Educate me on M1 carbine

[greenhorng]

I am planning on trying to purchase one this year. I would like a GI model, not a new manufacture. I don't "need" one to fill any niche or purpose. I would just enjoy shooting and owning this particular piece of history. Not collector grade but not in terrible condition. So what am I looking for while researching and shopping? Also, what price point am I looking at? Thank you.

 

[figment]

What I saw at the last gun show in the specifications you are looking for was around $1000.00 to $1200.00 and upward. Since these were shipped back from Europe differently from the Garands in the Pacific, many of them are still mostly correct. (If you're interested in "historical" then "correct" is what you want.) To make the search easier you could decide which manufacturer you want like Singer, Rockola, Winchester...there are many types. They have and will continue to appreciate in value.

There are lots of online resources for this which google can provide.

 

[Reloadron]

You are looking at what would be called a shooter which most are. Call it a shooter or mix master. Around here at the shows a really good clean example will run you around $800 to $1,000 or more. Your call on what you are willing to spend. They were made by a wide range of manufacturers with the Inland division of General Motors having made the majority (about 43%). the original GI versions were also made by, Underwood, Rock-Ola, Quality Hardware, Winchester, National Postal Meter, Irwin-Pederson, Standard Products, International Business Machine and Saginaw Steering Gear Division (General Motors). Not all made the complete rifle so it is for example not unusual to see a Quality Hardware manufactured carbine with a Rock-Ola barrel. All you want is a shooter. I prefer the GI manufactured to the aftermarket flavors.

Ron

 

[greenhorng]

Thank you for the replies. I do want a GI model and figured I would be paying $1000-1200. If I do find a clean model I'm interested in, is there anything I should look to avoid? Are there proof or inspection marks that will always be present on specific parts no matter which manufacturer?

 

[strambo]

I was fortunate to inherit one from a friend's estate. I can't speak to specifics, but can confirm you are definitely on the right track. I have a GI Inland in decent condition (probably $800-$900 in the current market) and it is a joy to shoot. I love the little carbine and regret not buying a CMP one when I could have for $650 (I did get a Garand instead so I'm not a total idiot, but I could have gotten 1 ea). I stick to used GI 15 rd magazines.

 

[MEHavey]

I picked a Standard Products (pristine Underwood barrel) a while back for $600. After relieving about 1/8" under the recoil plate to lever the barrel up ~1/2" above the forearm at the barrel band -- thereby getting a firm pressure point-- it's a (relatively speaking) 50¢-driver.

No need to spend big bucks.

 

[lemaymiami]

Here are the sites I went to when I was learning about carbines.. Check them out

http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/
http://m1carbineforum.forumco.com/
http://forums.thecmp.org/index.php
http://www.milsurps.com/

 

[Furncliff]

I bought a National Postal Meter Carbine on Gun Auction last winter for $750. It is excellent cosmetically ( looks like an aftermarket walnut stock), it's been nearly flawless mechanically, accuracy is just ok. I wanted a shooter so I might re_barrel it, if I could get better accuracy out of it. Be careful about what you buy for ammo. I bought out a LGS stock of surplus ammo, planning to reload the brass. Turned out the ammo was made in Central America probably in the 50's and it has a weird flash hole, it may also have corrosive primers. Lot's of surplus ammo from lot's of different countries so... know what your buying.

I haven't shot mine much...yet, but I'm already planning to sell my other pistol caliber carbines, it's just a great rifle.

 

[briansmithwins]

Turned out the ammo was made in Central America probably in the 50's and it has a weird flash hole, it may also have corrosive primers.

I'd really, really hope that the ammo isn't corrosive. The short stroke piston on the carbine isn't supposed to be routinely stripped and there isn't any way to get corrosive primer salts out of it once they get in there.

I've shot corrosive through my AK and SKS, but those were designed with gas systems that easily strip down for cleaning.

BSW

 

[Reloadron]

Turned out the ammo was made in Central America probably in the 50's and it has a weird flash hole, it may also have corrosive primers.

I have a box of 30 Carbine sitting here marked LC 53. Looks to be a Lake City arsenal 1953 head stamp. The reality is the stuff is counterfeit Chinese manufacture is berdan primed and is corrosive. I keep it as a novelty item. The Chinese made the stuff and tons of the stuff ended up here in the US.

The US never manufactured corrosive 30 Carbine ammunition, unlike the 30-06 Springfield.

Ron

 

[CoalTrain49]

Invest in a muzzle erosion gage and check the wear before you buy one.

http://www.fulton-armory.com/muzzleweargaugefor300-303bores.aspx

A muzzle that is around 1-1.5 is what you want. Some carbines need to be rebarreled. Actually some have already been rebarreled when they were rebuilt at the arsenal. I have one that is a pretty good shooter at 1.5. I also had one with the original 43 barrel that was worn out. Didn't shoot real well. Also look to see if the barrel has been recrowned. A recrowned barrel indicates it was well used. Probably want to stay away from those.

Bolts are the next biggest potential problem. Those can be rebuilt for less than $100 and parts are out there. CMP forum is a good place to find parts. Usually an extractor or ejector gets worn and causes problems. Be prepared to rebuild a bolt because there really isn't anyway to check without stripping one or shooting the gun. Get a few USGI mags with the gun if you can, the only ones to have.

Yep, a grand will get you a good one if you know what to look for. CMP was a good source but those are gone. If you can find a CMP service grade rifle those are usually in good condition as CMP went through those before they sold them. They had certs that went with the gun.

Some make a big deal out of import marks on the barrel but for a shooter it matters little. It seems to be more of a tool to devalue the gun as collectors don't want them. Condition is what you want if all you are going to do is shoot it.

 

[CapnMac]

If you can, get a copy of Bruce Canfield's "Collector's Guide to the M-1 Garand and M-1 Carbine." He covers all of the marking made by all of the manufacturers. He also gives dates an d serial number ranges and the like.

If you are looking for a shooter, it's very likely to have all sorts of maker's marks on the parts. In fact the larger the variety, the better. In military service, all of the parts were interchangeable, so the armorers at each level--Battalion, Regiment, Brigade, Division, etc.--used the next part in the bin.

It is only now, in the richness of all the parts we have that a person can get replacement parts that match the maker on the receiver. Which, when that gets on GB or a show, suddenly adds $4-600 to the arm.

You kind of have to go with your gut if you are deciding between a couple carbines of similar price. I'd probably go with the best looking metal, rather than best wood; carbine stocks are just too easy to find. I'd be biased towards te flip-up "L" sight, but I'd also rather have the lever safety/push button magazine catch combo versus the button saftey/button mag catch.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Another thing about sights. The flip up sight was the original sight. Those are the ones collectors want because those are the ones that came with a lot of the early carbines. Eventually most of those were replaced by the adjustable sight. I prefer the adjustable sight for a shooter. Carbines need all the help they can get. The POI and POA wasn't in the same place on some with flip up sights. In other words the flip ups didn't work real well and neither did the original mag release. Collectors prefer both but I would rather have a rearsenaled carbine if I wanted a shooter.

In some states you will want a carbine without a bayonet type barrel band. I think they are illegal in CA. but don't quote me on that. You can easily change those. Also in some states the 15 rd mag is illegal. In NY I think you can just register mags with the local police.

 

[Ibmikey]

I have collected Carbines since my first DCM release in 1963, at one time had about fifty of the little gems along with many spam cans of ammo. As the years went by i gave a number of the Carbines to friends (gave a pristine M1A1 Inland to my buddy's daughter on her sixteenth birthday) and then got into SAA Colts and Cowboy Shooting. Still have quite a few Carbines left and shot a Texas Hog with a 1942 Inland last month, neat weapons. As discussed above most Carbines have gone through a rebuild or update at some point I have several that were GI duffle bag bring backs that seem to be as produced by the maker. One is a Rockola that came from the Pacific by a neighbors grandfather ( since deceased) who told me he brought the rifle back disassembled in his " barracks bag" and had used it on Guam. Unfortunately all i have is a memory of the conversation and the rifle in my safe.
Carbines are fun shooters and i fire all of mine and do not worry about collectability.

 

[CapnMac]

Starting to see some "estate sale" where the remaining family only knows that it was gran's old gun, and it goes for $100 or $150 to show up on a table with a $900 price tag. A few of those have the flip sights, others with the milled adjustable sights.

The Inland I had had been converted, so the sight overhung the maker's stamp. I never found that adjustable sight to be that useful--not in the way an 03A3 or Garand sight would. Which was fine by me, it shot minute of helmet with wwb.

Curses upon the '08 Bust that forced me to sell that gem.

 

[greenhorng]

Thanks for all the replies. Much to learn as I don't want to end up with a bad one. Haven't found any locally yet.