***, I appreciate the opportunity you've given me to respond to these allegations. I will include the e-mails that I have received from this "disgruntled" customer. First let me say that we are a manufacturing company of custom and original style gunstocks. We manufacture semi-finished gunstocks and also have a custom shop where we fit, finish and checker gunstocks. We guarrantee our stocks for replacement or refund. However, as with any other company in business today, we are trying to make money. We don't do that by providing a stock to a customer and taking it back after they have altered it to the point that it is no longer useable. It is the customers resposibility to check the stock upon receipt to insure that there is no shipping damage, it is the right stock for the application and that the stock was correctly machined to his satisfaction before starting to work. If any of these things are a problem, we will replace or refund at the customers discretion. If a stock has been worked on and the customer wants to return it for replacement or refund, it is then at our discretion and we must have the opportunity to inspect the stock. When a customer sends an e-mail stating that we "screwed up his stock" and wants a refund but is not going to return the stock, its like a Roy Mercer phone call. I am supposed to take his word for the fact and just send money or he will hold my company hostage. I am sorry but I cannot believe any reasonable human being would expect that. We make semi-finished stocks, they are just that. A gunstock that is machined, shaped and inletted, to approximately 95% completion. The customer then has the option of inletting, sanding and finishing himself, having a competent gunsmith do it or sending the barreled action to us. This customer is an self proclaimed amature gunbuilder that should have practiced his skills before starting on such an expensive peice of wood. Few of us recognize our limitations before we make the attempt. At this point, given the circumstances, my company will not issue a refund for the gunstock.
E-mail #1
> Henry:
>
> I'm using your email address in the event one of your employees received
> the other two I sent to the "Sales@gunstocks" address and failed to pass
> them on. I do know, however, that you responded to an email sent by a
> friend of mine to that address.
>
> Since I wrote you last I contacted the owner of a custom stock-making and
> stock repair company. He, Bill, was kind enough to give me his advice -
> he confirmed that the only way to repair off-center holes was to bore them
> oversize and either install pillars or plug the holes and redrill them.
> If I did remove too much wood from the inside of the right action wall
> before I recognized the problem with the screw holes I will have to glass
> bed the action. Bill said I should anyway if I install pillars.
> Aesthetically I don't like the look of the crescent remains of dowels half
> drilled out - it looks like a cheap repair. I did not tell Bill who sold
> me the stock.
>
> Henry, If I don't hear from you I will surmise you don't intend to
> compensate me for your mistake. That would be unfortunate for us both as
> I assure you, you will lose far more in reputation and sales. It's not
> simply the money; it's the principle - I hate being taken advantage of and
> I won't let this rest until I believe some form of parity has been
> achieved.
>
> A prompt reply would be appreciated.
>
> Mark
>
> Henry:
>
> My name is Mark *****. I bought a Gary Goudy Classic in #1 English
> Walnut for a pre-64 Winchester, Shilen #5 barrel. I told you when I
> called for a progress report that shortly after I placed my order I came
> across a number of negative posts about your business and was concerned
> about what I might get. When I received the stock I was delighted with
> the wood and called you to say so. As I told you I would, I went to the
> sites where I found the complaints against you and reported my positive
> experience. I got a couple of replies from professional gun makers on one
> site who were glad to hear you were still turning out nice work.
>
> I started inletting the action this morning and realized pretty quickly
> that with the exception of the recoil lug I was removing material almost
> exclusively from the right side of the stock - I thought at first that was
> because the right side was thicker, as I found in measuring for a butt
> plate, and thought the problem was with the rough inletting. As work
> progressed, it just didn't look right. I realized that the action was
> canted slightly and discovered that the rearmost screw hole was off center
> to the right by 85 to 90 thousandths - almost a tenth of an inch. As a
> result, the rough inletting on the left side around the tang area would
> have a big gap even without removing any additional wood. I put my
> inletting screws in the front and middle action holes and sighted through
> the rear action hole and saw the hole in the stock is out of line with the
> forward most and center holes by half the screw thickness.
>
> I am furious that you or your employees did not get even this most basic
> aspect of roughing out a stock correct, especially after spending two days
> cleaning up gouges left by the shaper. I don't think there is enough wood
> remaining on the right side to achieve a correct fit if I plug and redrill
> the rear hole or bore it out and install a pillar or a sleeve. This is
> absolutely NOT something I should have to do to a stock I paid $600 for in
> very rough form.
>
> I am not going to jump through hoops to try to return the stock or argue
> with you about why the stock is the way it is. I need to get this rifle
> done. I am going to try to repair the hole and live with the results even
> if I have to glass the action in to fill the gaps. My time to repair and
> attempt to mask your error and the resulting gaps, along with the hassle
> factor of trying to sell a less than perfect high grade rifle, is worth
> $250. Send me a check for $250 and I will consider us even and the matter
> closed. If I do not receive this partial refund by Friday, November 21st,
> I will be a sorely aggrieved customer and I will publicize this as widely
> and as relentlessly as I am able as a service and a warning to anyone else
> contemplating doing business with Great American Gunstocks. There should
> be no doubt in your mind I am a man of my word and will honor my
> commitment fully to either of the options you choose.
>
> My address is as follows:
>
> Mark *****
> [address redacted]
>
> A paper copy of this letter will follow by post Monday morning in the
> event you don't check your email regularly.
>
> Sincerely,
> Mark *****
>
>
>
> Henry:
>
> I found in determining the truest center for the top length of the stock
> that the forward hole was also off to the right of center, although not as
> much as was the rear hole.
>
> I drilled out the front and rear action holes to plug them and in the
> process I determined what probably went wrong on your end. The holes on
> the underside of the stock were correctly positioned in the rough
> inletting but missed the top center to the right. I suspect either the
> stock was canted when the bottom was drilled or the inletting on the top
> and bottom are not square. Next, the stock was drilled from the top down.
> Whoever did that wallowed out laterally oblong conical holes - maybe
> searching for the correct angle. I put the stock on my vertical mill and
> used a pilot to find the center of the top and bottom holes at the
> external surfaces to within a couple of thousandths. When I drilled
> through using a .250 bit I found there was a dogleg where the two holes
> met inside the stock and I had to use a larger drill (.285) to straighten
> the holes to take the dowels.
>
> Predictably, when I started trying to finish the inletting yesterday, the
> inletting screws aligned with the bottom half of the holes as they were
> the tightest part.
>
> Mark
E-mail #2
> Henry,
>
> You made your choice. **** you.
>
> Mark
E-mail #3
> Relax, Henry, this is the last you'll hear of me directly. I just want
> you to know that I'm not taking this quietly and the ripples are spreading
> across the water.
>
> I wrote this in response to a recommendation a member of HighRoad or
> HuntAmerica made a few days ago to another member to buy a semi-inletted
> stock from you:
>
> "I was just ripped off by Henry Pohl of Great American Gunstocks today.
> Check out the site Ripoffreport.com if you think I'm doing this because of
> a chip on my shoulder - I don't want other gun lovers to get similarly
> hosed. I paid $600 for a roughed out stock. Yes, it has really nice wood,
> but the action screw holes were so far off center and angled inside the
> stock that they had to be be bored out and plugged. I may yet have to
> pillar bed the action to keep the repair job from looking cheesy. I waited
> three months for the stock - a month longer than promised; I have two full
> days in filing and shaping and sanding to get the shaper gouges out - not
> finish sanded. Worse, I relied on the position of the action screw holes
> to start finishing the inletting for the action and may have taken off too
> much wood on one side to get a proper metal to wood fit. It's a custom
> order and I've worked on it so I can't send it back, and with the work and
> the wait I
> wouldn't want to - so I told Henry I wanted a partial refund for the
> additional work his mistake had caused. His response was I should be happy
> I only paid $600 for such a nice stock. Buyer beware."
E-mail #4
> Henry -
>
> I reversed the positive comment I had left on you on Rip-Off Report dot
> com and have started hitting the firearm sites - here's what I posted on
> firingline. As I said, I am a man of my word.
>
>
> Ripped off by Henry Pohl Great American Gunstock Co.
>
> Just today I got ripped off by Henry Pohl of Great American Gunstock Co.
>
> I ordered a stock in the second highest grade of English Walnut for a
> pre-64 Model 70 action and paid $600 for it - I really wanted it to look
> nice.
>
> After I ordered it and saw my credit card get hit I came across a bunch of
> posts about bad products and service from Henry Pohl/GAG. I was so
> relieved when I got a pretty piece of wood that I went on line to counter
> some of the negative stuff I'd read.
>
> I didn't care that the stock was rougher than a cob - I figured that was
> all part of the do it yourself thing. I spent two days with files and
> sandpaper getting the shaper gouges out of it - I had to reform the nose
> of the cheek piece because it had been chewed up pretty good in the
> shaping process - still, I was OK with that. The right side of the butt
> was a lot fatter than the left - sand away.
>
> Then I went to try to inlet the action - bad news - the inletting screw
> holes were so far off center I couldn't possibly get a good metal to wood
> fit. I had to bore out and plug the existing holes and may have to pillar
> bed the action. Worst of all, before I realized the action holes were off,
> I shaved wood off and may have taken too much to get a decent fit with the
> correctly repositioned holes - so I may have to glass-bed the action.
> That's not such a bad thing for accuracy but it's like putting mag wheels
> on a Bentley - not appropriate on a classic.
>
> I waited three months for the stock - a month longer than promised, had
> two plus days in cleaning it up and I ordered it with custom features
> which make it non-returnable - so I wouldn't and couldn't return it. I
> wrote Henry and told him I wanted a partial refund. His answer was this -
> exactly as he wrote me:
>
> "However, even if the hole is a little miscut, the stock was sent with the
> opinion that regardless of what minor blems their might be found in it it
> was nonetheless worth the asking price. I regret that you don't feel this
> way, but I honestly think your judgement is somewhat severely and unfairly
> negative. Where else can you get a gunstock that nice for such a low
> price?"
>
> Horsesh*t. That's a polite version of "Screw you, live with it."
>
> Henry Pohl, proprietor of Great American Gunstock Co, talks a good game up
> front, but as you can see, his work is shoddy, and he has absolutely no
> honor when it comes to addressing flaws.
>
> If you are leery of my motives, check out all the comments on
> ripoffreport.com
Brian Sharp
General Manager
Great American Gunstock Co.
Phone: (530)671-4570
Visit Us Online At Gunstocks.com
D) and which one. with a middle of the road 7mm, i would choose the mauser action, and shoehorning a accutrigger would be cool too. i personally like thumbhole type stocks. that is what i would do.
