Dealing with family
- Thread starter Chrontius
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Just set your "gottahaveititis" aside for the moment. I'm 33 years old, I have approximately 40+ firearms in my collection, and honestly, I regret approximately half the firearms I acquired over "gottahavititis" in some way or another, and know exactly what I'd rather have once I did some research or learned more...
So that means even if you did get the grey G22, I predict there's a 50% chance you'll learn more about shooting, and want a different .22 within a few years time. Say like a Ruger 10/22 because the target and competition accessories market is so huge, just as an example. So relax.
The grey "limited edition" Walther G22 will never be a high-end collectable within the next ten years. It will be worth nothing more than a used Walther G22 based on it's condition. Assuming Walther never makes another grey G22, the Blue Book will probably never put a premium higher than an extra $50 on one that's pristine New-In-Box condition in the next decade over a black or a green one. So don't sweat it.
A few people may buy into the "limited edition" BS, and might be selling theirs for a ridiculous price, but if you look around, or check gunbroker once you're living on your own, you'll find one eventually. Or, your tastes in firearms will have changed completely by then, and you won't care for the Walther one way or the other.
Here's what I would do, open a high-interest checking account, or money-market fund where you get the decent interest (for savings anyway) of 3-5%, and every time you have "the bug" for a certain gun that you can't get because of your mother, put the purchase price it would have been into that fund and save it. You'll be flush with cash when you finally do move out, and can jump-start your gun collection, ammo, a safe, all of that.
While you're saving money, to work on your mother, you need to act, and stop talking. Right now she probably has no real idea that you're serious about becoming a shooter, and just sees your desire for the Walther as another "toy". But this one is admittedly, a potentially lethal toy. And in her mind the risk isn't worth what she thinks will be 1-2 months of interest in plinking, then to be forgotten when you move onto something else.
To "work" on your mother, quit arguing with her directly. (anti-gun) Mothers are ultimately women. (THR Women, please let me be, I'm generalizing, obviously...) And women are often motivated by Emotion, Guilt, and "Mother Logic".
Despite your age, you are still her son, Emotion is telling her that she needs to protect you from harm. She would feel endless Guilt if she allowed you to own a firearm, and you then injured or killed yourself. Mother Logic tells her that at least while you are under her control, if you don't own the firearm you can't be harmed.
So, back to the problem of your Mother, what do you need to attack? Simple. Emotion, Guilt, and Mother Logic.
How do you do this? By turning her Emotion and Guilt to your advantage, and undermining the Mother Logic.
The Plan:
It sounds as though you've had some kind of shooting opportunities before, even though you don't own any guns of your own. Keep up with those, whatever they are.
Spend $35 and join the NRA. This shows you are serious about being a shooter.
Buy your own eye and ear protection if you don't have any already. This shows you are serious about safety.
You need to join every organized shooting sport you can legally participate in, afford to participate in, and can do so with borrowed firearms from the club, or from participants willing to help you out. This shows you are serious about shooting.
Most shotgun clubs have rental guns, and it only costs an extra dollar or two to use it. Most also have a "lesson day" where the owner or a pro will give a class on trap or skeet shooting. The good ones will charge only $20 for the lesson, and they donate the funds to youth shooting programs or the NRA etc.
Find out online, from the NRA, the local gun stores, or local ranges about all the competitions, shooter's clinics, classes etc. that you can find. Don't be shy, and explain that you're 18, have anti-gun parents, but want to participate in the shooting sports as much as you can. If you get rebuffed by some cranky shooters, keep trying. Ask how someone who doesn't have the proper rifle can participate, or if there are members willing to take you under their wing. Eventualy you'll find someone who understands we need new shooters to keep the sport and RKBA alive, and you'll find someone who gets that.
For instance, High-Power clubs/competitions make loaner M1 Garands available, because the High-Power participation is a requirement for buying a low-cost surplus M1 from the CMP. If they didn't, there'd be a chicken-n-egg problem.
So if every weekend you're out to a range or a club, and coming home with stories about how you participated in this shoot and that, how your score improved over last time, you'll get to your mother. And you'll be getting at her through the very things that are making her forbid you own guns now.
Emotionaly, parents want their children to be happy. If she sees you're truly dedicated to shooting competitions and clubs, she will begin to feel Guilty. By participating in all the various shooting sports, clubs, and venues, it will defeat the Mother Logic that preventing your ownership of a firearm will prevent you from being exposed to them. If you're spending a great deal of time around firearms and shooting them anyway, the Mother Logic fails, and there is no point in preventing your owning one.
And furthermore, there's lots of people on these Internet boards, myself included, who have lots of guns in their collections, but never any time or money to shoot them. If you follow the above advice and get involved in clubs, groups, and competitions, you're better off in the long run with lots of trigger time and fewer guns, than you are with lots of guns and little trigger time. You'l be that more of a "real shooter".
One more thing. +1000 to those who gave you the long-term advice to not marry or seriously date an anti-gun woman. You also need to be aware if a fiancée or serious girlfriend is a fence-sitter, that you make it abundantly clear that the guns stay. It's not always a crystal-clear plan in her head, but many women see their men as a "project", and will go into a relationship thinking they'll just get him to get rid of the gun collection "later". Even if she shows no desire at the time to pressure you into giving up guns, make it clear you won't, and do it repeatedly.
If she actualy loves shooting, or takes a dedicated interest after meeting you, start ring shopping.
So that means even if you did get the grey G22, I predict there's a 50% chance you'll learn more about shooting, and want a different .22 within a few years time. Say like a Ruger 10/22 because the target and competition accessories market is so huge, just as an example. So relax.
The grey "limited edition" Walther G22 will never be a high-end collectable within the next ten years. It will be worth nothing more than a used Walther G22 based on it's condition. Assuming Walther never makes another grey G22, the Blue Book will probably never put a premium higher than an extra $50 on one that's pristine New-In-Box condition in the next decade over a black or a green one. So don't sweat it.
A few people may buy into the "limited edition" BS, and might be selling theirs for a ridiculous price, but if you look around, or check gunbroker once you're living on your own, you'll find one eventually. Or, your tastes in firearms will have changed completely by then, and you won't care for the Walther one way or the other.
Here's what I would do, open a high-interest checking account, or money-market fund where you get the decent interest (for savings anyway) of 3-5%, and every time you have "the bug" for a certain gun that you can't get because of your mother, put the purchase price it would have been into that fund and save it. You'll be flush with cash when you finally do move out, and can jump-start your gun collection, ammo, a safe, all of that.
While you're saving money, to work on your mother, you need to act, and stop talking. Right now she probably has no real idea that you're serious about becoming a shooter, and just sees your desire for the Walther as another "toy". But this one is admittedly, a potentially lethal toy. And in her mind the risk isn't worth what she thinks will be 1-2 months of interest in plinking, then to be forgotten when you move onto something else.
To "work" on your mother, quit arguing with her directly. (anti-gun) Mothers are ultimately women. (THR Women, please let me be, I'm generalizing, obviously...) And women are often motivated by Emotion, Guilt, and "Mother Logic".
Despite your age, you are still her son, Emotion is telling her that she needs to protect you from harm. She would feel endless Guilt if she allowed you to own a firearm, and you then injured or killed yourself. Mother Logic tells her that at least while you are under her control, if you don't own the firearm you can't be harmed.
So, back to the problem of your Mother, what do you need to attack? Simple. Emotion, Guilt, and Mother Logic.
How do you do this? By turning her Emotion and Guilt to your advantage, and undermining the Mother Logic.
The Plan:
It sounds as though you've had some kind of shooting opportunities before, even though you don't own any guns of your own. Keep up with those, whatever they are.
Spend $35 and join the NRA. This shows you are serious about being a shooter.
Buy your own eye and ear protection if you don't have any already. This shows you are serious about safety.
You need to join every organized shooting sport you can legally participate in, afford to participate in, and can do so with borrowed firearms from the club, or from participants willing to help you out. This shows you are serious about shooting.
Most shotgun clubs have rental guns, and it only costs an extra dollar or two to use it. Most also have a "lesson day" where the owner or a pro will give a class on trap or skeet shooting. The good ones will charge only $20 for the lesson, and they donate the funds to youth shooting programs or the NRA etc.
Find out online, from the NRA, the local gun stores, or local ranges about all the competitions, shooter's clinics, classes etc. that you can find. Don't be shy, and explain that you're 18, have anti-gun parents, but want to participate in the shooting sports as much as you can. If you get rebuffed by some cranky shooters, keep trying. Ask how someone who doesn't have the proper rifle can participate, or if there are members willing to take you under their wing. Eventualy you'll find someone who understands we need new shooters to keep the sport and RKBA alive, and you'll find someone who gets that.
For instance, High-Power clubs/competitions make loaner M1 Garands available, because the High-Power participation is a requirement for buying a low-cost surplus M1 from the CMP. If they didn't, there'd be a chicken-n-egg problem.
So if every weekend you're out to a range or a club, and coming home with stories about how you participated in this shoot and that, how your score improved over last time, you'll get to your mother. And you'll be getting at her through the very things that are making her forbid you own guns now.
Emotionaly, parents want their children to be happy. If she sees you're truly dedicated to shooting competitions and clubs, she will begin to feel Guilty. By participating in all the various shooting sports, clubs, and venues, it will defeat the Mother Logic that preventing your ownership of a firearm will prevent you from being exposed to them. If you're spending a great deal of time around firearms and shooting them anyway, the Mother Logic fails, and there is no point in preventing your owning one.
And furthermore, there's lots of people on these Internet boards, myself included, who have lots of guns in their collections, but never any time or money to shoot them. If you follow the above advice and get involved in clubs, groups, and competitions, you're better off in the long run with lots of trigger time and fewer guns, than you are with lots of guns and little trigger time. You'l be that more of a "real shooter".
One more thing. +1000 to those who gave you the long-term advice to not marry or seriously date an anti-gun woman. You also need to be aware if a fiancée or serious girlfriend is a fence-sitter, that you make it abundantly clear that the guns stay. It's not always a crystal-clear plan in her head, but many women see their men as a "project", and will go into a relationship thinking they'll just get him to get rid of the gun collection "later". Even if she shows no desire at the time to pressure you into giving up guns, make it clear you won't, and do it repeatedly.
If she actualy loves shooting, or takes a dedicated interest after meeting you, start ring shopping.
Havegunjoe
Member
Buy it....
And put it in a safety deposit box or some other secure storage container off her property.
And put it in a safety deposit box or some other secure storage container off her property.
Mr. James
Member
IV. Honor thy father and thy mother.
Tread carefully, Chrontius: The Man has spoken, and He don't mess around!
Tread carefully, Chrontius: The Man has spoken, and He don't mess around!
shooter94
Member
Mom was cool about guns in our house...my Dad had his all over the house, I had mine in my room. Her only complaint was all the loose cartridges she'd pick up...
Mannlicher
Member
Time to grow up and move.
stellaone
Member
Chrontius- I do understand your frustration. My dad bought a snubby when I was 8 years old and we moved to a bad neighborhood in LA. He took me to the mountains several times to learn how to shoot the gun and always let me know where it was, loaded, in the house. He donated it to the police station when we moved to another state.
I just recently bought my first gun and my dad is really against it. I own my own home, but I live near my parents and they have a big place in my life. He has been weird around me since I bought the gun and won't talk to me about it. He knows that I bought it not only because I believe strongly in the 2A, but also because my job takes me into dangerous situations. Still, he is adamant that I should get rid of it and should never have bought it in the first place. It's hard. I try not to upset my parents- they have given me a tremendous amount of love and support throughout my life. I made the decision to buy the gun and, essentially, disappoint my father because of my strong beliefs in favor of owning one. I would be in a real predicament if I still lived at home and had to deal with the disappointment on a daily basis.
AJ Dual-- Excellent post!
I just recently bought my first gun and my dad is really against it. I own my own home, but I live near my parents and they have a big place in my life. He has been weird around me since I bought the gun and won't talk to me about it. He knows that I bought it not only because I believe strongly in the 2A, but also because my job takes me into dangerous situations. Still, he is adamant that I should get rid of it and should never have bought it in the first place. It's hard. I try not to upset my parents- they have given me a tremendous amount of love and support throughout my life. I made the decision to buy the gun and, essentially, disappoint my father because of my strong beliefs in favor of owning one. I would be in a real predicament if I still lived at home and had to deal with the disappointment on a daily basis.
AJ Dual-- Excellent post!
wheelgunslinger
Member
Chrontius,
I have to second Wiley's post. Very good advice, even if you can't follow it.
I have to second Wiley's post. Very good advice, even if you can't follow it.
What really galls me was she was perfectly willing to buy me a freaking samurai sword (two - one blunt, grooved, whistles-when-you-swing-right practice blade, and one "bisect you lengthwise" live blade) and train me up until she found out that it was a $500 initial investment. *rolls eyes*
Second: I want the walther because I can't afford to rent. $7 plus ammo for an afternoon is much easier to swing than $35 plus ammo an afternoon.
I plan to get my CCW before I join the NRA, as one is more funds-critical. OTOH, I got the thing in the mail - I'm going to join and leave the NRA duffel bag sitting out whenever I can get away with it.
James: He also seems to enjoy royally screwing Me.
Mannlicher: watch the attitude. I'm working on it.
Stellaone: I get the dissappointment without any of the benefits.
And finally, AJ: I'm printing that one off for reference.
Second: I want the walther because I can't afford to rent. $7 plus ammo for an afternoon is much easier to swing than $35 plus ammo an afternoon.
I plan to get my CCW before I join the NRA, as one is more funds-critical. OTOH, I got the thing in the mail - I'm going to join and leave the NRA duffel bag sitting out whenever I can get away with it.
James: He also seems to enjoy royally screwing Me.
Mannlicher: watch the attitude. I'm working on it.
Stellaone: I get the dissappointment without any of the benefits.
And finally, AJ: I'm printing that one off for reference.
Mannlicher is right. I don't see any attidude in his post other than truth. The fact that you do tells me something
Here's the deal. You are of a legal age that the state sees you as an adult. The idea behind waiting until someone is 18 before they are termed an adult is in hopes that by then they will have learned enough to be an adult. Lesson #1, in my opinion, is that actions have consequences.
"Wiley:
That would be another potential hobby, but it involves being written out of the will. Besides that, you suggested my default course of action (story of my life). "
It seems to me you are unwilling to accept the consequences.
If it truely matters to you, buy that gun and face the consequences. This may mean moving out. This may mean storing it somewhere else. (and if part of the consequences of that decision is being cut out of the will, then so be it). This may mean buying a gun safe and giving the keys away.
Or choose not to buy the gun.
What you really need to do is grow up. I frankly don't care if that hurts your feelings or violates the rules you set up at the beginning of this thread.
There is a reason they say the truth hurts. Good luck.
Here's the deal. You are of a legal age that the state sees you as an adult. The idea behind waiting until someone is 18 before they are termed an adult is in hopes that by then they will have learned enough to be an adult. Lesson #1, in my opinion, is that actions have consequences.
"Wiley:
That would be another potential hobby, but it involves being written out of the will. Besides that, you suggested my default course of action (story of my life). "
It seems to me you are unwilling to accept the consequences.
If it truely matters to you, buy that gun and face the consequences. This may mean moving out. This may mean storing it somewhere else. (and if part of the consequences of that decision is being cut out of the will, then so be it). This may mean buying a gun safe and giving the keys away.
Or choose not to buy the gun.
What you really need to do is grow up. I frankly don't care if that hurts your feelings or violates the rules you set up at the beginning of this thread.
There is a reason they say the truth hurts. Good luck.
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