Effects of Cheney shooting on RKBA..

[Don't Tread On Me]

I don't think this qualifies as a dupe. I think we need a thread to discuss the potential fall-out from the Cheney incident.


What do you guys think might come out of this? If the guy dies as a result of this, it could be much worse. Even if he doesn't, hunting and shooting and most importantly, firearms have just been launched into the global spotlight in the most negative of ways.


Obviously every anti-gun group in the nation will be screaming for gun control as a result. But I'm not worried about them, that's their standard behavior. What I worry about is the GOP, or the administration trying to do damage control by perhaps pushing or allowing some sort of gun control bill slip in the near future.


They are extremely vulnerable. Iraq, the economy, gas prices and all sorts of other issues has the incumbant government in fear. They do not need a serious gun control issue right now. They'd gladly stick the knife in our backs in order to appease the mainstream who might consider this the last-straw for an administration that has screwed up in so many other ways.



What do you think might come out of this? What do we need to do to defend against this? What is the objective at the moment?

 

[ArmedBear]

No one's going to die.

28 gauge birdshot from 30 yards away.

This is just an attempt by the press to make something out of nothing.

Meanwhile, Gore tells the Saudis that we're imprisoning Arabs for no reason and treating them deplorably, the Iranian president is threatening to nuke Israel, daily, and Europe, already in an economic downward drift, is on the verge of a violent clash of cultures.

 

[El Tejon]

And the nexus between even more gun control laws and this accident is???

Nothing will come of this.

We should use this as an example to make gun safety and marksmanship mandatory in all public schools.

The objective never changes: destroy all gun control laws.

 

[Henry Bowman]

No one's going to die.

28 gauge birdshot from 30 yards away.

This is just an attempt by the press to make something out of nothing.

Meanwhile, Gore tells the Saudis that we're imprisoning Arabs for no reason and treating them deplorably, the Iranian president is threatening to nuke Israel, daily, and Europe, already in an economic downward drift, is on the verge of a violent clash of cultures.

And what mainstream America really cares about is who is going to win "Dancing with the Stars," "American Idol," "The Bachelor," "Survivor XVII," or the next episode of "Wife Swap." :banghead:

 

[KriegHund]

CNN has been reporting this 24/7 since its been reported. its fraking rediculous. Get some REAL news! yeesh.

As soon as i heard about it in yesterday i thought "Bah, more fodder for the anti's..."

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

Look, I agree that this isn't significant - at least from OUR perspective, but it can turn into something worse. They've reported that some of the shot "migrated" to his heart, causing him a minor heart attack. That seems a little more serious than initial reports would have us believe. Let's not forget that they tried to put a lid on this the first 24 hours. They're trying real hard to hide the severity of it. I don't think he'll die either, but even if he dies from complications related to everything that happened...you know how the leftwing haters will twist this. The media is already hard at work.


We'll have to wait and see if any long term effect on the current balance of RKBA is seen or not. It is just me, or does it make it more difficult now for the NRA, or for the GOP to promote or persue any pro-gun bills for quite a while after an incident like this? That's an effect on us wouldn't you agree?

 

[ArmedBear]

If I thought that the GOP had any intention to promote or pursue pro-gun bills, then I might think it will have some effect.

Truthfully, I don't have a whole lot of objection to hunter safety courses, or, for that matter, firearms safety being taught in schools. I'd rather know that the other guy in the field had to take a safety course.

 

[Ermac]

i dont think this is going to really affect our firearms ownership in anway
like some of the other posters said, its a media ploy
i do believe cheney shot by accident and it was truly an accident (although a stupid one) but it does make you wonder because 'Scooter was appointed by Willington......

 

[UWstudent]

We can't get [Osama] bin Laden, but we nailed a 78-year-old attorney.

- David Letterman

 

[ArmedBear]

Anyone here listen to Jerry Doyle? An interesting guy. Bashes the Republicans pretty hard. Not a GOP apologist by any stretch, but harbors no illusions about who runs CNN or the NYT and what their political objectives are.

Anyway, his take is that the press wants to bury the real stories of the day because they hurt the Democrats politically (Gore), and they undermine the wishful worldview of the current American Left that keeps saying that conflict in the Middle East is either made up, or the US' fault (Iran and Europe).

I tend to agree with him.

 

[RealGun]

The story, as far as guns are concerned, not politics, is very positive in that many will learn about hunter safety or be reminded of the rules.

 

[Brett Bellmore]

It's not going to have significant effect, for exactly the reason Armed Bear states: The Republicans weren't planning on doing any more for us anyway, (At the federal level, anyway.) so this doesn't spike anything they might have done. At the same time it doesn't make it any safer for them to screw us over, so they're not going to do that, either, as much as some of them might want to. And it has no effect on Cheney's political future, 'cause he doesn't have one.

At most, it might move up plans to replace Cheney with whoever Bush feels like anointing for the 2008 nomination. And the chances that was going to be somebody notably pro-gun were slim to none already.

 

[RealGun]

At most, it might move up plans to replace Cheney with whoever Bush feels like anointing for the 2008 nomination. And the chances that was going to be somebody notably pro-gun were slim to none already.

I disagree. I think Condi Rice would move up instantly.

 

[ArmedBear]

At most, it might move up plans to replace Cheney with whoever Bush feels like anointing for the 2008 nomination. And the chances that was going to be somebody notably pro-gun were slim to none already.

With one very interesting exception.

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

Interesting. We're touching on other issues that past threads have discussed. If all the hard work we've done, through the NRA and other methods over the past 10 years has resulted in a simple gun industry protection bill, then we're in trouble. Possibly also the political position to resist an AWB renewal also.


Ever since that industry protection bill, there's been ZERO buzz about anything else on the horizon. Nothing, nada, zilch. Nothing federal at least.


So I guess you guys are right, we won't lose any opportunies for pro-gun laws, since we exhausted them already. Heh, should be a T-shirt made that says: "We backed the GOP for 10 years, and all we got is this lousy industry protection"


I dunno, I see the left using this to nag and nag and nag for some form of guncontrol. Maybe not a bill, but later on in the future to use it as leverage on a future bill.


You guys don't seem to think of this as much, but I feel that this is a pretty big blow to us. At the very least, it has CHANGED THE SUBJECT. No longer will the subjects that we discuss, but rather the subject will be again in the negative. I'm hoping that this isn't a turning point where we go from being on the offensive, back onto the defensive.

 

[kennyboy]

I don't think we have anything to worry about. The only thing that we have to fear is that this may hurt Cheny's campaign if he chooses to run in '08, but I do not think it will have much effect. Everyone who I talk to seems to just laugh it off. Honestly, it's not like the VP purposely shot the guy or anything. Anyways, people like hunting and will, hopefully, just feel that VP Cheney was enjoying a day afield and an unfortunate accident occurred. I am not worrying about any gun control measures being taken as a result of this. Conservatives are still in control and I doubt they will pass gun control legislation-at least I hope they don't.

 

[ArmedBear]

Interesting. We're touching on other issues that past threads have discussed. If all the hard work we've done, through the NRA and other methods over the past 10 years has resulted in a simple gun industry protection bill, then we're in trouble. Possibly also the political position to resist an AWB renewal also.


Ever since that industry protection bill, there's been ZERO buzz about anything else on the horizon. Nothing, nada, zilch. Nothing federal at least.


So I guess you guys are right, we won't lose any opportunies for pro-gun laws, since we exhausted them already. Heh, should be a T-shirt made that says: "We backed the GOP for 10 years, and all we got is this lousy industry protection"


I dunno, I see the left using this to nag and nag and nag for some form of guncontrol. Maybe not a bill, but later on in the future to use it as leverage on a future bill.


You guys don't seem to think of this as much, but I feel that this is a pretty big blow to us. At the very least, it has CHANGED THE SUBJECT. No longer will the subjects that we discuss, but rather the subject will be again in the negative. I'm hoping that this isn't a turning point where we go from being on the offensive, back onto the defensive.

I do think that the AWB sunset was an accomplishment as well, though. Politically, it's usually a lot easier to let things quietly die than to make a big deal out of them.

I wouldn't be defensive, though. Just remind people that, if they were fishing and Cheney hooked a buddy with a couple of treble hooks, it wouldn't sound as bad as "he shot someone" but it would be about the same thing. My answer to people is, "It was a little shotgun (28 G) with birdshot at 30 yards. It's not what they make of it. That said, I'm glad I had to take a safety course to get MY hunting license, and I think everyone should take it." End of story. Works fine.

 

[Merkin.Muffley]

What do you guys think might come out of this?

Nothing significant. It's a hunting accident.

 

[RealGun]

Ever since that industry protection bill, there's been ZERO buzz about anything else on the horizon.

That is partly because Congress has been in full session only a couple weeks since. I see no reason to be pessimistic.

I expect the DC Gun Ban Repeal to come up again, but I don't find it on the active legislation list (Thomas). As part of the next round of DC appropriations would be my guess, probably late in the year.

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

Well, I don't think people understand what birdshot is, or what 28g is. All they know is GUN --> SHOT MAN ---> Man in intensive care for days. To the mainstream, a gun is a gun is a gun. Except when they are "educated" by anti-gunners at CNN or ABC or NBC that certain guns like 50calibers are extra-deadly.

 

[ArmedBear]

Well, I don't think people understand what birdshot is, or what 28g is. All they know is GUN --> SHOT MAN ---> Man in intensive care for days. To the mainstream, a gun is a gun is a gun. Except when they are "educated" by anti-gunners at CNN or ABC or NBC that certain guns like 50calibers are extra-deadly.

It's a good opportunity to explain it to them. If you don't take that opportunity, you're missing out.

 

[fourays2]

Non-shooters have been asking me my oppinion on this as a gun savant and I have been roaring with laughter as I tell them how overblown the media coverage of this is. I also use the opportuinity to point out the utter ignorance of the media in general as they try to spin this into something akin to Cheney opening up on the guy with a chain gun, and then segway into the media hysteria over 50cals. I then point out that if they are this ignorant about guns then they're probably just as ignorant about a lot of other topics. All in all I'd say I've made very good use of this media event.

 

[UWstudent]

Well, I don't think people understand what birdshot is, or what 28g is. All they know is GUN --> SHOT MAN ---> Man in intensive care for days. To the mainstream, a gun is a gun is a gun. Except when they are "educated" by anti-gunners at CNN or ABC or NBC that certain guns like 50calibers are extra-deadly.

exactly what i was thinking..

cheny could not run anymore, how the heck do you think he could debate again? all the opponent would have to say is "hell, at least i don't shoot people"..

it wont matter what the exact details are, accident or not.. the majority of the non-armed americans will think CHENEY WITH GUN SHOT MAN..
they probably wont even remember it was associated with hunting

 

[ArmedBear]

All in all I'd say I've made very good use of this media event.

Ditto.

BTW there's nothing wrong with emphasizing that, from what you heard, the guy did something that was a complete NO-NO, and sadly he paid the price. I've explained to a few people how, if 3 people go upland hunting, you divide up the field of fire and you don't walk into the line of fire, especially while ducking in the grass!

So far, people "get it."

 

[answerguy]

No one's going to die.

28 gauge birdshot from 30 yards away.

This is just an attempt by the press to make something out of nothing.

Meanwhile, Gore tells the Saudis that we're imprisoning Arabs for no reason and treating them deplorably, the Iranian president is threatening to nuke Israel, daily, and Europe, already in an economic downward drift, is on the verge of a violent clash of cultures.

Not so fast there ArmedBear, you've probably heard by now that the 'victim' has had a mild heart attack. If he were to die how would that change things?