comparing handgun ammo

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SHusky57

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I was looking at ballistics for Speer Gold Dots and when you compare pistol calibers together it seems they have more in common than in difference.

In other words, how much of a factor does ammunition speed or diameter make? What is more important in a defensive load, bullet weight, velocity, or is total energy the most important factor? On paper, a 124 gr 9mm +P round is generating the same muzzle energy as a 230 gr .45 ACP round.... so is there any difference in their efficiency as a defensive cartridge? With the .45, you are getting an extra .1" of diameter and an extra 100 gr bullet weight, but with the 9mm you are getting an extra 200 fps of velocity?

For those of you that hunt, especially with handgun calibers, what do you find to be the most useful? Or is this just a never-ending debate?

I will agree shot placement is important, but I've heard stories about guys being hit with a 9mm in the head, not feeling it (maybe due to PCP) and shooting the other guy dead with a .45. Granted, this is why the SAS developed the double-tap but I'm just really curious if beyond movies and urban legends there is any appreciable difference between handgun calibers.
 
Muzzle energy is kind of an overrated statistic. Momentum I believe relates much more directly to knockdown power. This is where the .45 shines. Go out somewhere and shoot a moveable object with a 9mm and with a 45 and see the difference.

There was a thread on here about a guy in a CCW class where the 9mm guys were outshooting the 45 guys. Then the instructor threw out some heavy rubber blocks and the 9's vs the 45's ahd to get the block across a line. The 9mm guys couldnt even move the block.
 
On paper, a 124 gr 9mm +P round is generating the same muzzle energy as a 230 gr .45 ACP round.... so is there any difference in their efficiency as a defensive cartridge?
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Wife CCW a 9mm with DOUBLETAP ammo and I use a .45ACP with DOUBLETAP ammo. I'd trade her guns in a heartbeat and not feel the outcome will be different at all. Shot PLACEMENT is King.
For those of you that hunt, especially with handgun calibers, what do you find to be the most useful?
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MATCH the size of the game to the gun. .22 class weapons for wabbit size critters -- .357 magnum class weapons for deers size critters --.44 magnum class weapons on up for progressively larger game such as Elk on up, etc. The LOAD being used makes a significant difference.
I will agree shot placement is important, but I've heard stories about guys being hit with a 9mm in the head, not feeling it (maybe due to PCP) and shooting the other guy dead with a .45. ... I'm just really curious if beyond movies and urban legends there is any appreciable difference between handgun calibers.
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"Stories" abound, I "heard" of a BG taking 6 .45ACP Golden Sabers in the back and still ran 2 city blocks -- I "heard" of a guy taking 5 COM hits from a .357 magnum and still kept going and going --Take these stories with a grain of salt. BOTTOM LINE: Use the right self defense load with proper bullet PLACEMENT and the caliber generally does not make that much difference in the outcome.
 
I believe it is a never ending debate.

I'll admit I don't hunt, but I have noticed there is a big difference between the bullets marketed for personal protection and those marketed for hunting.

Nearly every personal protection round is a hollow point. Nearly every hunting round is basically a heavy-for-caliber, semi-wadcutter, with a wide flat nose.
 
The only reason I'm wondering is I have 9mm's and .45s.

For logistics, it's nice to keep it to 2 calibers.

.357 Sig and .40 look interesting.... and since 9mm, .40, and .357 sig guns all tend to be built on the same size frames.... I was wondering if there would be any advantage to getting a .40 or .357 rather than the 9mm.
 
.357 Sig and .40 look interesting.... and since 9mm, .40, and .357 sig guns all tend to be built on the same size frames.... I was wondering if there would be any advantage to getting a .40 or .357 rather than the 9mm.
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The most important thing is shot placement, but either the .40 or the 357 Sig have superior balistic performance when compared with the 9mm. If the .40 or 357 is built on the same frame as the 9mm you want then I would pick the .40 or the 357 Sig.
 
Are you in the market for some Oceanfront property? I have some available in South Dakota.
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I'm not fibbing. These stories come from cops and soldiers who have been to the sandbox. I'm sorry that your paper targets never shoot back or take PCP, but sometimes being able to stop the threat ASAP is highly advantageous when they have the ability to shoot back.

In this particular story, he was shot through the jaw, and combined with adrenaline and possibly drugs he claimed to never even feel it.
PCP turns people into supermen.

The guy that shot him is now dead. The guy that got shot in the face with a 9mm shot back with a .45.

I've heard stories from cops where people on PCP will have both their legs broken and keep running and fighting.

I know on paper you think all your headshots would be instant kills, but in reality I've heard a lot of instances where 9mm has failed. Especially consider if you were actually getting shot at and needed the BG to go down ASAP. Yes, a CNS hit would achieve that but that's a really small area on a target that is moving and firing back.

Everyone I know in the sandbox would rather have a .45. I know you all say "but modern JHP's fix that".... Box of truth anyone? They don't always expand, and even then.... a 9mm hitting a bone is going to act a lot different than a .45 hitting a bone.

It seems like most people who have been into combat prefer calibers that start with .4 for handguns and .3 for rifles.
But there are those British SAS guys who claim that hi-powers on 9mm run just fine for IRA terrorists.... but the Hi-power has the quickest double-tap of any handgun I have ever shot; and putting a 3 shot burst from an MP5 probably helps too.

I guess I have talked myself into the .45.

I'm taking my 45 to my IPSC match tonight, so we will see if I can shoot is as accurately at speed as a 9mm.

I understand that software is the most important, but why not give yourself every advantage out there?
 
Hey, SHusky57 you were saying there's only .1 diff tween
.45 and 9mm. bzzz, calculate surface area of the bores.

If you do the math pi X radius squared
and calc. for .451 and use that as 100%
the .401 bullets approx. 79% the surface
area of a .451 bullet. The 9mm/.355 dia.
bullet is approx. 62% the surface area of .451
bullets.

Of course shot placement is #1, but
I'm in the Momentum Camp, with a quality
HD/SD bullet.

YlogicMV

Randall
 
No one knows, but honestly you're undergunned with anything less than a 12 ga shotgun. I personally won't hold a strong opinion on the subject until several agreeing peer-reviewed scientific papers are published on the matter, which probably won't ever happen.
 
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