Concealed Carry at a Party?

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Back in 70s my Mom used to hang out with the uppercrust in South America. At that time everyone who could afford it carried a weapon. You were a fool to travel without one as the roads were crawling with bandits, communist guerillas, and government soldiers. All pieces of scum in their own right.

From her stories and others I have heard, in that part of the world when there is a house party it is the responsibility of the host to provide a secure place for the revelers to leave their hardware for the duration of the evenings festivities. Generally laid out on the bed in the locked master bedroom or in a locked coat closet.

Sounds like a civilized custom we in America would do well to emulate.
 
I think what he was asking is ...what do you do when trouble comes out of nowhere? ...And , how do you keep your weapon concealed in a wrestling match? My answer is, keep your cool and try to avoid a fight if you can, if you cant, fight to win, but only with your fists and/or feet...and about your weapon falling out in a scuffle, well, I carry a Beretta 96 Vertec in a SmartCarry and train mules and horses ( bucking and sometimes falling off too) and have been bounced, thrown, flipped and about everything else you can imagine and my weapon has NEVER came out of the holster. Just my 2 cents worth.
 
great question..every now and then one comes along!!

What I have learnt:

1. consider carefully how you will party- formal,pool,dancing, function etc as this determines how you carry and your holster setup.

I had a friend who was unexpectedly called upon by the DJ to dance at a company function. Having his CCW in an open top IWB caused him some concern about the weapon being exposed or even falling out but he knew he had to do something- didn't want to be called a party pooper.

quick thinking on his part, he called for a partner and decided to do a waltz being sure also to trap the partner's hand so it wouldn't encounter the gun in the waist..


2. always have an extra layer of clothing over the weapon.. reduces the distinct shape and the first layer of clothing has a tendency to blow up.


3. The best position is usually the appendix posn. given bumps, snatches, hugs etc.

4. Be careful of alcohol.. it will impair your judgement and cannot be difficult to defend against.

5. for pool parties, ensure the area is secured and it is a controlled crowd as you are going to have to use off-body carry. In Jamaica, if you leave your gun in your car and it is stolen, you could be charged for negligence and aiding and abetting..
 
Blackcat,

My suggestion to you is to learn to avoid such conflicts. If you find yourself getting in fights at parties on a regular basis, you're doing something wrong.

If you're thinking about getting a CHL, leave your ego at home.

Most state laws clearly state that you have a duty to try and deescalate a conflict before resorting to deadly force. Just get into the habbit of avoiding fights and learning how to keep situations calm now.

I do carry at times when I'm at a party, but I don't drink very much when doing so. The one situation where I actually would have been justified drawing my gun was at a party, and my gun was 40 feet away in my car on the other side of the guy who had pulled a knife on my friend.

That friend happens to be an air marshall, and he managed the situation quite well without my help. He quickly backpedaled, kept his hands in the clear, and talked the drunken idiot that pulled the knife down. Fifteen minutes later they were sitting off to the side of the group chatting.

My friend was armed. He would have been justified in pulling his gun and shooting the idiot. He was however capable and confident enough to be able to handle the situation without resorting to violence, and to realize that the guy was drunk and stupid, but wasn't actually a real threat.
 
I'm in no position to give advice on this matter, living as I do in an "enlightened" state where not only is there no CCW, but ANY carry is a felony. However, I can state what is everywhere the legal test that should be applied if something -anything- "goes down."

What would a reasonable person do?

In this case, and without going on at more length, would a reasonable person carry a gun into a party where they thought there was a significant possibility of a fight or other violent confrontation? And, as someone else pointed out, what happens if you carry into such a party and you end up dropping the hammer is going to be seen as your responsibility alone, and you will only be exonerated if it is demonstrated that you used that gun in an actual life-threatening situation.
 
*yawn* This thread isn't dead yet?

This "significant possibility of something going down" varies greatly you know. It can all hinge on one moron showing up where they shouldn't.

what happens if you carry into such a party and you end up dropping the hammer is going to be seen as your responsibility alone
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Really?

Although, if you're justified to pop someone out on the street in certain situations it's just as legal to do the same outside of your friend's house.
 
I know a guy who was involved in a really bad incident at a party a couple of weeks ago.

From what I heard, a girl started a fight with the one guy. I'm not sure exactly what happened next, but his friend stepped outside to call someone. He (the friend) was then assaulted by a bunch of people with a golf club and a brick, hitting him only in the head and face no less. After they beat him unconcious they stuck him in the first guys car, which they had already broken the windows out of, and drove it off the property and parked it in the woods somewhere. They left him there to die. Luckily somebody reported this and the paramedics arrived before he bled to death.

What would a reasonable person do?
 
I know a guy who was involved in a really bad incident at a party a couple of weeks ago.

From what I heard, a girl started a fight with the one guy. I'm not sure exactly what happened next, but his friend stepped outside to call someone. He (the friend) was then assaulted by a bunch of people with a golf club and a brick, hitting him only in the head and face no less. After they beat him unconcious they stuck him in the first guys car, which they had already broken the windows out of, and drove it off the property and parked it in the woods somewhere. They left him there to die. Luckily somebody reported this and the paramedics arrived before he bled to death.

What would a reasonable person do?
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As previously suggested -- associate with a more civilized group of people.
 
This whole question, the whole issue of what to do with a pistol when a possible fist fight is about to take place is, in my opinion, based upon raw immaturity and inexperience with carrying guns. The reason I say this is because if you go back and reread the very first post, well if you reread this part anyhow, you will see that the thread starter asks:

What do you do with your weapon when someone, or some people want to fight? Drama tends to happen more often that not, usually for little or no reason. Provoked or not stuff happens and it happens fast. I'm thinking stash it in your car if you get a chance before anything happens. I don't want to risk being on the ground, or having my shirt pulled up on me, displaying my pistol. That would invite someone to grab it (big NO! NO!) or get their own I assume. Of course this could be a double edged sword as fights sometimes turn real ugly and then your gun is who knows where, in your car, and you can only hope to make it there if you need it.
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So what BlackCat is asking us at least in that first thread, is essentially, as I see it: When the trouble makers show up, and we are pretty sure trouble is about to erupt, what should we do with our guns – should we stash em in the car AND THEN GO BACK IN AND KICK SOME BUTT? Did the rest of you miss that last part. Don’t you see he seemingly wants to be in on the fight, at least from what I can make of his post anyhow. I mean why would you go out to the car, stash the gun, then go back inside - where you expected trouble - and then find yourself on the ground? I am figuring because he wanted to be in on the fight. Just in case you missed that sentiment in the above quote, here it is by itself:

I don't want to risk being on the ground, or having my shirt pulled up on me, displaying my pistol. That would invite someone to grab it (big NO! NO!) or get their own I assume.
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These words came after the part about storing it in your car once you have realized that trouble was about to start. The best way to avoid all of that would be by avoidance - LEAVE or just don't go to such parties in the first place. People who keep going to such so called socail events, that are really great places and great excuses to fight, only breed more of them that attract miscreants. Find other people at these events who truly don't like the fights, and go to parties with them. make sure only to invite good people, who can keep their mouths shut about the event. Do not invite trouble makers directly or indirectly.

If you cannot avoid someone, if it is an on the street thing and someone jumps you unexpectedly that is very different from you going to a party where you expect troublemakers to show up, or where they show up and you then have time to anticipate trouble. On the street when you are jumped unexpectedly and have to fight while armed, you need your pistol in a secure holster; one that has at least one or two retention features. You also need to know how to retain your firearms. You also need to know if you are jumped by 4 or 5 guys that you should be running, escaping, at the first chance. If you cannot run, and if five guys are beating you, you had better quickly assess the situation to see if it is one that threatens serious bodily injury or death. If those are the case, you may well be justified to start shooting to protect yourself (this depends heavily upon state law and upon the particular confrontation). Even if you need to shoot, you may need to get away from your assailants a bit so as to make certain they will not get your firearm. Then if you are far enough away and you can run, run for your life. If they persist, and they are still an immediate threat of serious bodily harm or death, you may have to shoot to stay alive.

Yet, the best thing to do would be to get away. If you want to call that being 'Sally' (is that a 21st century reference to being a sissy?) I guess you can call it that and decide to stay there and have the poop kicked out of you. That would be, in my opinion, foolish, immature and out and out stupid if you actually had a chance to escape. Five to one are great odds for the movies and for actors, not for lone people who get jumped. That guy usually winds up being referred to as the victim. If you decide to stay toe to toe and duke it out, or if you decide to let 5 guys bring you to ground and kick you senseless, fine for you mr. macho - you are in my opinion - less than smart. Get away, call the police, let them handle it if at all possible.

Take the advice of others, avoid such situations as best you can. Otherwise, if you absolutely have to, defend yourself as best you can under the law. Also bear in mind, if you are under the influence of alcoho or drugs you are breaking the law in most places if you are carrying a firearm.

Best regards,
Glenn B
 
get a pocket pistol. a 22 in the hand is better than a .44 in the safe. and no chance of un-concealment by someone else.
 
As previously suggested -- associate with a more civilized group of people.
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Noted.

However, if I had been present at the situation where the guy was beaten within an inch of his life by a group of savages I definately would've had to fire at least one round. If they were lucky it would be a warning shot. :mad:

I'm very glad I wasn't there, and I don't carry a pistol. I do have access to a long gun at any given moment though.
 
a "reasonable person" would call the police as soon as trouble erupts.

a "smart person" doesnt willingly put themselves in positions where they KNOW that there is a good chance trouble will break out.
 
i disagree with some of what's been said. i say never leaver your gun in your car - i've seen too many cars broken into outside of parties. DON'T START FIGHTS, if someone insults you, absorb it, ignore it and drive on. we're not in high school anymore (most of us) and we don't fight because someone dissed us. we fight to protect ourselves or others. my friends and i host many parties, all of us are gun owners and we have agreed that if someone is getting beligerant, they go, no matter who's "friend" they are. it's real simple: one of us notices the bad behavior, we round up the others (we're almost always at the eachother's parties) and we kinda hold council. we may decide to immediately remove someone, or we might pull them aside and talk to them - that usually works. i've even seen my friend escort someone out at bayonet point when he was younger. that sort of thing works and is justified in my state, but not necessary. i've been to strange parties before where i didn't know many people, but still with a couple of good friends and a pistol. i avoid a fight and keep an eye on the exits. you go to a party to have fun, not fight. and if other people's idea of fun is fighting let 'em beat the snot out of eachother, but don't get involved.
 
I'll share a story... one of the frats at my school had a campus wide (all students invited) party, in my four years here I haven't heard of a single fight at a party, but a couple locals that knew someone that knew someone else showed up and when it was time to wrap up the party they refused to leave. After some yelling, one of the locals grabbed one of the frat brothers and put him in a choke hold while the other pulled a knife and put it to another brother's neck. The locals were at a clear disadvantage number-wise but with a knife they evened it up and no one could do anything. So one of the brothers goes to his room where he had a handgun locked up, from what I heard it had a trigger lock and was in a locked box that was in a locked case or something like that, he goes outside with it hidden. He yells at the locals to leave, then the one with the knife begins advancing. The brother with the gun pulls it and fires a shot into the air, the two locals run off. The police show up and tell the brother he should have shot the guy with the knife and didn't even cite him for discharging a firearm in the city (near downtown Flint, MI).

So, I'll play devil's advocate and say that in this case it's a good thing someone did have a gun. The frat brothers do not drink until everyone else goes home so the guy with the gun was sober.

As a side note, our school President caught wind of the incident and had the brother kicked out of the frat house because there's a national no-guns-in-the-frat-house rule. I hate that guy.
 
thats whats called an 'anectdote'.
an obscure instance where being armed was the right thing to do. what one cannot do however, is think that by citing such an incident it gives one an affirmable defense after shooting some drunk at a party that you choose to go to, knowing full well that bad things do happen there.
 
Glenn Bartley --

You raise an interesting point. I did over look that, but you are entirely correct. If you know there's trouble brewing, rather than going outside to stash the gun in the car -- go outside and just leave.
 
These parties sound like the boondockers I went to in High School. Y'all know, bunch of folks out in the desert with big trucks and kegs and a bonfire and lots of fights.

BlackCat, if you HAVE to be armed at such a function, carry OC. Worst thing that could happen is that you spray the wrong guy. A whoopin' ain't as bad has meeting your new cellmate (for life), "Cupcake." :what:
 
How old are you BlackCat and where do you live that is so dangerous? Your questions seem really silly and thank god you don't carry. I do applaud all the other posters on this thread, your smart answers and comments make me feel much better about the kind of mentality that is into guns and does carry. The frat brother story I don't know about, firing a weapon in the air will not get praise from law enforcement in most cases, so I don't know why it did in this case? In any case, we shouldn't have to be telling someone that wants or hopes to carry to avoid beatdown parties, if an assult took place at the last party someone should have dialed 911 and not wondered where he should keep his gun when he joins the action. :banghead:
 
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