Debating changing my carry gun philosophy again

[Old Dog]

However, there are cases of people being shot for not disengaging the safety in time

This claim gets bandied about on the internet somewhat frequently, but aside from a couple of Ayoob articles back in the '90s, I've not seen credible documentation on this. And the Ayoob articles referenced cops whose sidearms were taken by assailants, who then tried to use them against the cops, but couldn't get the guns off safe...

I'd be interested to see some factual accounts of people actually shot because they couldn't get their own handguns' safeties off. And if the victims were killed, how would we know that was the reason?

 

[defjon]

Whatever you shoot best and have the most muscle memory with.

 

[Navy87Guy]

So here’s my summary of @chaim ’s post:
- He shoots SA’s better than DA/SA’s (but it’s really just the first shot that’s a little off).
- He’s worried about the manual of arms when reintroducing a thumb safety into the process.
- He’s worried about 1911 capacity
- He’s worried about 1911 reliability with a range of defensive ammo
- He really likes his 1911

Sounds to me like the decision is pretty obvious (stick with your current carry guns) - but you don’t like that answer and you’re hoping someone can talk you into the 1911. The only down side of the current carry guns seems to be I one round accuracy (and I’m guessing it’s still in the A zone) - while you list a litany of “challenges” with the 1911. You characterize the better 1911accuracy as a “strong” reason to switch - but is it really? Does a few millimeters of accuracy on the first shot really outweigh all the other negatives you listed? I don’t see a strong argument to change.

FWIW, I EDC a Bul Ultra 1911 in .45 ACP. I appreciate all the arguments you make for and against - and for myself, I’ve decided the 1911 is my preference. I also have a couple of DA/SA’s that I keep in my carry rotation. It’s a matter of personal preference but I don’t think you’re going to find your answer in these responses. At the end of the day, you’re the one who has to live with your choice.

 

[trackskippy]

The only way to figure this out, is to take the gun you want to use, and vet it, and yourself with it, shooting it in a way that will "replicate its use", the best you can.

If you find problems with it, or you, or both, then you need to address that, or look for something else.

I think some of the problem here is, people want to figure things out without having to do any work or spend any money. This isnt something that you can do that with. Decent guns, gear, and ammo, are necessary and tend to be expensive. Especially the ammo part of this, if you hope to be at least reasonably proficient.

 

[Alllen Bundy]

From the Sig P365 Operator's Manual dated 12/26/2018

3.4 Loading the Pistol
1. Point the pistol in a safe direction. Engage manual safety if so equipped.

4.1 Clearing a Stoppage
1. Engage the manual safety if so equipped.

5.1 Unloading the Pistol (Magazine Not Empty)
1. Keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction and engage the manual safety if so equipped.

5.2 Unloading the Pistol (Magazine Empty, Slide Open)
1. Keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction and engage the manual safety if so equipped.

The idea that you are so special that you don't need to use a manual trigger safety is like someone that doesn't believe that they need insulation on their 120 VAC AC power cords because they can carefully arrange the wires so that they don't accidentally touch together. Or doesn't believe that they need to use a circuit breaker to prevent an overload because THEY will make sure that THEY will NEVER overload the circuit. And that only works until a device connected to the circuit has a malfunction and shorts out the powerline, burns down the house and sets the neighborhood and forrest around the houses on fire.

Anytime the pistol is loaded and outside of it's holster it is at risk of accidental discharge. If at least you keep a manual trigger safety engaged until your raise your pistol into firing position, you GREATLY reduce the chance of an accidental discharge from any cause.

I don't care whether or not you are worried that you might forget to disengage the safety. I'm worried that you might have a negligent discharge in MY direction. Unless you are in an area that is far enough away from anyone else to prevent accidentally shooting anyone, or there are adequate barriers around you, I consider the failure to use a manual trigger safety as reckless endangerment.

The idea that you don't need a manual trigger safety is pure arrogance!

 

[sevt_chevelle]

I carry a Taurus spectrum and a 9mm G2. Safety's always off. On the 9mm. Spectrum does not have a safety.

Ah I see a man of great culture, I gotta love what I hope is a trailer park boys reference.

 

[Ignition Override]

chaim: your opening statement Combined with two or three of the other longer responses require too much time, but your comments and info are extremely well-organized.

Most of my gun reading is on AKfiles.

If you are gonna do it, then may you be successful.
Let us know how you like the changes.

 

[mljdeckard]

I have never had any trouble switching between guns with and without a manual safety. It just kind of becomes ingrained. If it has a manual safety, I rest my thumb on it. As the gun comes up, it goes off-safe. When I bring the gun down, it goes back on safe. If there's ny lever, I just don't do it. (I did NOT like the 'positive' slide-mounted on my issued M-9.)

I carried a Kimber Custom II .45 1911 for years, I switched it out for a RIA double-stack 9mm. No issue with capacity, but I do carry a spare magazine. I had reliability issues when I first got it, because it is a combo 9mm/.22 TCM. The end result was installing a Wilson Combat Bulletproof extractor, tuned for 9mm. Now it functions perfectly with 9mm, and ....ok with the TCM. I can work with that, because the TCM is purely a recreational gun. (Maybe one day I'll set up another slide and extractor for the TCM.)

I only carry full-size guns. Year-round. a part of it is reliability and issues like smaller and 'modified' 1911s being less reliable, but it's mostly because I'm old and stubborn, and I don't feel compelled to have a different gun for everything. (A carry 1911, a combat 1911, a home-defense 1911, a competition 1911, etc.) I try to stick with a single setup. I also don't buy into the 'full size guns are too big to carry' idea. All sizes have their drawbacks and advantages. Make your choice, and plan your gear and your wardrobe around it.

I don't know that ANY 1911 is ammo sensitive. My Kimber eats everything. My RIA eats everything. My Para doesn't like handloads at all. A lot of it is using good magazines. But my Kimber eats everything with premium aftermarket magazines like Wilson 47Ds, with the magazines that came from the factory, and even the army magazines I pilfered that rattle in the magazine well.

I tried Glocks, Berettas, Sigs, S&Ws, Taurus, etc. I just kept wishing they were 1911s.

 

[md7]

Everything’s a compromise with a ccw. Size, capacity, manual of arms, etc. After reliability, then comes personal preference and that’s a question each of us has to sort out on our own.

The good news, so far as I can discern, is that you’ll carry and the options you currently have appear to work well enough for defensive purposes.

Now to the 1911. I agree with what you said about capacity. Normally I ccw a Glock with reloads. However, I do also ccw a 1911 (steel govt size) on occasion and also carry reloads. For me, I’m ok with carrying a 1911 and reloads. But I would definitely want a reload, especially with a 1911. That’s just how I see it.

1911 reliability. I can only speak for the two I have. Mine have fed, fired, and ejected Hydra shok, Critical Duty, whatever Sig calls their hp’s, and a few others too. Additionally, I’ve used Wilson, SA OEM’s, Metalform, and Mec Gar mags. Both 1911’s have been flawless to this point with the Mil Spec approaching 2500 rounds. Only 800-1000 rounds through my SA Loaded. Given proper maintenance, I feel fine saying they’re reliable. At least mine are.

1911 thumb safety. OP, I understand your point and know others that also don’t like manual safeties on defensive weapons. However, I do think that dedicated practice would build muscle memory required to run a 1911 well, and I don’t know of an single action option available without a manual safety. If you’re considering single action, you’ll have to put in the time and come to terms with engaging a safety. That’s just the way it is, and falls under the everything is a compromise category in my opinion.

Best wishes on the decision making process

 

[jmr40]

I've used 1911's enough to be very familiar with them. I'm fine with a striker fired gun like a Glock. In fact Glocks have been my preferred gun for a long time. I'm fine with Glocks, and similar guns not having a safety as long as they are carried in a holster that covers the trigger.

But more and more I find myself needing to have a gun not in a holster. Glove box and night stand use come to mind. For that type of use I much prefer an external safety or no round in the chamber And I like a 1911 style safety much better than the "backwards" safety used on most DA/SA pistols.

In recent years there have been several modern plastic, striker fired guns introduced with a 1911 style safety. I've found myself drifting in that direction. For CC I now use a Sig 365 with a safety. I also have both a Sig M17 and M18, the military versions of the 320 in 9mm but with a 1911 style safety.

S&W offers a version of their M&P with that type of safety and I have both a 45 and a 10mm version of the Smith.

Ruger also offers several budget oriented pistols with a similar safety.

I installed an Apex trigger kit on the Smith 45 and it now rivals a good 1911. The 10mm Smith is a newer 2.0 version and while not quite 1911 good, it is better than a Glock. I also find the Sig's to have better triggers than Glock. To me this is the best of both worlds.

 

[Rexster]

There are some artisans, who work in polymer, who can sculpt a Glock G17 frame to feel much like a 1911. I have a Gen3 G17 that was done this way, by Robar. Robar may not still be in the gunsmithing trade, but there should be others doing similar mods. Such a modification would allow the user to have some of the advantages of each system.

 

[Demi-human]

The idea that you don't need a manual trigger safety is pure arrogance!

The idea one could use an electronic device and not see the difference between a P-365 and a 1911 is pure idiocy.

But you’re not an idiot. You’re just being arrogant. Anyone who doesn’t chose what you chose is wrong, even if they own a completely different set of circumstances and pistol.
That is called arrogance. Extraordinary shortsightedness at the very least.

Believing that someone in Maryland could negligently discharge their weapon and hit you In Minnesota is ridiculous, and exactly what you wrote.

The idea that you are so special that you don't need to use a manual trigger safety is like someone that doesn't believe that they need insulation on their 120 VAC AC power cords because they can carefully arrange the wires so that they don't accidentally touch together. Or doesn't believe that they need to use a circuit breaker to prevent an overload because THEY will make sure that THEY will NEVER overload the circuit. And that only works until a device connected to the circuit has a malfunction and shorts out the powerline, burns down the house and sets the neighborhood and forrest around the houses on fire.

More unrelated, and insulting, pedantry.
Possibly below you. Far below even the average of the membership here.


Hey, Al. This is a 1911.

No, those aren’t safeties laying with it, those are knives.
(Sorry I opened them at you, well, at all of the western states, were you cut?)

Now look in your pants. The thing you’re constantly fondling with? Polishing, lovingly, at every chance. That’s your 365. (Do you even shoot it?) Notice how it doesn’t match exactly to a 1911, even though they bear a remarkable resemblance to each other as objects, they are, in fact, different.

Much the way we are from you, thankfully…

Look. You’re a smart guy, probably even knowledgeable about, something. Not the 365. But really, the 365 has more in common with the “I shoot me” P-320 than a 1911. Why must you insist on mucking up every 1911 thread, even the remotely appropriate, with your German love?
Rather than blather on about your Sig, why not suggest one of the other pistols the OP has to choose from, and listed?
I love my Magnum Research Desert Eagle, it has a safety and is in no way related to this conversation at all. Savvy?

And now we are to tolerate being called reckless because we don’t home tinkerer install a safety on our striker pistols?
Where’s the P-32 with a safety?

I know the sun hates Minnesota, but this is a shade beyond the pale.

We can simply state we like or dislike safeties and why, we don’t need to disparage other members’s choices or make straw man arguments about said personal choice.

 

[Demi-human]

Now, strictly to the matter at hand.
Glint edged accuracy isn’t necessary for home or self defense. I’d stay with a higher capacity, less picky, more reliable, lighter weight, DAO pistol that I was fastest with.

And cherish every range moment with 1911. They are great. But strikers are getting better and better. Even I can’t ignore split times with a nine are faster, and all pistol ammunition is equal-ish today. I won’t be buried with a 1911, but maybe with a 45 Auto cartridge.

 

[chaim]

But more and more I find myself needing to have a gun not in a holster. Glove box and night stand use come to mind. For that type of use I much prefer an external safety or no round in the chamber And I like a 1911 style safety much better than the "backwards" safety used on most DA/SA pistols.

That is a good point. I don't like the idea of grabbing a gun loaded for home defense (I don't put one in my glove box) that is sitting open and is ready to go. My solution has been for my nightstand guns, guns loaded and in a quick access safe, or (when out of state on my UT permit) when storing a gun in my car when entering a no-gun zone, I leave it in the holster. That would slow access when I need it, but keeps me from grabbing it with a finger or thumb inside the trigger guard if I'm trying to grab it quickly, at an odd angle, and not looking (there is also the issue that, other than the quick access safe, the gun may not be the only thing there and something could end up the trigger guard even when I am picking it up properly if it isn't in a holster). That would be a good application of using the 1911 or other gun with a safety. Even if I don't grab it in a way that lets me quickly disengage the trigger (or under stress, I don't), a non-firing trigger pull followed by then disengaging the trigger may not take any more time than having to use two hands to pull off the holster as I pick up the gun.

There are some artisans, who work in polymer, who can sculpt a Glock G17 frame to feel much like a 1911. I have a Gen3 G17 that was done this way, by Robar. Robar may not still be in the gunsmithing trade, but there should be others doing similar mods. Such a modification would allow the user to have some of the advantages of each system.

I hadn't thought about that. Might be an interesting idea. I know Glocks are some of the most customized guns these days, and the fact that so many accessories and gunsmiths are available for it was part of what made me finally give them a try. I may have to look into that.

Glint edged accuracy isn’t necessary for home or self defense. I’d stay with a higher capacity, less picky, more reliable, lighter weight, DAO pistol that I was fastest with.

I used to shoot quite a lot. I was getting pretty good my first few years of shooting. About 15 years ago when ammo prices started going through the roof, I cut way down. The last 5 years I've only gone to the range once or twice a year some years, and maybe 2-3 times on average. At that point, I decided that maintaining at "combat accuracy" was good enough. Lately, I've decided I need to shoot a lot more (especially now that I can have a MD permit and will be carrying in public a lot more than I used to). I've shot thousands of rounds just over the last month and a half to two months, and I've bought a couple .22 handguns (soon to add more) so I can shoot a lot more. Now that my accuracy is catching up to where I used to be, I guess I care more about an inch here and a few millimeters there than I had in a long time. But, that is true, that kind of obsession over consistency is probably better left at the range. I'm not shooting competition where that matters, in a self defense situation, if I can keep all my shots in a 6" circle COM on the target at 15-20 yards, I'm prepared for 90% or more of the likely self defense situations I may find myself in. Still, I love my 1911s, consistent shot placement and better accuracy is never a bad thing.

 

[chaim]

I've been on this gun forum since it opened (within a week or so anyway), I've been on others for well over 20 years now. I know I wouldn't get a definitive answer here. However, just writing it out can help my thought process, and often people bring up ideas that are helpful (such as a couple posts back about a safety as an advantage for a "nightstand gun").

I do see a fair number here do what I stopped doing when I dropped my 1911s from my carry rotation and they alternate their use with DA/SA, DAO and/or striker guns. I got away from that because (for me) I am more comfortable with 1911s if all my carry/home defense guns are 1911 type or at least use the 1911 style safety. I'd still have the issue that under stress, fine motor skills are less precise and I may miss the safety, but if all my guns worked that way, I feel like it would be less likely to happen. I really liked several guns with a different manual of arms and I definitely didn't want to drop my revolvers (small framed revolvers especially, they may be very much a niche gun as far as carry, but in some circumstances, they are hard to beat). So, I semi-standardized. Not all my guns are true DAO or are striker guns, I have DAO (though I'm mostly phasing them out now for other reasons), DA/SA or striker, but all are put into action the same way (with no manual safety and using a longer trigger pull as the "safety"). However, there certainly is no objective one is better than the other (even though some people would have us think so), so I'm not going to get a definitive answer.

Maybe for me the answer is to go back to carrying 1911s occasionally while mostly keeping my other carry guns. That is what some here do, and while it may not be ideal in some ways, it may be better than dropping guns that in many circumstances may be better for carry (IMO). But then, it will let me indulge my love of 1911s and when I really want to, let me carry one. Sure, by adding another MOA to things, I'd be more likely to have a mistake where I don't disengage the safety, but for how many years now have I been unable to carry at all here in my home state, carrying but introducing a higher likelihood of a mistake that keeps my gun out of action longer is certainly better than the last 50+ years (okay, maybe I should just count my adult years, so over 30). It didn't take me long to know I am not going to drop the guns I currently rely on for defense, so that is my only option if I'm going to add the 1911 back.

On the other hand, a few here suggest the status quo, the DAO, DA/SA and striker guns for home defense and carry, and appreciate the 1911s as great range guns. That idea certainly has merit as well, and has been what I've done for a number of years now.

 

[JTQ]

That is a good point. I don't like the idea of grabbing a gun loaded for home defense (I don't put one in my glove box) that is sitting open and is ready to go. My solution has been for my nightstand guns, guns loaded and in a quick access safe, or (when out of state on my UT permit) when storing a gun in my car when entering a no-gun zone, I leave it in the holster.

RCS Gear Vanguard https://rcsgear.com/holsters/by-series/vanguard-minimalist-holster

Dale Fricke Zacchaeus https://dalefrickeholsters.com/product/zacchaeus-concealment-holster/

 

[Smaug]

I feel like you might be getting ahead of yourself here, Chaim.

What counts when you need it is CoM hits quickly. X vs. 10 vs. 9 isn't going to matter; getting that hit first hit does. I bet you can already do that with your current carry guns at 7 yards and under. Shooting someone at > 7 yards will be probably hard to justify as a defense shooting. (excluding possible mass shooter scenarios, as in Greenwood, IN)

However, if you DO decide to go 1911-style, I would encourage you to look at some of the new smaller ones and replace one or two of your current carry guns to get it. My buddy just got a Kimber Micro 9, and it is great. We had no jams at all shooting range ammo and I was shocked at how accurate it is. It has the 1911 advantages and is easy to shoot accurately. S&W just came out with a subcompact 1911-style pistol in 380, too. I bet they're both reliable.

Also, don't sell yourself short on the needing to retrain for SA cocked & locked carry angle; you're a Gun Guy. You're a regular poster here, so you think about guns all the time. You will NOT forget to thumb off the safety, even in the heat of the moment. That is for muggles. If it's a gun your wife might grab, that's a different story.

 

[chaim]

I feel like you might be getting ahead of yourself here, Chaim.

What counts when you need it is CoM hits quickly. X vs. 10 vs. 9 isn't going to matter; getting that hit first hit does. I bet you can already do that with your current carry guns at 7 yards and under. Shooting someone at > 7 yards will be probably hard to justify as a defense shooting. (excluding possible mass shooter scenarios, as in Greenwood, IN)

However, if you DO decide to go 1911-style, I would encourage you to look at some of the new smaller ones and replace one or two of your current carry guns to get it. My buddy just got a Kimber Micro 9, and it is great. We had no jams at all shooting range ammo and I was shocked at how accurate it is. It has the 1911 advantages and is easy to shoot accurately. S&W just came out with a subcompact 1911-style pistol in 380, too. I bet they're both reliable.

Also, don't sell yourself short on the needing to retrain for SA cocked & locked carry angle; you're a Gun Guy. You're a regular poster here, so you think about guns all the time. You will NOT forget to thumb off the safety, even in the heat of the moment. That is for muggles. If it's a gun your wife might grab, that's a different story.

I usually do most of my defensive gun practice between 10-15 yards, and I'm starting to push out to 15-20. I only do 20+ yards with much slower practice shots, not self-defense oriented drills. I figure if I can do 15 yards or so I'm pretty well prepared for typical self defense needs, and have a chance at atypical self defense scenarios. All the guns I use for defense are just fine at those ranges. So, yes, dropped to a more typical 5-10 yard self defense range, any of my guns will be in a fist sized group (even with a flyer or two) and be more than good enough (even with my degraded marksmanship skills behind the trigger).

I guess, part of what is inspiring this thread is, yes, I am better with the 1911, but I also just like it. Like your last paragraph, if I add it to the rotation, and don't standardize on it, there are some disadvantages, but I'll probably be fine (and like my last post, is definitely an improvement over what I've been able to do in the past when here in MD). Is missing the safety under stress a real thing, yes, it can and does happen to people. But, I love 1911s, I'm good with 1911s, and they have some advantages other guns don't. It is just part of the positives and negatives when weighing any carry choice. I'm actually starting to lean against any kind of standardization, carry my other guns most of the time, but carry a 1911 or similar type when that is what I want to do, and then living with the extra training needs and slightly increased chance of messing up and not disengaging the safety on the draw. I've been shooting a long time, a lot of that was 1911s (I only stopped using them for carry and home defense a few years ago), and yes (even when I wasn't shooting much), I'm often thinking about and learning about guns and trying to improve my skills and knowledge (and tend to do that with all of my hobbies). Heck, looking back at some of my old posts here and at TFL, the main reason I retired my 1911s for defensive use was that I was starting to shoot less, and I was spending less time practicing my draw. Now that I'm shooting a lot again (and doing a lot of dry fire and laser practice as well), that is not an issue anymore.

As for the middle paragraph, if I do reintroduce the 1911 (and similar) to my carry rotation and home defense guns, there may be some new additions. I do like the Kimber Micro 9 (with most guns I don't go for the different color options they now offer, but I really like some on that gun). Though, I've wanted a Springfield EMP since they came out so that would be more likely (or more immediate anyway). I'm retiring both of my pocket autos. My LCP is 100% with FMJ, but I recently left the FMJ only camp for .380 and found my LCP is not reliable with JHP. My Pf9 never got used in its intended use (pocket 9mm) because I've never got through more than a box without either a FTF or a double feed. A SIG P238 or P938 (or Kimber Micro or Micro 9) may be a nice solution when I want something smaller than my P365. While I plan to use my RIA 1911CS as trade fodder towards a full sized steel 1911, and that will be a more traditional version, I am also shopping .45ACP pistols to replace my .45ACP SIG P250 as my home defense gun. I may then add some double stack and/or railed 1911s as my home defense gun instead of the M&P, HK or P220 I'm currently deciding between (and going to a 1911 with a safety for this purpose would mean my home defense pistol no longer needs to have a holster).

 

[GEM]

There are some videos of folks not activating the safety on Active Self Defense.
From the look of them, not well trained. Now, I shoot a 1911 and haven't had a problem in matches forgetting the safety. I have seen it done even by high level folks once in awhile. One thing folks have noticed is forgetting the safety is more common if you don't grasp the gun from your standard position. Your muscle memory is pretty specific to your draw sequence and standing position. So, sitting, taking the gun from a box, sometimes screws folks up.

However, when I'm going to carry my 1911 or compete with it, I do a bit of dry fire to reinstate the muscle routine.

 

[Smaug]

There are some videos of folks not activating the safety on Active Self Defense.
From the look of them, not well trained. Now, I shoot a 1911 and haven't had a problem in matches forgetting the safety. I have seen it done even by high level folks once in awhile. One thing folks have noticed is forgetting the safety is more common if you don't grasp the gun from your standard position. Your muscle memory is pretty specific to your draw sequence and standing position. So, sitting, taking the gun from a box, sometimes screws folks up.

This is a very good point! If I had to somehow get the gun lefty, I might not remember.

 

[Smaug]

I usually do most of my defensive gun practice between 10-15 yards, and I'm starting to push out to 15-20. I only do 20+ yards with much slower practice shots, not self-defense oriented drills. I figure if I can do 15 yards or so I'm pretty well prepared for typical self defense needs, and have a chance at atypical self defense scenarios. All the guns I use for defense are just fine at those ranges. So, yes, dropped to a more typical 5-10 yard self defense range, any of my guns will be in a fist sized group (even with a flyer or two) and be more than good enough (even with my degraded marksmanship skills behind the trigger).

You should practice at 5 or 7 yards too, to make sure your speed is up to snuff.

I'm retiring both of my pocket autos. My LCP is 100% with FMJ, but I recently left the FMJ only camp for .380 and found my LCP is not reliable with JHP.

Well, I'm sure you've read that 380 HPs don't penetrate enough to be reliable anyhow. (under 12" in ballistic gel) That's why FMJ is favored, preferably flat point that will disrupt tissue better than a round nose.

A SIG P238 or P938 (or Kimber Micro or Micro 9) may be a nice solution when I want something smaller than my P365.

Having shot my buddy's Micro 9, if it is smaller than a P365, it is not enough to notice. It IS a lot heavier, though! (I have a P365 for my main carry gun) The P365 has such a good trigger. A Micro 9 trigger breaks a bit cleaner, but it wouldn't matter in a defense situation. I bet the weight at which they break is about the same.

 

[The_Quartermaster]

It's unfounded that a flat blunt faced .380 FMJ would do more damage. And there have been two .380 JHP's that meet and exceed FBI protocol tests; LE 50 round boxes of Fe4deral Hydra Shok and Hornady XTP from either Hornady or Fiocchi. I bet there would be a third if Hydra Shok Deep in .380 was tested too.

 

[JTQ]

...I have seen it done even by high level folks once in awhile.

Are these folks that only compete with a 1911, or are they shooting multiple guns in multiple divisions?

One thing folks have noticed is forgetting the safety is more common if you don't grasp the gun from your standard position. Your muscle memory is pretty specific to your draw sequence and standing position. So, sitting, taking the gun from a box, sometimes screws folks up.

If you get your full firing grip on the holstered gun, with your thumb on the thumb safety, it seems unlikely one would forget the safety. My thumb spends more time on the thumb safety than my finger spends on the trigger. I often share this GunTalkTV 1911 video featuring the late Ed Head demonstrating the draw stroke, beginning at about the :40 mark.

 

[md7]

However, when I'm going to carry my 1911 or compete with it, I do a bit of dry fire to reinstate the muscle routine.

Same. A little practice prior to holstering up never hurts.

 

[westernrover]

This one blew me away starting at 16:52



I think this is especially relevant for law enforcement officers, but it can be important to an individual also.
I carry a revolver and am highly likely to continue to do only that, but this changed my perception about manual safeties.
While the safety isn't as sophisticated as the kind of access control device would could conceive of, there is evidence that it works.