingers, (strong and weak hand) port up, port down, upside down and even upside down shooting back over my head as I was on the ground.

Brought it home, took apart, cleaned factory lube out, lubed with Browning Gun Oil in a Tin can, and went out to shoot it. Not one hiccup!

I'm doing something wrong obviously....

 

[1911Tuner]

Steve's Commander

Steve wrote:

>I'm doing something wrong obviously....<
**********

Of course you did. You need to immediately send it off for a mirror-like ramp and throat job, and buy a few trick, 8-shot gamerzines...and you too can join the ranks of semi-satisfied 1911 owner/shooters who accept a 2% malfunction rate as the price paid for shooting an obsolete pistol that was designed a century ago.



Sorry...Irresistable impulse.

 

[sm]

> Drift
I miss that gun terribly so. It was my HS grad gift to myself.
I took the good natured razzing from mentors about buying a Steel Combat Commander instead of a blue one
Some Mentors also bought one like mine.

That gun and other guns, along with business mdse stolen in a business safe when the safe was stolen.

It had a set of Ivory Stocks given to me on it at the time. Sentimental to me...
Always figured it ended up getting butchered and it still makes me sad and angry.

It ran from the get-go. Just like all the bone stock 1911s. I only do full size and Commander size.
I may change stocks, and in the old old days sometimes swapped out Mspg housing to have/ remove laynard, but Stock is how I run 'em.
Oh and for "just because" - use a fired case for recoil plug.

You can launch these and not worry about having to find them.
I dunno, we used to have fun launching these and seeing who could launch into a coffee can or something.

Brass cases launch further than nickel ones from my experiences and observations... *smirk*

>back on topic now<