Daytime home security for stay at home mom?

[wrigh003]

My wife is suddenly interested in firearms. After years of mistrust, I get an email from her yesterday that says "I think I'm ready for a pistol permit and some shooting lessons." Great news! Wait, why?

There have been a series of break ins in our neighborhood. With the downturn in the economy and our home's location in an exterior/rural suburb, we seem to be seeing an uptick in minor thefts, stuff going missing from around people's houses, etc. Occasionally we'll hear about a house actually being burglarized while the occupants are away- the dirtbags/tweakers seem to be aware that in the neighborhood a great many folks are away from home working from about 7 to about 6 every day. Exactly that happened to the folks across the street from my mother-in-law (lives a couple miles away) this week, cleaned them out. About 10AM Tuesday, she's putting the baby down and hears somebody knocking forcefully on our front door. She was busy, so didn't answer right away (wasn't expecting anybody), and by the time she went to check there was nobody there. She heard the truck drive off, so it was somebody in a vehicle.

Now, that could have been the bug guy, somebody selling door to door, etc., and I'm not pessimistic enough about the state of the world or our area yet to really think otherwise. Maybe (hopefully) it was completely above board. But in light of the fact that there have been break ins in the area, etc., my concern is that it COULD have been somebody checking whether there's anybody home. In our neighborhood, folks don't usually come door to door, as the houses here are about 250' or so from each other- it's just too much of a PITA for the average sales guy. That's mostly why the random knock on the door is so unnerving- it's completely out of character for the area.

I guess what I am after here, as far as replies go, is some advice on how to have the conversations with my wife about home security while she's there.Honestly, if we're away, we're insured. I'd prefer not to have my stuff grow legs and walk off, but I'm REALLY not interested in anybody attempting that with my family at home. Links to reading material, etc., possibly targeted at women, would be appreciated. She's home with our infant and preschooler most of the time, and isn't a big fan of answering the door for random people. We've got a 55# lab/shepherd/pitbull/goofball cross that's in and out all day long. Great with the kids, but he's intimidating enough when he sees something unusual, and barks nice and loud. The dog, locked doors, plus a pistol that she only knows how to use in theory- well, suddenly it doesn't seem like enough.

Not sure if she'll ever actually carry (particularly inside a house full of kids), but the permit app is on the table in here waiting to go to the sheriff's office. I hate the world today.

 

[esheato]

Get her the pistol lessons. If she has the desire to learn, fan the flames man. Emphasize getting comfortable and being confident. That confidence can go a long way to warding off danger before things get critical. Also check out The Truth About Self Protection. Originally published in 1983, some of the technical data is a bit out-dated but the "I'm not a victim" information is timeless.

Definitely read this website (and book) by a woman for women:

http://corneredcat.com/

Some folks say the most dangerous place in the world is between a Mama Bear and her cubs. It may be so. I've never met a Mama Bear, myself.

The most dangerous place I ever stood was between a cornered cat and an open door.

When a cat feels threatened, she gets away from the danger as quickly as she can. She doesn't care what damage she inflicts on her way to safety, but she's not interested in fighting for fighting's sake. She does only as much as she needs to do in order to escape. She doesn't deal in revenge. If she feels threatened, she simply leaves. Efficiently.

Until she needs to use them, her claws stay sheathed. She doesn't go around threatening to maul people. She's cuddly, she's cozy, she likes to curl up next to a crackling fire on a cold winter's day. She's great company.

But don't try to trap her in a bad situation.

This site is about women and guns, not about cats. But in a way, it's about the cornered cat in all of us. It's about the determination to get away from an attacker if you need to. It's about making the decision to say, "Not me. Not mine. Not today." And it's about the tools to make that decision stick.

Best of luck and stay safe.

 

[kragluver]

I'll second the Cornered Cat website. I've referred my wife to it a number of times. Kathy Jackson also has several good articles written for men about how to talk to their wives about guns. Number 1 - don't tell her what gun she wants!

Some things that work for us - we each have one of the touch pad pistol safes in our bedside tables (his and hers thing). I also just recently mounted a Mossberg 88 18.5" 12 ga to the wall using one of the Shotlock shotgun mounts. Very secure. Someone seriously determined could get it off the wall with a crow bar, but they are probably going to damage the gun doing so. It will definitely keep children safely away from the gun and you can store it loaded -very easy to access and put into action.

When it comes to teaching her to shoot. Start with a .22. Resist the temptation to give her your .45 the first time out. Chances are you will scare her off and she'll never come back to shooting. Spend a couple of hours with the .22 teaching the basics. Shoot cans, clay birds on the berm or just dirt clods - build in the fun and she'll want to come back to it.

 

[Fred Fuller]

Definitely refer her to Kathy's CorneredCat site. You could do worse than to spend some time reading there yourself, too, the perspective might help.

The dog sounds like a big plus in your favor.

If she's already less than enthusiastic about opening the door to strangers, that's a good thing. A wireless intercom might help, or a camera system so she can see who's there.

Do you have an electronic burglar alarm? There are DIY systems available for around $100 that are wireless, easy to install and will work to alert anyone at home if there is an intrusion, and many have autodialers that can alert several other locations to problems as well. See http://www.x10.com/security/index.html for one example, I'd suggest sticking only to the magnetic reed switch type sensors.

How "hard" is your house physically? That is to say, how difficult would it be to break into? If you don't know what to look for, consider asking the police department if they can do an evaluation for you, looking for things that need to be taken care of. See the following for some ideas-

http://www.ou.edu/oupd/hardhome.htm

http://www.ci.canfield.oh.us/Police/Manual security1.pdf

http://www.armorconcepts.com/Preventing-A-Break-In/Door-Reinforcement

hth,

lpl

 

[MachIVshooter]

If burglary is the issue, she's probably pretty safe. Burglars, by definition, try to avoid occupied residences. They generally understand that the stakes are much higher.

That said, I'd encourage her to go to the door if there is a knock. Not to open it, but make clear that someone is home.

A surveillance system is also a wonderful investment. A burglar who comes and knocks on the door isn't likely to do so with a nylon over his head; He will probably be dressed somewhat normally and have a BS line prepared just in case someone does answer the knock. If he is standing there at the door and realizes his face has been caught on tape, he'll likely never return. He realizes that he would be a suspect in the event of a crime in the near future, and is unlikely to gamble that you are not recording.

Alarms: You don't need a fancy one that alerts police. An inexpensive one that mearly sounds an earpiercing alarm when a door or window is breached is sufficient. Only the most brazen process predator is likely to continue, and even then, his first focus will probably be finding and disarming the alarm, giving your wife and kids some extra time to get to a safe place or get out of the house. There are some very affordable options here with magnetic door/window sensors and arm/disarm remotes. Another good idea is the wireless motion sensing alerts for outdoor use. I have one, it's purpose is more for alerting me that a customer (or delivery) is here so that I can greet them more promptly. But it doesn't discriminate about what has crossed it's path. It sounds a loud chime whenever something passes in it's range, whether it's a car, an animal or a person on foot. The one I have was under $20 from harbor freight, and works quite well. You do have to limit their field to avoid being driven nuts with false alarms from cars passing on the street, rabbits running past it, etc. More expensive units use a laser that is more aimable; These cheap ones use the same type of sensor a security light does. Which brings us to the security lights; Always a good idea. Criminals generally prefer stealth, and motion sensing floodlights certainly hinder that.

Security: An average house can be hardened pretty well for a relatively small cost. Deadbolts that require keys on both sides are great, because even breaking a door window or side glass does not allow the criminal to unlock the door. The biggest problem with locks is using them; Those of us in "safe" areas have a habit of not locking the doors, especially during the day. Unlocked locks provide no security at all. Window bars: No, I'm not talking about the ones that mount on the outside like a jail cell. I'm talking about the ones that prevent/limit opening the window. I also live in a rural area, and during nice weather, I like to keep all the windows cracked at night. So they all have a steel bar that prevents them being opened further than 4" or so; Not enough for a person to get in. This leaves the criminal with his only option to completely break out the glass, which is noisy and potentially injurious to him as he's crawling in. It also takes longer than simply sliding the window open. Of course, bars on the outside make it even more difficult, but if you're like me, you don't care for them.

Plan: The most common theme in ST&T is sofware, then hardware. Make sure your wife (and kids, if old enough) know what to do if someone breaks in. You mention a baby, and I'll assume for the moment that you only have the one child. So, the plan should probably include your wife having her phone on her at all times, and retreating to the baby's room in the event that the house is breached. If she doesn't plan to keep the gun on her, the baby's room may be a good place for it. You know the layout of your home, so these are decisions only you can make. Just be sure that the defense strategy is a good one. A pistol locked up in the bedroom with the baby sleeping upstairs and your wife doing laundry in the basement creates a logistical nightmare in the event of a home invasion, as it puts the invader between her and the baby, and she is unarmed.

 

[Loosedhorse]

Burglars, by definition, try to avoid occupied residences.

Oh, the times, they are a-changin'.

Invasion robbers are different. At night, or while the occupants are away, folks tend to set the house alarm. Response time will vary depending on where you live. If you're a robber, why deal with that?

During the day, most people do NOT set the alarm if they're home. Robber knocks on the door, sign this package, ma'am, and here we go. Some robbers follow their victims from the store, knowing if their hands are full of shopping bags when they enter their homes, they probably will not latch the door behind them.

Sure, get firearm training. In the meantime, get pepper spray. Have a house alarm, and have it on during the day.

(Dogs. Great alarm systems, but don't expect them to deal with an armed intruder unless you've trained them to do that.)

 

[MachIVshooter]

Oh, the times, they are a-changin'.

Invasion robbers are different.

No argument.

Just sayin', there are two classes of criminals who unlawfully enter homes: Burglars and home invaders. The former becomes the latter if the home is occupied. If he flees upon discovering that the home is occupied, he was just a sloppy burglar. If he continues, now he's become an invasion robber.

Now, there is a fundamental difference in mindset between the burglar who entered the home and discovered it was occupied, and the invasion robber who entered the home expecting it was occupied. Generally, the invasion robber falls between a burglar and a process predator, danger-wise. In other words, if you stay out of his way, you are probably relatively safe, because he is after your goods. The process predator, of course, is after you specifically and doesn't care about what you have, except maybe as an afterthought.

Now, would I treat an invasion robber any differently than a violent home invader? Probably not, unless he flees. To me, anyone who enters an occupied home presents a danger to the ocucpants, so unless they flee upon contact, they are to be considered a threat and dealt with accordingly.

 

[JR133]

Get her the lessons and see if she really wants a gun. Let her pick the gun that fits her and make her practice with it till she feels confident with it.

For the other issue about the Robber / Home invader. The only problem during the day is if she is home, it's not going to do any good unless she is carrying the gun with her while she is in the house, all of the time.

Most of your Burglars will knock on the front door to see if someone answers. When no one answers, they go around to the rear of the property and break in.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Most of your Burglars will knock on the front door to see if someone answers. When no one answers, they go around to the rear of the property and break in.

Which is why I suggested that she answer (not open) the door. Knowing the residence is occupied will weed out the run of the mill burglar. Additionally, she now knows that anyone who forces entry despite her being there is a threat.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Member
Daytime home security for stay at home mom?

All of the above PLUS having your wife carrying on her person rather than having a loaded gun stored elsewhere. Having a loaded gun stored somewhere that is unavailable to a toddler is a logistical challenge for the parent in a crisis situation. She doesn't have to carry a FNP-45 with a 15 round mag. A 7+1 P32 in a paddle holster will more than suffice. Most bad guys will not stick around when shots are fired.

Keep this in mind... the law will view a stay-at-home-mom protecting her kids from BGs trying to break in with the mom firing through a door very differently than a 250 lb guy doing the same.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Keep this in mind... the law will view a stay-at-home-mom protecting her kids from BGs trying to break in with the mom firing through a door very differently from a 250 lb guy doing the same.

Law enforcement officers might, but not the written statute.

In most states, disparity of force or immediate danger of great bodily injury do not factor into home invasions as they do with self defense in a public place. It is the attacker breaking the threshold and a reasonable perceived threat of any harm to any lawful occupant of the residence that justifies deadly force.

My state (CO), for example:

The general assembly hereby recognizes that the citizens of Colorado have a right to expect absolute safety within their own homes.

Notwithstanding the provisions of section 18-1-704, any occupant of a dwelling is justified in using any degree of physical force, including deadly physical force, against another person when that other person has made an unlawful entry into the dwelling, and when the occupant has a reasonable belief that such other person has committed a crime in the dwelling in addition to the uninvited entry, or is committing or intends to commit a crime against a person or property in addition to the uninvited entry, and when the occupant reasonably believes that such other person might use any physical force, no matter how slight, against any occupant.
Any occupant of a dwelling using physical force, including deadly physical force, in accordance with the provisions of subsection (2) of this section shall be immune from criminal prosecution for the use of such force.
Any occupant of a dwelling using physical force, including deadly physical force, in accordance with the provisions of subsection (2) of this section shall be immune from any civil liability for injuries or death resulting from the use of such force.

It is your responsibility to know your own state's (or local) statutes, but this theme is pretty much the norm anymore in most.

 

[W.E.G.]

Is there a question in the OP?

 

[Derry 1946]

Same Boat

As a father of young children in a traditionally safe area with some recent crime, I'm in a similar situation. My wife does not feel she will be up to the task of using a firearm competently for defense. My advice, whether your wife ends up getting armed or not: get an alarm system, preferably monitored, that includes a fire/smoke detector/alarm. Use it religiously by night and by day.

Good luck and be safe.

Derry

 

[riseagainstforme]

My uncle took an home security sign, shot it so you could still see it said "security" and stuck it by the front door. Lol just a thought to add to the others.

Also put a little more fear in her, just a smidge. Let her know the world isn't safe. Play some
YouTube videos of 911 calls.

 

[Al Thompson]

As pointed out, hardening that perimeter will help peace of mind and I would add a safe room to the picture. Having an interior door (master bedroom?) that can resist a few kicks gives her some reactionary time.

On another note, there is a great training facility about two hours north of you that offers one day handgun training courses:

http://www.shootrite.org/schedules/Schedules.html

Highly recommend.

 

[wrigh003]

Thanks for the replies- I didn't realize there was any kind of training facility anywhere nearby, so that's a plus.

I've seen the corneredcat site before, but I'm sure she hasn't- I'll send her that way.

 

[Owen Sparks]

People who break in in the day time usually do so in hopes that the homeowner is at work. Knocking or ringing the door bell is often the first step. If you answer thay will pretend to have the wrong address or be looking for a lost pet or some such excuse. If you don't answer they take it nobody is home and break in. These criminals are usually not violent and are only dangerous when cornered. A big barking dog is probably the best deterent. If you make your house just a little harder than the next one the thieves will usually move on to an easier target. a "BEWARE OF DOG" sign works wonders even if you don't have a dog. The thieves will not bother to find out.

 

[Kleanbore]

Keep this in mind... the law will view a stay-at-home-mom protecting her kids from BGs trying to break in with the mom firing through a door very differently from a 250 lb guy doing the same.

Disparity of force is generally less of an issue in a residential break in than are other issues.

One must know the law. In some states (Texas, for example), deadly force may be justified under some circumstances if an intruder is attempting to enter unlawfully and with force; in others (Florida and the OP's home state of Alabama, for example), the operative words include in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering; in others (Colorado and Missouri, for example), the statutes do not mention force at all, but unlawful entry must have occurred.

The absence of a completed entry does not necessarily mean that a defense of justification would not be successful, but it does increase the evidentiary burden on the defender. The outcome will depend on circumstances, on the attitudes of the charging authority and of the triers of fact, if it comes to that, and upon any appellate rulings that may have found their way into jury instructions.

Personally, I would never fire through a door at anyone.

Shooting someone is the next to last thing that any reasonable person wants to happen. I have had to dissuade one VCA who was in the process of breaking and entering, one person who walked in through an unlocked door and announced his intention to start killing, and another who unlawfully entered after jimmying with a lock. In each case, the mere presence of my firearm brought an end to the threat. All three incidents, the last of which happened over four decades ago, occurred at night.

I will say that a key ingredient in survival in such circumstances is the willingness to use deadly force without hesitation should it become necessary. Absent that, the defender may end up simply providing another weapon to the intruder.

 

[Averageman]

In this order.
A Plan.
A Cell Phone.
A Dog.
An Alarm System.
Training.
A Gun and more training.

 

[MachIVshooter]

In this order.
A Plan.
A Cell Phone.
A Dog.
An Alarm System.
Training.
A Gun and more training.

I disagree on the order, and you left out a very important aspect; Hardening the home.

My version of priority:

-Early warning system: Either electronic or 4-legged (preferably both)

-Hardened exterior: Doors and windows that cannot be easily defeated in mere seconds.

-A plan: Whether it is egress, retreat to a safe room or standing your ground, it needs to be decided ahead of time.

-Weapon: This is an absolute necessity when the first three measures have failed

-Cell phone: Land lines are easily cut. 911 is unlikely to prevent an attacker from getting to you, but you will almost certainly need to make that call at some point during or after the invasion, especially if you or a family member are injured

-Training: this is last not because it isn't important, but because it is the least likely to be done and pretty much useless without the others. Being some kind of martial arts master or having all manner of other HtH training won't help one bit if the intruder is armed with a ranged weapon and has distance on his side.

All that said, many an untrained person with weak barriers, no alarm and no training has effectively repelled or ended an attack with a firearm. While using a gun most effectively requires good training and practice, simply using one is a monkey task. As well, most invaders are not Navy SEALS or otherwise highly trained operatives. The visions of SWAT-like teams of criminals sweeping your homes with tactical equipment seems a common one here, but it is extrememly unrealsitic; I don't know if we can even count the number of times an intruder has been shot by an untrained armed homeowner as he carelessly came through a door or rounded a corner.

 

[Owen Sparks]

I don't know what part of the country you live in but here in the South it is assumed that breaking on an occupied dwelling will get you shot. We have our share of break-ins but they almost always happen when no one is home, usually during the day. If you can make it look like someone might be home with a car in the driveway or even a closed garage door thieves will usually look elsewhere.

 

[bubba in ca]

Even if you don't have security on all windows, get a good security door for the front door. Pretty ones are available, ours has kind of a sun rise pattern in white paint with metal screen that also keeps out most bugs. That allows you to leave the door open for ventilation or to talk to someone while still having the protection of the steel door.

Get her a shotgun in 20 ga. or 410 and teach her to use it.

 

[SSN Vet]

1. Get everyone in the habit of keeping the doors locked at all times and invest in good locks.

2. You can get a motion/metal driveway sensor that remote chimes in the house for pretty short dollars. It can be very nice knowing whenever a car pulls in the driveway.

3. Carrying on her person will certainly afford the maximum state of readiness.... but I know I could never sell that to my wife. Nor do I want to do it myself on a regular basis. So a good alternative is to put a quick access lock box (I like the touch pad Gun Vault) bolted to the wall or floor in a convenient and central location. Then keep your handgun in condition 1 inside.

Good luck and stay safe...

 

[2WheelsGood]

So a good alternative is to put a quick access lock box (I like the touch pad Gun Vault) bolted to the wall or floor in a convenient and central location. Then keep your handgun in condition 1 inside.

I think that just gives a false sense of security. 9 times out of 10 it's going to be all over by the time you get it out of the box. Maybe if you have a huge house, and you happen to be sitting next to the box when the door breaks down you'd have time.

Can you imagine the sinking feeling you'd get when a bad guy pops around the corner, and your gun is locked away in another room?

 

[SSN Vet]

false sense of security

I appreciate you point...

I don't know however, how anyone outside of the OP's head can comment on whatever sense of security he and his wife do or do not get.

I don't think I myself have any dillusions... (well aside from my Rock-n-roll fantasies )

I can roll out of bed, open the GV and pop up armed in about 3 sec. Our sleeping rooms are on the second floor and with the locked screen doors, dead bolted steel doors, dog gate, and squeaky stairs, I'm not overly concerned about someone getting the drop on me (notice I said dog gate and not dog.... my pup will sleep through just about anything).

On the ground floor, 90% of our waking hours are spent in one open room and the GV is mounted to a beam that is very accessible, while also having cover between the GV and mud room door. The drive way is visible from the main room and I'm installing one of these in the very near future.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004184TEU/ref=asc_df_B004184TEU1809347?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=asn&creative=395093&creativeASIN=B004184TEU

We live back in the woods, so any car that comes down our private drive arouses scrutiny.

Bullet proof? Nope

Better than nuttin'? Yup