Elk Hunting Round Advice

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LD, I think the 06 will work out just fine but I would suggest a quality 165gr bullet rather than the 180. I say this because it will flatten out the trajectory some and that will always simplify the shooting. It will fall within 100 fps of the velocity of the 300WM with 180 gr.
I also would say that the word magnum is/was just a gimmick they are all just metallic cartridges and is some crafty fellow back at the turn of the last century would have called the 06 a magnum because of its performance over the 30-40 the conversation would be different today. Magnum is just a word, there is really no criteria that I am aware of aside from the presence of the belt but then that is a "Belted Magnum".
 
Last elk season, while hunting in CO, i was able to get within 40 yards of several cow elk, but not within 450 yards of a legal bull. ( I saw over 50 elk while out there, on public land, but could not get close.) Had i practiced the longer shot, i may have had a more successful hunt.

I watched a shot taken at 547 yards... He missed the first shot, but killed the bull elk with the second shot in the neck, with a 300 Ultra mag. His son killed an elk at 75 yards with the same rifle the day before.

I purchased a 7mm remington magnum, and am shooting 180 grain premium bullets next elk hunt, if the chance rises again
 
Cob I think you summed up elk hunting right there in your last post and that is the advice I try to give. Know your range and be comfortable out to 500 yds and you will have a much more productive hunt.
I shoot a lot of elk at ranges that my 45-70 works fine on and when still hunting in snow or late season PL cow hunts I take my Guide Gun because it is short and light and a kick to hunt with but when I am in the competitive general hunt for bulls on public land I pretty much go to that 338-378 with its very powerful VXIII.
 
Again, many thanks. Good point on the .30-06 and the lighter bullet for flatter trajectory. We'll try both and see which one his rifle likes best.

As for 8mm Mauser, well since we aren't handloading, the 8mm factory loads that I have found are well underloaded to what they could be, because folks at the manufacturing end are afraid of the J and S bore confusion. Oh well. We're also not going for custom barreled receivers, and I am hoping he will opt for a Remington 700.


LD
 
My hunting buddy Jim uses a Rem 700 in 7 mag, that's his favorite elk rifle (likes it more than his 300 Weatherby). He's shot maybe a dozen elk with it, one hunt I was with him he took a bull across a canyon that ranged a touch over 500 yards.

Another friend of mine (experienced, successful elk hunter) took a bull a few years ago that ranged something like 475 to 500 I don't remember the exact yardage, with a .280. One shot, down it went.

Most of the elk taked by these guys are much closer though, but once in a while you have one at this kind of range and circumstances are that this is your only shot. These are guys who know what they're doing; these are not lucky lob shots! :D

The guy with the 7 mag shoots 165 grain bullets. That's a rifle that you can actually shoot enough to get good with, without hating it. Ballistically, it will do the job you are looking at.

Me I shoot a 270 and the only elk I took was close up. It's good on mule deer at 400 I've found.
 
I have on occasion seen deer 600+ yd away, but never took a shot at one at those distances it is much easier to stalk within 300 and take the shot rather then track them due to less then ideal energy/placement. I have never lost an anamal because I don't take marginal shots. I highly doubt I will ever take a shot past 500 too many variables to screw up your shot past that.
 
Go to a major retailer and look at the Hornady loads - they give the drop - trajectory right on the box. That's out to 500 yards, I think. Re that last 100 yards, just stalk a little closer. If not possible you can reference the ballistic performance of like loads and figure the additional drop. If you don't have a good rangefinder and elevation change compensator............then give the elk a break and don't pester him. Just note that the drop gets measured in FEET before you get too far out there.
 
Interlock, Only 2 of mine over the years has been more than 250 yards. That was in my younger, brasher, less thoughtful days. I've said it 1000 times in here. You would be 10000000 times prouder of an Elk that you stalked up to a decent range than the false bravado you would get from "sniping" one at 700 yards. Yes there are times and places that make a stalk to a reasonable range impossible. Like spotting one across a canyon at close to dusk with only 30 minutes of legal shooting time left. Well guess what, rather than taking a possible chance of gut shooting that Elk and never finding it, how about letting the thing go and stalk it the next day or even the next year. No amount of pride, money, or chest thumping is worth the needless suffering of an animal being gut shot.
 
i am a little confused... are all elk shots really long? if so why?

thanks

Anywhere from 35 yds to around 500 for me.

Why?

Geography


I have lived and hunted in the Rocky Mtns for 30 yrs and have hunted multiple species each season and sometimes, especially with elk I have hunted and killed 3 in a year. I have seen pretty much most scenarios and try not to judge others and how they claim their game.
I spent the first 20 yrs in MN and IA and hunted bow and gun, the west and midwest are miles apart in many ways.
 
Cross canyon ,elevated shooting positions,across a cienega. In the west these areas give us a better view of the animal. If your in the thick timber your shots are very close.
 
Anywhere from 35 yds to around 500 for me.

Why?

Geography


I have lived and hunted in the Rocky Mtns for 30 yrs and have hunted multiple species each season and sometimes, especially with elk I have hunted and killed 3 in a year. I have seen pretty much most scenarios and try not to judge others and how they claim their game.
I spent the first 20 yrs in MN and IA and hunted bow and gun, the west and midwest are miles apart in many ways.
30 years of hunting and long range shooting practice might make it viable to shoot at game at 500yds. To me I think I would be deterred by the risk of the game moving before the bullet hits and thus make the shot go bad.

However, if you've got the experience and skill, I won't sit by my keyboard and tell you you're doing it wrong. If you were to come here and tell me that you didn't yet even own a long range hunting rifle and didn't have a clue as to what (factory made) hunting ammunition you should use in it for these extremely long range shots I would definitely tell you that you're doing it wrong.

OP, you're doing it wrong, and when you're new, that's perfectly fine. The reason people are upset is that we're afraid that if you don't get this straight then there's a risk of you taking unethical shots at live game. They are unethical because of the high risk of wounding the animal.

Get a "normal" hunting rifle that carries well and has a decently flat trajectory. I've got a .308 loaded with 165gr bullets and it's flat enough for me. When thinking of North American elk hunting the .270 winchester comes to mind.

ETA: I don't want to come across as harsch or as an internet tough guy, I'm having a bad morning is all. LD, I don't know much about you and my recommendation is based on a guess on your conditions. You might be a perfectly skilled and experienced, but you don't sound like it in the original post.
 
I suggest the .300 win mag. or the .338 win mag
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An experience from the past...I hunted with Bart. He tells of hunting elk with Leonard. Bart carried a 338, Leonard a 300 Win Mag. Lots of debate about the better gun. One day on the way back to camp some Spruce Grouse surrendered in front of Bart, and he took ones head off...body shots tooooo effective...good camp dinner that eve. Leonard wants one, shoot miss a few times (yes those Spruce chickens are that dumb). Bart sez.. Leonard you're hittin him, but just not killing him. Leonard ate his can of beans in silence even after Bart offered to share his Spruce chicken.
I have only killed one elk myself. .50 cal front loader, 90 yards, faced right at me, through the neck, died where he stood. The old time' mountain men were not under gunned.
 
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I've seen 3 elk killled (2 mine, and 1 my buddy's). The longest shot taken was at 180 yards and killed with my 7mm Mag. Shortest was 75 yards, also killed with my 7mm mag. My buddy killed his at 150ish yards with his .30-06. You don't need the latest crazy ultrasuperdupermagnum to kill an elk. Get a rifle you're comfortable with, buy quality ammo with midrange for caliber bullet weight, and practice with it. Know your range limitations and stick with them. It's hard to go wrong with the .30-06, but I prefer something a bit more odd. My next elk hunt will be with my .35 Whelen.

The areas I hunt and the manner in which I hunt them will never see me taking a 500 yard shot, but maybe that's just me.
 
I have said before and truly believe that Magnum is only a word used to sell guns, you can find many incremental increases in performance throughout the evolution of firearms that occurred without the Magnum label.
Look at your choice as simply performance based without the salesman's nomenclature and a lot of the back and forth can be eliminated.
I also believe that there is much joy in owning many firearms so I don't get all hung up on the notion that one must do it all in all ways. If what you get doesn't suit you you can always get another, they aren't wives ya know. Look at em more like girlfriends ;)
 
I've preached this one to many times probably but here goes again. I've killed some elk in my time, more than some, less than others and here is my take on it.

If you've got a rifle and scope combo that is capable of reaching out say 300 to 400 yards you've got the long range end of it covered. If you find yourself having to shoot more than 400 yards on an elk that's a desire not a necessity.

The most important aspect of an elk rifle is a bullet that will penetrate well and the ability to hit with that rifle from about 20 yards in the thick timber out to 300 or maybe a bit more if the need arises.

I've killed one elk at 443 yards my furthest (.375H&H)and I've killed a couple more at 300 ish yards. The vast majority have been at 200 and under. And a good number of those have been at under 100 yards busting tail through the timber because some of my hunting partners are MORONS (one in particular, sorry Tim but it's true;)) and don't do what they're told leaving me to tidy up loose ends from blown stalks, and having to make snap shots in the timber. WHICH is why I prefer something like a .375H&H or a .338 or a .35 Whelen that gives reliable deep straight line penetration. They can handle the heavy hauling at close range and they get it done at longer ranges too.

I wouldn't dream of trying some of the shots that I am comfortable with a .375 on elk in the timber with a .300 or a 7MM they just don't have the penetration I need and they tear up way to much meat at close range.

Fricking guys skypopping at elk with their "long range" set ups do a lot more wounding than killing. I am sick and tired of it.

To me the ability to hit confidently at close range when the chips are down are far more important than having a purpose built long range rifle.

So that means a rifle that balances well between the hands, has a short enough barrel so as to allow for a quick swing, a stock that fits and a scope that is mounted low enough that when you put the rifle up it's right there no head movement necessary. It should be easy to carry and light enough that it isn't a burden but not so light that it becomes difficult to shoot unsupported. IMO it should weigh in loaded with a scope from 8 to 10 lbs If you can't carry that all day in the mountains you've got a fitness issue not a rifle issue.

Unless you are sitting on a hill side with a supported shooting position and that is all you are going to do. A long barreled, unwieldy, target scoped rifle is a burden not an asset in elk country.

I know a guy who sits in the same spot every year and kills an elk almost every year who shoots a 14 lb target built .340 Weatherby. He has killed elk at over 700 yards with it. To me that is target shooting an elk and completely destroys the essence of what elk hunting is. BTW he is also a master level long range shooter and spends most of the year shooting F class various 1000 yard and high power shooting competitions, long range is this guys life.

To each their own.

To me elk hunting is cruising thick timber and glassing parks and meadows. Ghosting silently form vantage point to vantage point, seeing lots of new country. Getting in close enough to smell them, catching that ear twitch or hearing a bull knock his antlers against a branch right over the next little dip at spitting range. That's the stuff that gets my blood flowing. Getting in on them and fooling them at their own game in their own back yard.
 
I've preached this one to many times probably but here goes again. I've killed some elk in my time, more than some, less than others and here is my take on it.

If you've got a rifle and scope combo that is capable of reaching out say 300 to 400 yards you've got the long range end of it covered. If you find yourself having to shoot more than 400 yards on an elk that's a desire not a necessity.

The most important aspect of an elk rifle is a bullet that will penetrate well and the ability to hit with that rifle from about 20 yards in the thick timber out to 300 or maybe a bit more if the need arises.

I've killed one elk at 443 yards my furthest (.375H&H)and I've killed a couple more at 300 ish yards. The vast majority have been at 200 and under. And a good number of those have been at under 100 yards busting tail through the timber because some of my hunting partners are MORONS (one in particular, sorry Tim but it's true;)) and don't do what they're told leaving me to tidy up loose ends from blown stalks, and having to make snap shots in the timber. WHICH is why I prefer something like a .375H&H or a .338 or a .35 Whelen that gives reliable deep straight line penetration. They can handle the heavy hauling at close range and they get it done at longer ranges too.

I wouldn't dream of trying some of the shots that I am comfortable with a .375 on elk in the timber with a .300 or a 7MM they just don't have the penetration I need and they tear up way to much meat at close range.

Fricking guys skypopping at elk with their "long range" set ups do a lot more wounding than killing. I am sick and tired of it.

To me the ability to hit confidently at close range when the chips are down are far more important than having a purpose built long range rifle.

So that means a rifle that balances well between the hands, has a short enough barrel so as to allow for a quick swing, a stock that fits and a scope that is mounted low enough that when you put the rifle up it's right there no head movement necessary. It should be easy to carry and light enough that it isn't a burden but not so light that it becomes difficult to shoot unsupported. IMO it should weigh in loaded with a scope from 8 to 10 lbs If you can't carry that all day in the mountains you've got a fitness issue not a rifle issue.

Unless you are sitting on a hill side with a supported shooting position and that is all you are going to do. A long barreled, unwieldy, target scoped rifle is a burden not an asset in elk country.

I know a guy who sits in the same spot every year and kills an elk almost every year who shoots a 14 lb target built .340 Weatherby. He has killed elk at over 700 yards with it. To me that is target shooting an elk and completely destroys the essence of what elk hunting is. BTW he is also a master level long range shooter and spends most of the year shooting F class various 1000 yard and high power shooting competitions, long range is this guys life.

To each their own.

To me elk hunting is cruising thick timber and glassing parks and meadows. Ghosting silently form vantage point to vantage point, seeing lots of new country. Getting in close enough to smell them, catching that ear twitch or hearing a bull knock his antlers against a branch right over the next little dip at spitting range. That's the stuff that gets my blood flowing. Getting in on them and fooling them at their own game in their own back yard.
Very, very well spoken. This thread could easily begin and end with H&H's post.

35W
 
Don't see much to disagree with in H&H's post aside from a few yards more or less. I will even say that at times I handicap myself to 150 yds and under by hunting with a short barreled 45-70. The pleasures he described of the up and close hunt are indeed more exhilarating than the longer shots through glass but I hope we can agree that terrain does play a huge part in the western hunt.
 
If I were at leisure to buy a new rifle of any caliber I wished to hunt elk at any conceivable distance I would get .300 Win Mag and call it good.
Personally I have killed elk with a 45-70, 6.5x55, 30-06 and 30-40AI. Longest shot - 225 paces, shortest 45 paces. I would never shoot at an elk that was 600 yards away, but if somebody else wants to I think a .300 Win Mag would be the right medicine for the job.
 
If I were building a long range purpose built elk rig it would be in a .340 Weatherby or a .338 RUM or something similar.

Reason being that I'd want full penetration with an exit so that I'd have a decent blood trail to follow after I flubbed my long range shot which is going to happen you eventually at any range but especially at long range.

And after I flubbed my long range shot on that elk I'd want my good old .375 carbine in my hands for the follow up because a huge target rifle with a huge target scope is next to worthless for the second half of the job. That's the part where I jump that three legged elk out of thick cover at 50 yards and have to pop him as he runs through lodge poles quartering hard away at full three legged speed.
 
Does anyone remember when we used to brag about how close we got? :banghead:

But I guess its cause Im shootin a little peeshooter 7mm Mauser (Bell who?? He did what with a .275 Rigby?) :cool:
 
Here we go AGAIN!
In my humble opinion, the super long range stuff IS bunk!
All of you future/ prespective Elk/Mule Deer /Antelope Hunters should do yourself a BIG favor and READ ( God Forbid) what the late ,great Jack O'Conner has to say about long shots on game animals.
600 yards?? Gimme a break!
As in my previous posts. I have taken Deer at 250+ yards and for me THAT is EXTREME.
Rethink the 600 yard shots.
 
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