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doubling up, ear plugs+muffs

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by testosterone, Jan 7, 2010.

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  1. testosterone

    testosterone Member

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  2. Mr.Davis

    Mr.Davis Member

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    WRONG. Every 10dB doubles the sound level.
     
  3. hokeyplyr48

    hokeyplyr48 Member

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    Anyone have any experience with these? If it says they can be reused again and again why buy more than one pair? 6 pairs for a "personal" kit seems like too many if they can be reused.
     
  4. Manco

    Manco Member

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    While every +10 dB is thought to subjectively double the perceived loudness of a sound, the actual sound pressure level is increased by 10 times. In addition, +3 dB approximately doubles the SPL, just as Guns and more, the person to whom you were responding, said.
     
  5. Blues Brother

    Blues Brother Member

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    has anyone figured out the math for sure yet??
     
  6. Flynt

    Flynt Member

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    One thing that's always confused me: Comparing the electronic muffs with plain ones. Let's say a plain muff has an NRR of 30 and an electronic muff cuts off at 89 db. Which is better?
     
  7. Blues Brother

    Blues Brother Member

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    Excellent question.
     
  8. testosterone

    testosterone Member

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    I'm not positive, but this is how I think of it.

    If the muffs "block" above 89 db, in other words, the mechaism that block sound goes into effect above 89db, but they can reduce the sound impulse so much...

    There must be another rating(the NRR), and I think that is the absolute amount of noise that the muffs will shield you from once the sound block mechanism goes into effect.

    It's not like 100% of the sound above 89db is dropped(which would totally rock).
     
  9. GeezerwithGuns

    GeezerwithGuns Member

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    There you have it. We all need suppressors for "health" reasons. :neener:

    Benefits would surely outweigh all of the BS (& expense) you have to go through to get one.
     
  10. Manco

    Manco Member

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    Right, they all have an NRR rating in addition, and most of the ones I've seen, save for the expensive premium models, are not among the best as far as pure hearing protection goes. The way they're advertised, though, gives one the impression--and I've seen people make these claims for them--that they can block ALL of the noise above a certain level, which is certainly not true (the electronics will, based on their input, but the earmuffs themselves are usually kind of weak or middling in performance).
     
  11. Artiz

    Artiz Member

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    It's extremely effective. When I do that I don't flinch, and just enjoy shooting rather than thinking that's gonna hurt my ears.
     
  12. FRJ

    FRJ Member

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    I also use a mouthpiece like boxers use when shooting in a high noise area. You can destroy your hearing from the sound waves that come in thru your mouth. FRJ
     
  13. Ranb

    Ranb Member

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    It all depends on how you define intensity, noise, pressure level and loudness. Here is some math;

    Where X = Initial noise level minus final noise level in decibels.
    Change in intensity = 10^(X/10)
    Change in sound pressure level = 10^(x/20)
    Change in loudness = 10^(X/33.22)

    For intensity; 30 decibels is 1000 times the difference, 20 decibels is 100 times, 10 decibels is 10 times and 3 decibels is double.

    For sound pressure level (SPL); 30 decibels is 32 times the difference, 20 decibels is 10 times, 10 decibels is 3.2 times, and 3 decibels is 1.4 times.

    For loudness; 30 decibels is an 8 times difference, 20 decibels is 4 times, 10 decibels is double the difference.

    Frequency and how well a person hears is a big factor also. What an old man with hearing loss thinks sounds quiet can hurt a child’s ear.

    Ranb
     
  14. tom357mag

    tom357mag Member

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    Has anybody ever tried the Radians molded ear plug? Custom fit in 10 minuites and reusable. 26 NRR (dB) Rating
     
  15. Boba Fett

    Boba Fett Member

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    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    I haven't, but if it is only 26 NRR, I probably wont try them either. While I like the custom fit idea and have considered getting some made (i.e. at a doctors, not using some kit to do it myself), the custom plugs I've looked at offer better NRR than those.


    Plus the standard plugs I get from Wal-Mart or the drug store are 29-32 NRR depending on the brand I get.

    If you really want some good custom plugs, find a doctor that will help you make them. That's what I'm probably going to do eventually. In the long run, it'll be cheaper than buying the throwaway plugs, it should be more comfortable, and it should provide better protection.
     
  16. Harley Rider 55

    Harley Rider 55 Member

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    I wear both when shooting any big bore type rifle. Just the concussion of many of them, will get your attention.
     
  17. killchain

    killchain Member

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    I rock some Peltor Tacticals. I don't think I've ever doubled up. My hearing has always been good, even after my service and all of the shooting I've done since.

    My Father, however, grew up on a farm and now he doubles up because he's stone deaf. :p
     
  18. thorazine

    thorazine Member

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    Blah.

    Less bang takes all the fun out of shooting.

    Without the bang I would just take up golf.


    Or buy another suppressor. :D
     
  19. harmonic

    harmonic member

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    The way you actually hear something is that ganglia (small hairs in your inner ear) vibrate from the result of moving air hitting them, transmitting a message to your brain. When the ganglion are assaulted by an extremely loud stimulus (e.g. crash, jet engine, gun shot), they get "pushed down" a little. They never "stand back up" to their full extension. People lose their hearing as they get older as a result of continued assaults upon the ganglion, pushing them down more and more each time. This results in hearing loss, the ganglion are no longer able to effectively transmit a given message. The loss of frequency (pitch) recognition can be segments of the full spectrum, all hertz between low and high.

    Facts on noise levels:
    1. Decibels measure sound pressure and are logarithmic. That means that only a 3db increase almost doubles sound pressure, a 6db increase quadruples sound pressure, etc.
    2. Gradual hearing loss may occur after prolonged exposure to 90 decibels or above.
    3. Exposure to 100 decibels for more than 15 minutes can cause hearing loss.
    4. Exposure to 110 decibels for more than a minute can cause permanent hearing loss.
    5. At 140 dBA noise causes immediate injury to almost any unprotected ear.
    6. There is also the more extreme ‘acoustic trauma’, which is an immediate loss of hearing after a sudden, exceptionally loud noise such as an explosion.

    Comparative noise levels and length of time exposed to cause permanent damage
    Jet engine taking off 140 dB Instant damage
    Thunder/Ambulance siren 119 dB 3 minutes
    Hammer drill 113 dB 15 minutes
    Chain saw/Earphones/Concert 110 dB 30 minutes
    Bull Dozer 105 dB 1 hour
    Tractor/Power tools 96 dB 4 hour
    Hairdryer/lawnmower 90 dB 8 hours


    Noise levels of firearms:
    .22 caliber rifle 130dB
    .223, 55GR. Commercial load 18" barrel 155.5dB
    .243 in 22" barrel 155.9dB
    .30-30 in 20" barrel 156.0dB.
    7mm Magnum in 20" barrel 157.5dB.
    .308 in 24" barrel 156.2dB.
    .30-06 in 24" barrel 158.5dB. In 18" barrel 163.2dB.
    .375 18" barrel with muzzle brake 170 dB.
    .410 Bore 28" barrel 150dB. 26" barrel 150.25dB. 18" barrel 156.30dB.
    20 Gauge 28" barrel 152.50dB. 22" barrel 154.75dB.
    12 Gauge 28" barrel 151.50dB. 26" barrel 156.10dB. 18" barrel 161.50dB.
    .25 ACP 155.0 dB.
    .32 LONG 152.4 dB.
    .32 ACP 153.5 dB.
    .380 157.7 dB.
    9mm 159.8 dB.
    .38 S&W 153.5 dB.
    .38 Spl 156.3 dB.
    .357 Magnum 164.3 dB.
    .41 Magnum 163.2 dB.
    .44 Spl 155.9 dB.
    .45 ACP 157.0 dB.
    .45 COLT 154.7 dB.

    Properly fitted earplugs or muffs reduce noise 15 to 30 dB. The better earplugs and muffs are approximately equal in sound reductions, although earplugs are better for low frequency noise and earmuffs for high frequency noise.

    Using muffs and plugs together: Take the higher of the two and add 5 dB. 30 plug with 20 muff gives an effective NRR of 35.

    If you are shooting by yourself, with plugs and muffs on, you get to shoot up to a thousand rounds without damage (louder ammo/gun and the allowable drops by a factor of 5). Shoot with other people and you have to add all the rounds shot cumulatively (10 people shoot 100 rounds and everybody's done for the day; toss a handcannon or 30 cal rifle in and you're back down to 200 rounds cumulative). If you shoot on an indoor range then all the rounds fired while you are on the range go into your total. So you can see that it doesn't take very long on a range to have a thousand rounds popped off around you.

    Don't forget about bone conduction of concusive sound waves. The mastoid bone will transmit the sound vibrations directly to you inner ear where the cochela and the hearing nerves resides. Constant exposure to this kind of concusive sound waves, ie: 50 BMG, industrial heavey machinery, will result in the degradation of your hearing quality. Even with ear muffs, bone conduction is a big factor in hearing.
     
  20. harmonic

    harmonic member

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    Also, I started shooting before hearing protection became fashionable. I also attended stock car races and worked heavy construction equipment.

    There is a constant squealing noise in my ears. Sometimes it's worse than others, but it's always there.

    I sure wish we had known back then what we know now.
     
  21. oldbear

    oldbear Member

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    Hearing protection

    Having ridden off road motorcycles, played with race cars, shot high powered handguns, and having the drivers side window on the car open for years without hearing protection, sadly my hearing is shot and getting worse. I am very protective of what little hearing ability I have left so I always double up.

    Everyone, please believe me a sever hearing loss is really a pain for the person with the loss and everyone you have to interact with, so PLEASE PROTECT YOUR HEARING!!!!!!!!!!!:cuss::banghead:
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2010
  22. Harley Rider 55

    Harley Rider 55 Member

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    oldbear has it right. I've done my share of car racing and still ride in tight motorcycle packs. Protect what you have.
     
  23. GlockStar

    GlockStar Member

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    I've tired a number of headsets over the years and never settled in with a favorite.

    Any good sets to try?
     
  24. BLACKHAWKNJ

    BLACKHAWKNJ Member

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    I have been wearing plugs and muffs for years, it does make a difference. You will still absorb some sound through the rest of your body.
     
  25. General Geoff

    General Geoff Member

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    I think all the folks here who are older and have little hearing left due to years of shooting, should band together and write their congressmen urging them to remove silencers from NFA regulation.

    Easier silencer procurement could save the hearing of millions.
     
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