Compact Assault Rifle

[Evil Monkey]

What was the first ever compact assault rifle to be used by armed forces?

I'm trying to go as far back as possible and I keep thinking XM177, which I believe is a 10" barrel m16. As far as I know, the Soviets never made a short AK until the AKSU74 and that was many years after the M16 family was created.

So is the XM177 the first compact assault rifle (not carbine) to be developed or was there another one earlier?

 

[Dr. Dickie]

Without having a true clue, first I think you need to define the difference between an assult rifle, and a sub machine gun.
Since a select fire weapon with a short barrel would not be a rifle but a sub machine gun to me.
Not trying to stir the pot, just genuinely curious!

 

[bthest86]

There was the little monster of a gun called the T26 which was an M1 with a cut down barrel and folding stock.

Then there was the M14K (below) and M14E1.

 

[Evil Monkey]

Without having a true clue, first I think you need to define the difference between an assult rifle, and a sub machine gun.
Since a select fire weapon with a short barrel would not be a rifle but a sub machine gun to me.

Well a compact assault rifle may have a very short barrel, but it doesn't mean it's a SMG. A SMG is a shoulder fired, select-fire, weapon that fires a pistol cartridge. A CAR is a shoulder fired, select-fire, weapon that fires a rifle cartridge.

 

[HorseSoldier]

So is the XM177 the first compact assault rifle (not carbine) to be developed or was there another one earlier?

I'd tend to consider the XM177 to be a carbine. Its lineal descendant, the M4, is counted as such. Semantics in any case.

I think the XM177 is the first weapon of the type you are describing to be fielded. At least it is the first I can think of off the top of my head.

 

[foghornl]

The M2 Carbine...full-auto (selective-fire) version of the M1 Carbine????

 

[Manedwolf]

I would think it'd be the German WWII 7.92x33mm Sturmgewehr 44? Compare it in size, here, to the .30 Carbine just below it. Many consider this to be the first modern "assault rifle". This was, I believe, first fielded in 1942!

 

[RNB65]

Got to be the STG 44 though I don't think it was ever issued in large numbers.

 

[Evil Monkey]

I know the STG44 was the first true assault rifle but what was the first ever COMPACT assault rifle?

So far the XM177 is holding the title as the first.

 

[kfranz]

M1 carbine in para configuration

 

[dfaugh]

It depends....

on your definition of "assault rifle"....Mainly the cartridge it fires. And the line is VERY blurry. Personally, and this is MY opinion, and its simply that----an opinion, the first was actually the SKS...STG-44 and M1 carbine fired what were essentially pistol rounds. SKS fired an "intermediate" rifle round, with considerably more punch.... YMMV

 

[HorseSoldier]

the first was actually the SKS...STG-44 and M1 carbine fired what were essentially pistol rounds. SKS fired an "intermediate" rifle round, with considerably more punch.... YMMV

I don't know that 7.62x39mm has a lot going on that 7.92x33mm did not have going on. Going by Tony Williams website (see here) the M43 7.62mm round only has 100 joules (74 ft-lbs) of muzzle energy over the 7.92 Kurz round (both are superior to both 5.56mm NATO and 5.45mm M74). The metric description of the rounds aside, the two throw very similar weight and diameter bullets downrange, the Kurz a little heavier and slower, the M43 a little lighter and faster, but both have arcing trajectories and both probably deliver about the same thump on the receiving end.

 

[Outlaws]

I dont know exactly which was the first, but I think the Thompson was the first one to make a real impact on the battle field.

Though I would call that a SMG more than an "assault rifle".