Enclosed Hammer or Open?

[Brass Rain]

So I'm still mulling over concealed carry options and had been thinking of a Smith & Wesson 637 for quite a while. But I kind of like the look of the black-finished 442 that only comes in an enclosed hammer design. I know in the rare chance (I hope!) of ever having to draw in a bad situation, there's an even smaller chance of it being reasonable to cock the hammer first. And it's just something to possibly hang up on clothing. But the ability to fire a more accurate shot with a much lighter trigger pull is a good thing, and I like the looks of the open hammers. For those of you whom carry snubbies, how many carry an open hammer design and how many an enclosed, and why?

Also, I came upon an old THR topic on the 637 of someone complaining of it having a really weak finish that flakes off and of having weak parts--that's it's a "poor quality" gun. From everything I've ever read of Smith & Wesson I'd like to think this isn't true. And it was written in 2004. Can anyone speak to the contrary?

 

[David E]

With practice you can shoot DA just as accurately as SA simply by "staging" the trigger. This is when you quickly pull the trigger thru 98% of its travel, confirm the sights, then complete the pull.

Soon, you won't have to pause.....but it does require practice and most folks don't want to put in the required time.

 

[451 Detonics]

The last thing you need in a HD/SD situation when your adrenalin is pumping is a super light and short trigger pull. However you can have both the covered hammer as well as the SA capability in the S&W 638, 438, etc.

 

[jon86]

Yup, as already mentioned, the 638/438 offers the best of both worlds.

 

[Brass Rain]

Yup, as already mentioned, the 638/438 offers the best of both worlds.

I've seen those, and they do seem ideal for what I'm talking about. It's just... I know it's silly, but the hump on the back kind of bugs me. I just don't really like the look of them. Maybe if I look at them long enough it will go away.

 

[motorcycle-charlie]

i have always liked look of the bodyguard frame. if you cant get over the look, you should go with the centennial enclosed hammer frame. if you are getting this gun to carry, you really shouldnt need the SA capability. if you still want the SA, you can get the exposed hammer version and have a gunsmith do a partial bob job on the hammer. round off the hammer spurr enough so it doenst snag on the draw, but leave enough so you can cock it back for SA shot if you desire.

 

[hardluk1]

You do NOT want to cock the hammer on a defence handgun. You could under the pressure pull the lighter SA trigger by mistake. Learn to shoot DA only for a CC gun. After that it don't matter which you buy, just get the one you get the best deal on but many older one have not been shot much and work smoother than one ones. I got a very good deal on an open hammer revolver I just don't use it. DA shooting only.

 

[BossHogg]

That hump on the 638 may look odd at first but after a while it starts to look like the best of both worlds. Highly recommended for pocket carry.

 

[sansone]

I like exposed hammers. Bobbed is OK

 

[M2 Carbine]

The best of both worlds.
The hammer is suprisingly easy to use.


Personally I don't like DA. I've had to draw my revolver 4 times and always had time to cock the hammer.
But for close up (under 7 yards), fast, repeat shots, cocking the hammer is too slow.
With a good bit of practice you can get pretty fast and accurate up close. (I shoot about 3 hundred fast DA rounds a week, with S&W J Frames. This practice is on the move and back to 7 yards. I still miss COM 4-5 shots out of 50 and this is not acceptable.)

Even at long distances the target can be reliably hit with aimed DA fire, but it's a lot easier cocking the hammer.
52 yards, DA, standing, two hands.

 

[451 Detonics]

Of course if you get lucky you can find a Detective Special and factory shroud and have a nice 6 shot pocket gun.

 

[scaatylobo]

I do not believe in a cocked revolver for 99% of any and all S/D situations.

that being the case my 2 favorites for BUG in revolver are the S&W 442 and a 640-1 that I also carry as BUG's.

Practice is THE key as was mentioned !!.

 

[Old Fuff]

When a revolver is carried under deep cover a conventional hammer spur can snag on the covering garment or pocket, and if not covered by a holster rub against the garment and soon abrade it into rags. This in itself is enough to recommend either bobbing off the hammer spur or carrying a revolver with the hammer shrouded or enclosed.

But in addition, if the hammer is "cockable" in the single-action mode, and you have to use it in a shooting, you can end up being accused of unintentionally shooting someone when under stress you touched the "hair trigger" of your cocked gun.

Now while this sounds far fetched to some, it happened enough times to cause some of the largest police departments and federal law enforcement agencies in the country to have they're conventional revolvers converted to double-action only (DAO).

In short, choosing a revolver with an enclosed or shrouded hammer can eliminate a number of different issues.

Concerning the finish on S&W aluminum frame revolvers. Yes, they did have problems, and owners that returned their guns got them refinished for free. At this point I believe the issue was addressed and solved - but in making a choice you should take it into consideration.

 

[Jim Watson]

Unlike M2, I find the shrouded hammer on my old M38 to be tough to cock. It had just as well be an M42, I use it strictly DA.

In 1960 Chick Gaylord wrote in favor of SA capability for long shots but times and techniques have changed.

 

[Hondo 60]

While I can certainly see the advantages of the enclosed hammer, HOLY CRAP they're ugly!!!!!!!!
They remind me of a humpback whale.

I'm just glad all of us have different tastes.
That way we have variety that doesn't cost 4 arms & 6 legs.

I like my SAAs for target shooting, a S&W J-Frame for pocket carry & a 357 or 9mm on the table or nightstand next to me!

 

[jad0110]

For me, it depends on the carry method. For pocket carry, I don't do traditional hammer spurs. It's gotta be enclosed, shrouded or bobbed.

For IWB/OWB, concealed or open carry, I can do whatever. But all the guns I carry on my belt have hammers, and I train to put my thumb over the hammer as I draw to avoid snags. Works quite well. I have more trouble with that technique on drawing from a pocket though.

YMMV.

With practice you can shoot DA just as accurately as SA simply by "staging" the trigger. This is when you quickly pull the trigger thru 98% of its travel, confirm the sights, then complete the pull.

Soon, you won't have to pause.....but it does require practice and most folks don't want to put in the required time.

This too. Dry fire practice helps tremendously as well. Just check several times to make sure your weapon is unloaded before doing this, obviously. I've gotten in the habit of using snap caps, simply because it forces me to open the cylinder and place 5, 6 or 7 snap caps in each chamber. Extra safety measure.

 

[motorcycle-charlie]

one more advantage of the centennial enclosed hammer is the fact that lint and pocket grit really cant make its way down into the gun. i get lint and grit on my 442 and simply blow it off with a can of that air used to clean computer keyboards with or simply hit it with the air hose at work. (softly)

 

[camsdaddy]

I had a M38 early smith bodyguard that I liked quite well. I have sold it and purchased a 642 with encolsed hammer. My reason being though it may be mental the DA action of the 642 is smoother than that of the M38. I can actually shoot the 642 quite well. I also have recently purchased a SP101 with the hammer and 3" barrel. I carry appendix. I slide my thumb behind the grip and pull up and grab. I am unable to guard the hammer with my hand. I have caught my garments during draw practice. For this reason I will either sell the SP101 and buy a 2" DAO or eventually bob the hammer of the 3". I carry a M13 strongside and have no issues. I think its because I have to do a more intentional sweep of my cover garment.

 

[Brass Rain]

Thanks for the recommendations. I guess enclosed/covered is definitely the way to go.

 

[M2 Carbine]

While I can certainly see the advantages of the enclosed hammer, HOLY CRAP they're ugly!!!!!!!!
They remind me of a humpback whale.

I have to agree with you there. I've always liked my Model 60........


.....but IMO this hump back does ugly up the gun........ it shoots good though.

 

[motorcycle-charlie]

i also have an sp101 but the 2.25 barrel with the factory bobbed hammer. i also will carry it appendix in my carry rotation once i have shot it a bit more. its a great gun. just put a meprolight night sight on it. no snags on the draw. its a keeper. for me, iwb carry cant have a hammer. just one more thing to remember to cover in what might already be a stressful situation. i know some guys practice and are good at it but the less you have to remember, the less you will forget.

 

[motorcycle-charlie]

i like the humpback

While I can certainly see the advantages of the enclosed hammer, HOLY CRAP they're ugly!!!!!!!!
They remind me of a humpback whale.

REALLY? NO ONE LIKES THE BODYGUARD SHROUD? i think it is a classic look. very distinctive. getting a nicely blued bodyguard is high up on my want list. the more i look at them the more i want one. i'll even take one in nickle.

 

[BBroadside]

A decision I made a while back was to be as double-action as possible. This is because I want to get used to the long, smooth trigger pull of a good a revolver as much as possible with the limited time available to me for practice. So a hammer spur is just a temptation. (Interesting: I've heard that the British Army bobbed the hammers on its Enfield No. 2s for the same reason - to keep recruits from training in a way they wouldn't be shooting as a way of artificially raising their scores. Others say it was to keep the hammers from hanging up on things, but most holsters from that era look like they cover the weapon completely.

So I'm looking at Centennials, the LCR, various bobbed-hammer guns, etc., and ruling out single-actions. I can see why the Bodyguard would be the best of both worlds for others, though.

 

[Guillermo]

I guess enclosed/covered is definitely the way to go

while I tend to agree with you, you have at least two very smart guys with a ton of experience on the other side of the issue. It would not be wise to ignore David E or Old Fuff.

David has argued that the 442 can be grasped higher thus making for quicker follow up shots. Old Fuff points out that it is unlikely that you would ever need single action in a SD scenario.

My point has been that it is conceivable that one might have to take a long shot and the single action option is nice to maintain. Of course with practice you can shoot just as well double action.

So while I still prefer the shrouded hammer for belt carry...I do respect their learned opinions.

Were I a "pocket carry" guy I might go with the 442. I think it was Colonel Applegate that said (something to the effect) that it was the finest short range defensive weapon ever devised. And who am I to argue with him?



(in the name of full disclosure, I carry a 6 shooter on the belt so I do not have a dog in this hunt)

 

[Haywood]

The 442 is my favorite looking Revolver. I always carried one until I found the 357LCR. I don't like the looks of the LCR as much but, I like the 357 cal.