Cross eye dominance, help a guy out

[jon_in_wv]

In an isosceles stance you are holding the gun neutrally in the middle. Moving it unnaturally right or left screws up your stance when you can just turn your head about 5 degrees to the right to accomplish the same thing and keep your stance stable. Honestly moving the gun over to the left means you have to aim it back to the right to keep your POA so it just doesn't work that way anyhow unless you are using a weaver stance in which case you are just moving the weapon further around to your left which is just like moving your head anyhow. Its hard to explain but I don't believe in changing a good solid stance over simply learning to adjust the position of your eyes to the weapon. You need to learn to do that anyhow for situations where you may have to hold the weapon in a less than perfect stance like in a defensive situation. If the answer is to just move the gun to your left what if you have to shoot something to your right?

 

[waktasz]

You might think you're holding it in the middle but you aren't. If you're right eye dominant the gun is in front of your right eye.

I'll have to post a video or some photos so you can see what I mean. You are over thinking it.

 

[waktasz]

Here's a good example of what I mean for a right eyed shooter. For a left eyed shooter just move the whole gun to the left a bit. Telling me you won't be able to do that in a defensive situation but then saying to tilt your head unnaturally instead doesn't make any sense.

 

[Cycletroll]

Lasix

 

[EnglishmanInArizona]

I take it you are a pistol shooter.

Don't tilt the weapon and don't tilt your head - both are extremely hard to replicate consistently. Your body seeks vertical automatically.

Holding one eye closed introduces tension and measurably reduces visual acuity in the open eye. To be honest, when you are shooting with both eyes open you are probably already shooting left eyed. No big deal. If you want to be sure, cover your right eye (a piece of card folded around the safety glasses will work) whilst practicing. Leave both eyes open.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

shoot left handed if you have a left master eye and right handed if you have a right master eye. this is the simplest and most effective way to deal with handedness issues.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Don't worry if you need to squit or temporarily close one eye. We all should practice shooting with either of our hands. I can envision where being able to shoot with either hand will be more important than which eye. May have to hold you child, may be shot in one arm, may need to slice the pie around a corner and using your weak hand to hold the gun may be the one that exposes less of your body. Thus, worry less about the eye and more about being able to shoot equally well with either hand.

 

[waktasz]

You guys are hopeless.

 

[jon_in_wv]

You might think you're holding it in the middle but you aren't. If you're right eye dominant the gun is in front of your right eye.

Agreed. Here is what I'm saying, covering you dominant eye, tilting the gun, changing your stance, etc....are all hardware solutions to a software problem. When you determine your dominant eye you point at something across the room. You finger instinctively aligns with you dominant eye. If you point you weapon without using your sights it naturally does the same thing. If I draw my weapon, point it at something across the room, and close my left eye I'll be looking down the side of my weapon, if I close my right eye my left eye is looking down the sights. With both eyes open I see the side of the weapon and my sights giving me a double sight picture. You need to train you brain to focus with the left eye instead of the right. By turning your head slightly to the left (NOT tilting it unnaturally) it helps me to focus on the sights with my left eye rather than being confused by my right. Over time, and with practice you no longer have to adjust your head. You can draw and point instinctively and still see your sights focusing with your left eye. I don't think you need to adjust your hands, your stance, or your weapon because it is the software problem behind your weapon that needs the adjustment. Now I have no problems no matter how I hold the weapon or whether I use a weaver stance, isosceles, bullseye, or whatever. You can call it unnatural to train your eye to align the sights to match where you naturally pointed the weapon but whatever you use that works for you is what works for you. I only argue that in a defensive situation you may not be able to control how you are holding your weapon so correcting the double image regardless of how your hold the weapon is the ultimate goal.

Here's a good example of what I mean for a right eyed shooter. For a left eyed shooter just move the whole gun to the left a bit. Telling me you won't be able to do that in a defensive situation but then saying to tilt your head unnaturally instead doesn't make any sense.

I'm also agreeing with you. The weapon should already be instinctively aligned with your left eye. Moving it further left is pointless. I'm only suggesting a way to help cross eye dominant shooters train themselves to focus with their dominant eye. Also notice I never suggesting "tilting" your head, only turning it slightly to the right and even that is only a temporary necessity until you begin focusing with your left eye as you should.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

I see two pages of discussion for a three word fix.

 

[jon_in_wv]

Do tell


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[Droid noob]

I'm left handed / left eye dominant. For some reason, I shoot pistols with the right hand. I've tried switching to the left, but it just doesn't feel right.

I looked in the mirror while aiming and it appears i tilt my head AND move the gun towards the center of my body. This is a product of always shooting with both eyes open. I've never shot pistol with non dominant eye closed though. I suppose if I was shooting for distance, i would close one eye.

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[Andrew Wyatt]

I'm "Cross Dominant", and for about ten years i shot pistols right handed and rifles left handed. I shot slow and couldn't make hits, and despite lots of diligent practice, i wasn't getting any better. Recoil was more pronounced because of the technique i used, and pistolshooting was work and i disliked it.

I took a class with Andy Stanford, and he did two things for me that improved my shooting immensely. He made me shoot left handed, and he showed me how to shoot with the modern isoceles grip.

I shoot better, and faster, and the body mechanics for shooting long arms and handguns translate over much better.

TL;DR

I used to shoot handguns right handed and it sucked.

 

[dprice3844444]

i think mpi makes stocks for that

 

[BillB204]

Agree with using tape

A common way for shotgunners to deal with this (since they can't twist their head because that would take their cheek off the stock) is to place a strip of mainly-clear tape over the lens of their shooting glasses on the dominant side, FORCING them to use the eye behind the gun

I have both a cross eye dominance and a slight lazy eye. The lazy eye causes my left eye to drift upward slightly when I relax my eyes which is what happens when you aim with one eye. (Causes slight double vision). I use one set of glasses for pistol shooting and another for rifle shooting. When shooting pistols, my glasses have a small strip of translucent tape over my right eye. When shooting rifles, the tape is over my left eye.

This blurs out the vision in my non-aiming eye and allows me to keep both eyes wide open while shooting which eliminates the fatigue of keeping one eye closed and also allows light into both eyes (which I read somewhere is important).

 

[jon_in_wv]

'm "Cross Dominant", and for about ten years i shot pistols right handed and rifles left handed. I shot slow and couldn't make hits, and despite lots of diligent practice, i wasn't getting any better. Recoil was more pronounced because of the technique i used, and pistolshooting was work and i disliked it.

I took a class with Andy Stanford, and he did two things for me that improved my shooting immensely. He made me shoot left handed, and he showed me how to shoot with the modern isoceles grip.

I shoot better, and faster, and the body mechanics for shooting long arms and handguns translate over much better.

TL;DR

I used to shoot handguns right handed and it sucked.

That was a three word answer? I'm glad that worked for you but I still think the answer is in your eyes, not your stance or which hand you shoot from. In a defensive situation you may have to shoot left or right handed, a "modern isosceles" stance may not be possible, I still think what you are saying is a hardware answer to a software problem. I can shoot weaver, isosceles, right handed, left handed, roll over prone, or any other shooting position with no issue at all with a pistol. I find it a lot easier to learn to see the sights rather than switching to my weak hand or relying on a particular stance to shoot well.

Andrew, I would suggest that getting some instruction, learning a proper grip, etc...did more to improve your shooting than simply shooting left handed to overcome your cross eye dominance. I used to shoot better left handed until I overcame my left eye dominance. Now I shoot better with my natural strong hand, but I still shoot well with my left.

 

[Rustle in the bushes]

so....as a rifle shooter/shotgun shooter the best ive read is to tape an eye at the range, and in the field close the other eye?


What are the detriments to just closing my non-dominant eye? I reaaally dont want to have to learn to shoot left handed.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

Rustle: the detriments to shooting long arms with your non dominant hand are several fold.

1. if you close one eye, or put tape on your shooting glasses, you will lose the benefits of binocular vision while shooting. this includes a loss of precise depth perception, a loss of situational awareness, and a significant decrease in your ability to resolve objects.

2. if you use the tape on your shooting glasses method, you now have to wear that pair of shooting glasses to shoot.


shooting left hand allows you to keep both eyes open and not require special equipment just to hit things.

 

[PRM]

Close your left I. With practice you can shoot well with either eye. I've seen some shooters that keep both eyes open - just always been easier for me to close one or the other.

We teach strong-hand and weak-hand shooting at our Academy when using barricades (left side - left hand - left eye...) Developing that skill allows you to shoot from both left and right sides of cover with minimal exposure. All of our advanced courses incorporate strong/weak hand shooting as well as movement and transition drills.

 

[Sam1911]

Pistols -- shoot with your right hand, but with your left eye. You've likely been doing it all along without even realizing it. Most people do.

Long-guns -- it is much harder to fight to try to change your eye dominance than it is to teach yourself to operate the rifle or shotgun swap-shouldered. Let your body work the way it wants to. Put the butt into your left shoulder and let your dominant eye do the (BETTER) job that it wants to do, rather than hindering you GOOD eye (taping your glasses or whatever) so you can push your body to work opposite of how it is telling you it should.

This will give you all the benefits of natural sight picture, both-eyes-open field of view and balance, and your clearer eye's vision capacity.

Retraining yourself to fire a long-gun left-handed is really no big deal and you will be a better shooter overall for having made the effort.

 

[jon_in_wv]

I think I'm going to start training my self to shoot lefty with a rifle. If nothing else I'll make myself a better shooter with my off hand.

 

[Sam1911]

And usually a much better wingshooter as well, if you're into the shotgun games.

 

[jon_in_wv]

BTW, you can compound my cross eye dominance with the fact my vision in my left eye is 20/25 while my vision in my right eye is 20/40. Closing my left eye would force me to give up most of my visual acuity. I don't shoot well with only my right eye. I had given up on shooting a rifle with open sights but I think I'll give it another try lefty to see how it works out. Thanks.

 

[wkumatt]

I'm continuing in the exact same quest friend.

I've recently noticed that optics make a huge difference for me. With my lower end optics I can't leave my dominant eye open while sighting with my weak eye and strong hand, with my nicer (redfield) scopes I can shoot with both eyes open from either hand. I still occasionally get double vision while shooting right handed/eyed but I've found I can blink for a few seconds and get the correct sight picture back.

I still have to close an eye for iron sights. Which leaves my weak eye very tired very quickly.

Best of luck in your continued quest.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

What benefit does right handed shooting bring you that is worth all the trouble you're going to?