DoubleTap verus Buffalo Bore Ammo

[Dog Wonder]

Shooters:

I am interested in two ammos for home protection: (1) DoubleTap & (2) Buffalo Bore ammo! I am looking for your thoughts on what ammo is more consistant in its stated test results as far as both velocity & expansion?
And out of these two ammos what ammo do you prefer & why?

P.S. This ammo will be shot out of a semi-auto hangun!
______________

 

[ku4hx]

I've got both in 10mm and to say the least they are awesome rounds and very consistent. My chronograph shows both firms to be truthful. However, I don't use either for home protection. Depending on the cartridge and exactly which loading you choose, you could be in a serious over penetration situation. As excellent as they both are, I tend to favor SD loadings that are less powerful. But that's just my choice. I read somewhere, "no cop was ever killed because of over penetration" or words to that effect. But in a neighborhood situation like mine, I feel obliged to err on the "safer" side.

You might want to look here:
www.firearmstactical.com/wound.htm

For some reason I can't open the site right now but from the FBI and industry data they show, the most penetration and greatest expansion is not always from the round with the highest initial velocity. I have the data downloaded in .pdf form if you can't open the site and want to see it.

Another excellent site for actual penetration and expansion tests is:
http://www.brassfetcher.com/10mmAuto180grRemJHP.html

This link opens to 10mm but you just pick the round you want to see on the left.

In the end it's your call and what you feel you can control and make a quick follow-up shot with if necessary. In a hunting/range situation I have no problem with either DT or BB, but for me recovery for a second shot is important and I'm just slower with both you're asking about. But again, that's just me.

 

[wnycollector]

I have shot both DT and BB in both pistols and revolvers. Other than DT's .38 gold dots, ALL of their ammo that I have chronographed met or exceeded their claimed FPS. BB is wonderful stuff, but just insanely expensive to shoot. IMOO DT's ammo is loaded hotter than most factory ammo, with just a slight cost increase.

I know I mentioned cost being a factor in picking ammo. In pistols reliability is the utmost concern for me. I normally shoot 200-300 rounds of my carry ammo through my pistols before I stake my life on that pistol/ammo combo. With DT, I can afford to do that. Buffalobore on the other hand... You get the picture I think that dollar for dollar DT is great ammo.

 

[Dog Wonder]

Thank-you for these informative links! I shoot 45 caliber ammo coming out of an HK45c -which soaks up the recoil very well !Whether the ammo is +p or standard the timing on my follow-up shots is the same!
Again thank-you _Ku4thx> and enjoy your turkey leftovers!

 

[freakshow10mm]

DT is known for inflating their velocity figures quite a bit. BB has a more solid track record than DT in that regard. Some guys on 10mmtalk have been disappointed in the quality at DT lately.

 

[jem375]

Interesting, I am on 10MMtalk quite a bit and the vast majority use DT and like the ammo very much. I have just about every loading in the 10MM myself from DT, and think it is the best ammo for it period....

 

[wnycollector]

DT is known for inflating their velocity figures quite a bit.

The only instance of inflated velocity with DT ammo that I have found is their .38 special 125gr gold dot loading (-18% from DT listed velocity). I have chronoed several loads in .40, .45, .357 and 9mm, all have come within +/- 2% of the stated velocities.

 

[freakshow10mm]

Their 10mm loads are hilariously slower than advertised.

jem375, most of the bad feedback about DT on 10mmtalk is deleted.

 

[IdahoLT1]

Their 10mm loads are hilariously slower than advertised.

jem375, most of the bad feedback about DT on 10mmtalk is deleted.

Post up some links to these posts. Im sure they cant delete all of them. If youre gonna call them out, atleast provide your sources. DT and BB both have been very close to their listed ratings from the times ive chrono'd them.

 

[freakshow10mm]

Here's one. Longer barrel, much slower velocity.

http://www.ar15armory.com/forums/Double-Tap-Velocity-Sho-t66566.html

There's more there in the DT subforum. Read yourself.

 

[jem375]

yeah, 1% complaints, 99% positive.... it happens to just about all of the major manufacturers, different barrel lengths, altitude difference as one of the above posters mentioned, lots of things could have been different... I haven't chronoed it myself and it doesn't bother me one bit.. so what if it is 50-75 fps difference, big deal... Whatever it hits won't know the difference...
And by the way, you mention 1 posting about DT, but somehow forget to mention the dozens of articles that mention that DT is no doubt the best ammo you can buy for the 10MM....

 

[freakshow10mm]

Read a few more. There's some that were slower than Hornady ammo and were nothing more than hot .40s.

Look over on GT too. I'm not going to spoonfeed you the links, you can browse in Caliber Corner yourself.

Also spend some time on M4C and read comments from professionals whom opine DT doesn't know how to properly measure bullet expansion. Read comments from professionals whom opine not to use DT for defense.

If you want to buy DT, go balls out.

 

[jem375]

yes, will buy what I need from DT in 10MM and other calibers, since I have been shooting his products for years and have yet to have any complaints.
I mean come on, all you are trying to do is to advertise and sell your own ammo and knock down DT..

 

[freakshow10mm]

When in this thread have I advertised my products? Never. Thought so.

Double Tap does not operate in the same market segment as my company does. Double Tap markets to the high velocity/defense crowd and my company markets to the practice/LE training/standard velocity crowd. Entirely different.

 

[ku4hx]

I guess I'm just a cantankerous old fart, but somehow the idea of a manufacturer bad-mouthing the competition (on "non competition") on a free forum such as this is just not my idea of the intended spirit of the forum.

Rest assured, if DT is producing substandard ammo, and bilking the public, they wont be doing it for long. But one thing is abundantly clear, I don't patronize those vendors who have nothing better to say that how bad their competition, or "non competition", is.

I just don't need to be talked down to or to be told untrue what I know to be true in my circumstances.

Sorry guys, I probably said too much but I've lived with that problem for years and well, it's an old friend now.

 

[mljdeckard]

For a .45, I wanting it moving exactly how it was intended. 230 gr at 875 feet per second. This is how it was designed to work. What advantage is it you are seeking by increasing the velocity? I don't like to do anything to mess with this. I don't shoot it out of shorter barrels, (decreasing velocity and creating the need for lighter bullets,) or shoot +P ammo. (Increasing the velocity and pushing the bullet faster than it was designed for, opening the possibility of early expansion or failure to expand.) They way it was designed works. I don't mess with it. I carry regular pressure HSTs.

The 10mm was designed to be a high-velocity round. The .45 wasn't.

 

[Dog Wonder]

Mljdeckard: Thank-You for your insight- concerning pushing a round to a higher velocity!. DoubleTap & Buffalo Bore ammo are good ammo's but I feel I must do a little more research on their advertised ballistics before I decide to use these ammo's ! I really am hoping my research into their test results matches what data I find because I like both DoubleTaps & Buffalo Bores stats! I have talked with Mike Mcnett in the past and found that he sounded sincere in talking with me about his ammo!
I also am a former Marine Corp Siniper -Viet Nam Era Veteran and believe in fighting for free speech but not to the point where it completely invalidates in a very crude manner a citizen of our own country!


Thank-You everyone for your important shooter opinions concerning these ammo's!

 

[freakshow10mm]

Kuh4x, I've used DT ammo since before they were famous on internet gun forums. I speak from personal experience.

If something is one thing in your experience but different in someone else's experience, does that say something?

 

[ku4hx]

I stand by my comments and my experiences and I will make no other comments on this thread after this post. I have no problem with you stating your experiences you are certainly entitled to speak your mind. As a Viet Nam veteran, I believe my service might have played a small part in securing that freedom.

What I think is reprehensible is the manner in which you belittled DT. The manner in which you spoke and the words you chose are to me demeaning. I simply do not appreciate that sort of tact.

And, as my God given freedoms allow, I simply don't support vendors who make disparaging claims concerning others products in the manner in which you did. I believe Rocky Balboa would have called it a "cheap shot".

I'm done sir; you have the last word.

 

[amd6547]

I have used DT ammo in calibers 45colt, 40s&w, 357sig, 10mm, 9mm, and lately, 357mag. I do not own a chronograph, so I can not comment on actual velocity achieved.
I can say that in every case, recoil was greater than comparable factory ammo, prices were lower, and accuracy was excellent.
For me, when I acquire a new handgun, I check DT's offerings. When I got my SP101 I wanted a hot 125gn JHP to fire through it...The DoubleTap load definitely fit the bill. No problem relying on that load for SD, that is what my revolver is loaded with right now.

 

[IdahoLT1]

I stand by my comments and my experiences and I will make no other comments on this thread after this post. I have no problem with you stating your experiences you are certainly entitled to speak your mind. As a Viet Nam veteran, I believe my service might have played a small part in securing that freedom.

What I think is reprehensible is the manner in which you belittled DT. The manner in which you spoke and the words you chose are to me demeaning. I simply do not appreciate that sort of tact.

And, as my God given freedoms allow, I simply don't support vendors who make disparaging claims concerning others products in the manner in which you did. I believe Rocky Balboa would have called it a "cheap shot".

I'm done sir; you have the last word.

I didnt notice that he was an ammo manufacturer before. I was posting/reading from my phone and must have missed that part. I wont tell the guy how to run his business, but i do agree with you, that is very unethical. He wont be getting any business from me thats for sure.

 

[freakshow10mm]

The fate of my business doesn't rest on your shoulders. I'm doing quite fine without your business and will continue to do so.

 

[KBintheSLC]

DoubleTap is a better value than BB... same high quality at a better price.

DT is known for inflating their velocity figures quite a bit. BB has a more solid track record than DT in that regard. Some guys on 10mmtalk have been disappointed in the quality at DT lately.

I have a hard time accepting your comment as being unbiased since DT is probably your biggest competitor. BTW, I just clocked some DT 200g stuff last weekend. Its advertised as 1250 fps in a G20... I got 1254 on average. If that is not close enough, I don't know what is.

Nothing wrong with pitching your products here, but no need to bash DT in doing so. I have used their 9mm, 10mm, and 40 extensively with no noticeable problems.

 

[freakshow10mm]

DT is not a competitor. We don't compete in the same markets. Some people don't seem to realize that.

 

[jem375]

yeah, as soon as I saw you mentioning M4C I knew that. that website has a habit of down grading other products as inferior because most of the wholesalers and training gurus either don't sell it or advertise something else...