Confrontation with a mountain biker

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Here in San Diego, the NRA sponsers an annual cleanup of all the shooting areas in the Cleveland National Forest. They provide soda and water, you provide the labor. Might be a good idea to do a similar thing at your range.
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I would add that any cleanup you do, be sure to get full brownie points for it by letting the "powers that be" know you did this. Who oversees the land -- Rangers, BLM? Invite them to your cleanup day. If they don't come, mail them a positive, upbeat letter with photos of your cleanup day. Be sure the "top dog" gets a copy.

Attend their public functions. Be the one who shows up smiling and supportive of them, and make the greens look like the PITAs they are. Volunteer for them if they have any other functions going on. Get to know the real decision makers, and befriend them...invite them to come out & shoot with you!

Oh, and on your cleanup day, bring donuts -- I am serious, you will get tons of people turning up.

I shoot at an outdoor public range in Northern CA (near SF), very near mtn bike and hiking trails. We are very very cautious to make good friends with the regional parks directors. And we win out whenever the greens start to whine about our shooting.
 
Let's be considerate here.

When shooting on public land the key word here is "Public".

If I was riding a bicycle and heard shooting I'd be leary of riding anywhere around. When you hear shot, you don't know if the shooters are practicing safe habits or not.

How many stories are there on here about idiots at ranges. When people, whether they be morons or tyros get unsupervised access to a place to shoot they often show less than proper consideration and dicipline.

Try assuring the mountain bikers (or whoever else) that you are being as safe as possible. DOn't get confrontational, invite tehm to look at how you are set up. And don't wear a gun in the open. It's intimidating to people wheather you mean it to be or not. Doesn't help your cause.

Smoke
 
And don't wear a gun in the open. It's intimidating to people wheather you mean it to be or not. Doesn't help your cause.
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Well, shooting in public seems to be intimidating too -- maybe everybody should just leave their guns in the safe.

Sigh.
 
i've been to an informal range where in between shots i heard hooting and hollering. turns out some snow shoers were hiking in the valley we were shooting into. idiots! their path was right right on the other side of trees we had targets set up on.

no sane person would go hiking or biking or whatever anywhere that would take them through the line of fire of a shooting range, formal or not.
 
Well, shooting in public seems to be intimidating too -- maybe everybody should just leave their guns in the safe.
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Hmmm...maybe I phrased that wrong. What I was implying was: in confronting the mountain biker who was already concerned with shooting, and you are trying to convince to come check out you range...then you should not be openly carrying.

Without getting into the whole open/concealed debate...I don't care if you walk down mainstreet with an openly carried weapon.

Smoke
 
Shameless Plug

If this happens in Colorado, invite him to the next Bike-N-Shoot, which combines a mountain bike race with a shooting competition.
 
If /when I go to public ranges, I bring in my targets. I always take extra trash with me when I leave. I make very sure of the backstop and announce loudly before shooting starts. Last time I got a similar confrontation, I listened...then reasoned...listened a little more. Then I locked in a full mag and told him to get his ears on...this is gonna' get loud. Talk time was over. :D
Mark.
 
Quote:
("BTW, mountain bikers are about the only non hunter group devoted to open land access anymore. Horseback riders are the worst.")

Not quite. It's all about lumping in inconsiderate folks with those who use common sense. I used to ride in Coconino National Forest near Flagstaff. Some a** was out there educating his son in poor gun safety and I was nearly killed--they weren't using a backdrop, they were shooting at cans on a large stump. Their trajectory intersected the trail at a 45-degree angle, headed my way.

Luckily my horse was bombproof. I, however, am not. I'm loathe to humiliate a parent in front of his child, but this dad learned a few safety lessons the hard way, in true ticked-off, crazy red-headed woman fashion. I hope his son was paying attention.

And yes, this forest was littered with bullet-ridden cars, appliances and garbage. Though I liked to plink with my friend's Beretta and my own .22, I developed a very big "most gun people suck" mentality on the basis of jerks like those I personally encountered. I got over that.

And it is necessary for some trails to be restricted to foot or horse traffic only, when mountain bikers (and I'm one of them, too) come silently barreling down narrow singletrack, where there's nothing but dirt wall on one side and steep embankment on the other. I've seen many a pedestrian hurt him/herself ducking for cover, and more than one horse injured.

BTW. Many of my equestrian friends organized regular trail cleanups, or volunteered on search/rescue teams, and raised funds for trail improvements/access. I never saw any notice in any local papers about NRA or rifle club-sponsored cleanup days, or I would have participated.
 
Selvagee;
I'm late to this thread. Couple of questions. I live in Monument as well and last time I checked all of the National Forest off Mt Herman in El Paso CO was closed to shooting. According to the Forest Service website you needed to go all the way to Rampart Road to get to anyplace where it was ok to shoot. I know there are several places people shoot up there, but I don't know anyplace that's legal. Don't know what you drive but 15 minutes up Mt Herman doesn't get me anywhere near Rampart. It's been a little while since I last checked but I hadn't heard the rules have changed. Have I got this wrong?

Thanks,
Steve
 
BTW, mountain bikers are about the only non hunter group devoted to open land access anymore.
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Well, rock climbers are, too. Actually I think Access Fund a great solution to a lot of "access" problems.

Earlier this year, the Mrs. and I went snowshoeing with a guide. The place we went to was a big state park and also happens to be, apparently, one of the best places to snowmobile in CA -- and probably one of the only places left open to them. The whole time we were snowshoeing, our guide who was an otherwise great guy, kept ranting about how he hated snowmobiles and that he & his buddies were going to lobby the park board to keep them out.

I didn't say anything because I was having a nice time, but this attitude is bullspit. What he was saying in essence was that he wanted the wilderness to himself for the activities he liked doing.

Check out this story for more examples of "green-on-green" conflict :p
 
Here in San Diego, the NRA sponsers an annual cleanup of all the shooting areas in the Cleveland National Forest. They provide soda and water, you provide the labor. Might be a good idea to do a similar thing at your range.
Click to expand...

Do you have more info on where those shooting areas are and any idea of the dates of these cleanups?
 
Steve -

Thanks for the reply I had previously checked the NF website for Pike NF and didn't see the notice you are talking about, just the standard rules for shooting in the NF. There is a sign at the forest boundary that says no shooting next 4 miles; the area I was at is a whisker under 5 miles from there so I think I was OK. If you have a link PM me please.

thanks
 
This is from the Forest service site:
http://www.fs.fed.us/r2/psicc/pp/faq.shtml

Q40. Can I do recreational shooting on Mt. Herman Road?



A. Although recreational shooting is generally permitted in the National Forest there are exceptions and conditions. The exceptions are normally outlined in Special Orders. In this case, Special Order 91-08 prohibits recreation/target shooting in all of El Paso County including the area west of Monument. You can obtain a map from us that shows you exactly where these restrictions apply. The best alternative area for recreation/target shooting west of Monument is off Mt. Herman Road and down Forest Development Road (FDR) 322A. This area is located in Teller County approximately six miles from Red Rocks Ranch Road. The other common sense conditions are as follows: (1) you cannot discharge a firearm in or within 150 yards of a residence, building, campsite, developed recreation site or occupied area (2) you cannot discharge a firearm across or on a Forest Development road or a body of water adjacent thereto, or in any manner or place whereby any person or property is exposed to injury or damage as a result in such discharge (3) you cannot discharge a firearm into or within any cave. I would also advise you to familiarize yourself with Colorado State law regarding possessing and transporting firearms.


I have looked for FDR 322A and found it, but none of what I find is anywhere near Teller CO.

Steve
 
Steve - Interesting link. This is the area where I was (down FR322A north of Mt Herman Rd) - you're right this is nowhere near Teller Co :confused:

It is not posted no-shooting like most of the areas further east along Mt Herman.
 
Yea, I've actually shot there a few times myself. It always seems like a pretty safe place, and there really isn't that much trash around. Unless you cross Rampart Rd you're still in El Paso and 322 doesn't cross on my maps. Last time I tried to go there one spot in the road was a bit too tough for my pretend 4x4(Mazda Tribute) so I kind of wrote it off. I guess a call to the Forest Service would be the smart thing to do.

Steve
 
The biggest threat to the ability of responsible people to continute to use public lands are rude and inconsiderate people in our midst. Whether it be the shooter who refuses to use a backstop, or a dirt-bike rider with a 110db exhaust, or hikers who leave trash around their camp sites. All of these people encourage the caretakers of the land to close it off. What other option do they have if the admittance of these people on the land causes them problems?

We need to talk to these rubes in a calm and rational manner, but we also need to be firm that their actions will not be tolerated. It is not someone else's job, it's all of our jobs.

Most people are just ignorant of certain things and welcome some good information from someone who is patient and interested in helping them do things properly. Unfortunately, some people are selfish and have too much pride for their own good. These people generally need to be taught a lesson. Neither is a task that we should stray from even though we avoid violent confrontations when possible. Sometimes it's just not possible.
 
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