David E. Petzal doesn't get it.

[beretta9]

Paragraph taken from Editor's Notes by David E. Petzal in May issue of Field & Stream.
"The whole mess brought to light a highly vocal subculture of black-rifle enthusiasts who not only don't hunt but are contemptuous of those "Fudds" who do. Yes, as God is my judge, we have a whole segment of gun owners and shooters deriding people because they hunt. Fudds like me supposedly look down on semi auto and military rifles. Along with accusing me of Fuddhood, my critics said I was old (true) and out of touch (also true) and that I didn't get it (probably true), since to paraphrase former President Bubba, I don't know what the meaning of "it" is. I was also told that the Second Amendment isn't about hunting. True, but that hasn't stopped us from defending it since the day it came under attack.

Sounds to me like he does understand "it".

 

[steveno]

in his gun test of the new TC rifle he complained that the only road hunters need a detachable box magazine in a hunting rifle

 

[30 cal slob]

wanker.

let's get F&S to can his fudd arse.

 

[Titan6]

By and large big game hunters do not need a detached box magazine. This is certainly true. Has nothing to do with the second and Petzal well knows this. Petzal is just trying to irritate you so that you will read his magazine. Do not give him the satisfaction. Normally I say post the link and text but I don't even want to see it here...

 

[CNYCacher]

Reap what you sow

And there it is.

THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO STOP USING THE WORD FUDD!!!!!



IF A HUNTER COMES ACROSS A FORUM POST WHERE A SHOOTER IS COMPLAINING ABOUT FUDDS, AND THEY HAVE NOT BEEN EDUCATED ABOUT WHAT FUDD REALLY MEANS, THEY ARE GOING TO BE ALIENATED, AND MAD.

THINK ABOUT IT!!

IMAGINE THAT YOU ARE A HUNTER, YOU COME TO THR AND THE "BLACK RIFLE GUYS" ARE COMPLAINING ABOUT THE FUDD HUNTERS NOT SUPPORTING THE 2A. WELL, AS FAR AS YOU ARE CONCERNED, THIS IS WHAT THE EBR CROWD THINKS OF YOU:




WE ARE BEING DIVIDED AND WE ARE DOING TO OURSELVES!!!!!!

STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP USING THE TERM "FUDD"




To all hunters: Please accept my apologies on behalf of all gun owners. "Fudd" is a term that some have adopted to describe gun-owning hunters who do not support the second amendment, or hunters who will vote to ban certain guns to appease anti-gun forces in exchange for their hunting guns being left alone.
"Fudd" is NOT a slang term for "hunter", it is only a specific type of hunter, the type who feels that 2A should apply to them and not to all of us.
Many of us do not agree with the use of the term, and I am one of them. It is ambiguous at best, and more likely it is misleading.

 

[CNYCacher]

Sounds to me like he does understand "it".

wanker.

let's get F&S to can his fudd arse.

NO NO NO! THIS IS ALL OUR FAULT!

WE ARE THE ONES WHO DO NOT UNDERSTAND "IT".

THIS MAN HAS BEEN ALIENATED BECAUSE HE READ SOMETHING WITH THE WORD "FUDD" IN IT AND ASSUMED THAT IT WAS A DEROGATORY TERM DIRECTED AT ALL HUNTERS.

THIS IS AN EASY MISTAKE TO MAKE, DUE TO THE POPULARITY AND RECOGNIZABILITY OF "ELMER FUDD", THE LOVABLE YET STUPID CARTOON HUNTER FROM WARNER BROS CARTOONS.

ANY HUNTER, EVEN A PRO-2A HUNTER WHO READS THE WORD "FUDD" IS GOING TO MAKE THE SAME ASSUMPTION, THAT IT IS DIRECTED AT HIM. IT IS NOT OBVIOUS THAT "FUDD" MEANS AN ANTI-2A HUNTER. STOP USING THE TERM!

 

[Thylacine]

CNYCacher , I disagree. There has always been a rift there, and all the word Fudd does is show that we know that it is there. The term Fudd is very appropriate for the anti-ebr hunters.

ANY HUNTER, EVEN A PRO-2A HUNTER WHO READS THE WORD "FUDD" IS GOING TO MAKE THE SAME ASSUMPTION, THAT IT IS DIRECTED AT HIM. IT IS NOT OBVIOUS THAT "FUDD" MEANS AN ANTI-2A HUNTER. STOP USING THE TERM!

Assumption is the mother of all...............
And no I won't.

 

[30 cal slob]

petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd
petzal is a fudd

 

[JWarren]

"The whole mess brought to light a highly vocal subculture of black-rifle enthusiasts who not only don't hunt but are contemptuous of those "Fudds" who do. Yes, as God is my judge, we have a whole segment of gun owners and shooters deriding people because they hunt."

Not to rehash the whole Zumbo affair, but Petzal doesn't get it on another level:

There are a LOT of "black-rifle" enthusiasts that DO HUNT. THOSE were the people that Zumbo was suggesting were in the wrong. After all, it was said that they (Black-rifles) should be banned from hunting.

It wasn't simply some people who DON'T hunt. He says black rifle owners were contemptuous of those "Fudds" who do hunt. No. We are contemptuous of those that were prejudiced against US.

If anything we are contemptuous of contemptuous people LIKE Petzal.

NO ONE was deriding anyone BECAUSE they hunt. We were deriding those who apply THEIR values to us, and judge us according to their yard-stick. I don't recall anyone making either Zumbo or Petzal the all-being master of all things firearms and/or hunting.

For the record, I am happy with Zumbo's reevaluation of his beliefs and the actions he is taking with his new perspective.



John

 

[30 cal slob]

petzal fudd's mind is made up - he hates the EBR crowd, always will.

He's a lost cause and as far as i am concerned IS AN ENEMY OF FIREARMS FREEDOM.

That doesn't mean all fudd's are EBR haters, and if we marginalize petzal it doesn't mean we're marginalizing all fudds.

boycott F&S.

 

[bogie]

Okay... This is liable to hack off a lot of you folks.

YOU don't get it - in fact, I think he gets it more than you do.

Why do I say this?

The gun culture is fragmented. The wabbit hunters are one group. Target shooters are another. Tactical boys are another. And they ALL are sure that their choice of boomstick is the best.

Many of you ARE guilty of contempt. As are many of "them." And there's a whole buncha "thems." We have to lose that contempt, and we have to lose it FAST. Or we're gonna have problems that'll make HR1022 look even more trivial than it is.

Guys, we need to work together. Or we're all going to hang separately. If you FURTHER the split amongst our disorganization, you're only going to make it happen faster. I think that SOME folks are actively working toward that - no, I KNOW they are, and some of them post here.

So think. And focus. What is in OUR best interest here? I say it's unity, not division.

I don't care if your passion is unlimited benchrest, smallbore position shooting, or if you just drag the thutty-thutty outta the closet to shoot a couple of deer every year. We're all one family. Let's keep it that way.

You know, somewhere there's bound to be a family that argued and split apart because they were "Chevy" people, and then one of the members went and bought a Ford... That's SAD, folks... And that's the same situation we're in. So let's stop the BS, and just deal with it.

I think that Petzal gets it. He just doesn't know what to do about it.

 

[JWarren]

bogie,

I understand your sentiment, but I think (no offense) that if some of us don't get it, the same may be said of you. You bring up valid points, and I share your sentiment.

However, this is where your assertion falls short:

We (the gunowner community) are being highjacked by "purists." A VERY small portion of hunters actually have the Petzal view of black-rifles." Contempt for hunters is held by a VERY small population of non-hunting gunowners.

All of those of us in the middle are a big ole happy family.

While I may very well live in some mythical utopia, practically everyone around me hunts. Of those people, practically every one of them also has an EBR or three in their gunsafe. We aren't the ones taking sides.

Most of us are the "can't we all get along" crowd. The contempt that persons like me hold for the Petzal's of the world are not that they hunt. *I* am a hunter. We hold contempt for him because of the contempt HE has chosen to hold, print, and advocate TOWARDS us.

Yes, we need to be united, but frankly I don't see how you can unite with people who don't fundimentally respect YOUR beliefs or rights AND is vocally unabashed of that fact.

I don't see too many Jews sitting down and having coffee with Nazis.


John

 

[Mannlicher]

No, Dave is just another Fudd. When they come for my guns, they will also knock on his door. He will be one surprised though...............

and gee whiz bogie, do you have to SHOUT with that large font? Get a grip man.

 

[orionengnr]

He who posts in a huge type font in order to "make his point" loses the argument before it's truly begun.
Much like screaming in my face, your message is lost in your overzealous and misguided attempt at delivery.

Take a deep breath, turn down the volume, and try again. In a civil tone. Maybe then, I'll listen. Until then, it's just noise.

 

[bogie]

A lot of gun folks see things as very black and white. The cup's either full or empty, nothing in between. You're for us 100%, or you're against us. Our way or the highway.

That doesn't work.

We need to come together, from both ends.

 

[30 cal slob]

I think that Petzal gets it. He just doesn't know what to do about it.

Oh really? Please read on before you continue.

Gun owners -- all gun owners -- pay a heavy price for having to defend the availability of these weapons...The American public -- and the gun-owning public; especially the gun-owning public -- would be better off without the hardcore military arms, which puts the average sportsman in a real dilemma.
-David Petzal

If Sarah Brady is smart—and she is very smart—she will comb through the same blogs and chatrooms I’ve been reading, excerpt some of the most vicious and foul-mouthed entries, print them up, and distribute them to Congress.
-David Petzal

This ******* fudd is an enemy of freedom.

That is all, carry on.

 

[bogie]

Sometimes you have to shout.

There's so much venom out there. So much willingness to just go out and destroy SOMETHING. And then destroy something else. And something else.

Destroying is easy, and it may feel good while you're doing it, but in the long term, you're losing.

What's going to happen next? Going after something like THR, because it has folks who hunt as members?

 

[grampster]

Boy oh boy. EBR enthusiasts and elitist 'pat hunters in designer hunting clothes who only hunt 'pats on Saturday with a 28 gauge being compared to Jews and Nazi's sitting down and having coffee. Now that is an offensive characterization. Now I realize the above comment was not explicitly defined that way, but that is the characterization.

Bogie has hit the nail on the head. It's about attitude folks. Those of us who recognize the value of our firearm culture as it pertains to our freedom and security have an obligation to enlarge our group by embracing and educating and inviting all to begin to understand what our culture truly means. This means that we don't deride some who may be self branded elitists. We need to rise above that notion and not fight amongst ourselves even if some of us kick sand into our face. We don't make friends by causing others to become defensive. That is just stupid!

The fact that we as a group have power, was shown with Zumbo's meltdown. We raised the flag boys and girls. Now it's time to march with it in a positive way, not go looking for more fights. Does the power of unity cause us to ulimately further fragment us or bring us together. United we stand, divided we fall is very apparent in this situation.

 

[30 cal slob]

bogie,

fudd shot hissown self in the foot. petzal said what he said, and it is what it is.

what do you want me to do? take him out for a cappucino and tell him that EBR's would all look nicer with walnut stocks?

look, i'm a hunter too but the 2nd ain't about duck hunting. hunting ain't even a right ... it's a PRIVILEGE.

his views are totally colored by a "hunting" aesthetic that has absolutely nothing to do with 2A.

 

[CNYCacher]

I "get it" just fine.

If you went on a hunter-only website, and they were complaining about all the stupid "Rambos" who make sportsmen look bad, what would you think?

"Sorry for the misunderstanding, 'Rambo' is our name for fishermen who wear white after labor day. Oh, you thought when we said 'Rambo' we were referring to black rifle guys? No, we love black rifle guys, we just can't stand fashion-challenged anglers. What? We managed to piss off thousands or black rifle owners? Bummer."

The problem with "Rambo" in this scenario is two-fold: (A) It doesn't accurately describe a poorly-dressed sea life-extractor (B) can be easily mistaken to be a derogatory remark against all EBR owners

Well, what the heck does Rambo have to do with fashion? I can't remember John Rambo wearing anything but black pants and a headband, which is always in style, so the answer is 'absolutely nothing'.

But then again, when did you ever see Elmer Fudd calling for gun control?

The whole mess brought to light a highly vocal subculture of black-rifle enthusiasts who not only don't hunt but are contemptuous of those "Fudds" who do. Yes, as God is my judge, we have a whole segment of gun owners and shooters deriding people because they hunt.

Yeah, he doesn't get "it". But it's only because we aren't being clear.

 

[Len S]

JWarren,
I would have to disagree. While I do live in the opressive state of IL under the ironfist of Chairman daley and his lackey ROD I know alot of RBKA supporters. However, I also hunt, In Il you can't use a centerfire rifle for deer, only shotguns. I am a waterfowler, yes it helps to be insane, and phesant hunter. Most of the hunters I encounter do not think we need the "evil black rifle". I try to educate but:banghead: . I have a guy accross the street who has a whole safe full of shotguns and bolt action rifles and 1 M-1 garand. He and I have had the discussion many of times bit still:banghead:.Unfortunatly there is a misconception among many wh believe that "they will not come after mine becuse I hunt". They are also willing to cut deals along those lines. We have to figure out how to unite under a common voice.
Now completly unrelated but funny I I live just outsied Chicago, real close to O'Hare airport. Yesterday I cut the grass. As I type this, there is a fresh blanket of snow on my fresh cut grass and I may have to shovel the slush off of my driveway.:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:


Len

 

[kfranz]

It's about attitude folks.

No, it isn't. It's about control, and there are control freaks in every segment of every group. They are the real enemy....

"There are only two types of people; those who want to be left alone and those who will not leave them alone." --Ernest Hancock

 

[bogie]

Thing is, there ARE folks who deride others because they hunt. And that group has GROWN since the Zumbo thing. They figure that since Bubba hunts that he must be against 'em. Not the world's greatest logic, but then again, who needs logic? Then Bubba gets irritated, and snipes back. Before you know it, each is actively working against the other. It's a PERFECT situation for gun control...

There are also folks who want to widen the split. I suspect that some of the most vocal internet folks on both sides of the subject have never touched a gun in their lives.

 

[30 cal slob]

There are also folks who want to widen the split.

Hey - that idiot Petzal drove the first public wedge.

Look - it doesn't help our cause if non-shooters become gun owners because they are recruited into hunting and then decide they don't like black guns or handguns and vote to have them banned.

i know plenty of these snooty types who march into a gun store to take up wingshooting/sporting clays and wrinkle their noses at semi rifles and pistols.

 

[CNYCacher]

Gun owners -- all gun owners -- pay a heavy price for having to defend the availability of these weapons...The American public -- and the gun-owning public; especially the gun-owning public -- would be better off without the hardcore military arms, which puts the average sportsman in a real dilemma.

Okay, so Petzel IS a Fudd, insomuch as he is a hunter who is against EBRs. This does not change the fact that "Fudd" is a poor choice of word to describe an anti-EBR hunter. Now we have Petzel trying to split the hunters against the shooters by saying to all hunters: "Look! Look at the EBR guys, they are calling us all Fudds! They hate us because we hunt!" If the word "Fudd" didn't call to mind an image of a stupid cartoon hunter chasing wascawy wabbits, Petzel wouldn't be able to make these claims, or they wouldn't be effective if he did.

The word "Fudd" is a wedge that the antis will drive between shooters and hunters. Mark my words.