Ever wanted to kill another hunter during hunting season?

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H&Hhunter

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Last elk season in CO I damn near killed some SOB slob POS whom happened to be carrying a rifle during hunting season. I won't refer to him as a hunter.

We hunted during second combined elk season last year and the first couple of days I always bring my wife and children up and we ride the horses drive the truck around and generally "hunt" the first couple of days in a way so that my two girls age 8 and 5 can have an enjoyable time and feel as if they've participated in the hunt.

In any case on the first day we rode the horses out of camp all lathered up in hunter orange and went right up the side of a mountain riding an old loggers cut and gaining altitude rapidly. Finally ending the ride at the summit with a gorgeous view of the Roaring Fork valley and the Maroon Belles across the valley. After a quick picnic we "hunted" a couple of coulees and draws and the girls identified some fresh elk sign. My 8 year old kept assuring me that with sign this fresh these poor elk could run but they weren't going to hide from her daddy.

About mid afternoon we walked the horses back down the ridge in a leisurely gate generally enjoying the mountains and the freedom of being an American in some of gods greatest country. A beautiful landscape is breathtaking in it self. It's an unimaginable sense of freedom and liberty and happiness to experience that landscape with a well tuned rifle in your hands. GOD BLESS AMERICA.

At about 16:00 we arrived in camp unsaddled the stock and fed and watered them. My wife and kids decided to stay in camp as myself and my hunting buddy a retired FBI agent and Marine decided to head up the opposite ridge line and glass the afternoon into dark to see if we couldn't pick up some movement somewhere.

About 15 minutes before dark we headed off the hill. Of course the walk down was much quicker than the steep climb up and just at last light we were approaching camp when it happened.

A loud crack and a shower of bark and leaves showered me as a high powered bullet zinged through the trees not ten feet over my head. My first reaction was to drop and find cover. My Ex Marine retired FBI buddies reaction was somewhat startling to me... He yelled don't drop there move out run now. He immediately started a low yet shockingly fast crouched run down the hill across and away from the line of fire I followed suite as more rounds started to crack through the branches above and around me.

It was about this time that I realized that camp was directly in the line of fire. I yelled for the kids to "get down, get behind something!!"

About that time my buddy Doug hit the camp perimeter and scooped up my youngest daughter and put her behind a rock I was running as fast as I could but my legs seemed as if they were in concrete boots I just couldn't cover the ground I needed to fast enough. By the time I got to camp the shooting had stopped 5 or 6 rounds had been fired and several had struck inside my camp perimeter narrowly missing my horses my wife and my children.

I was seeing red I was so hot that at that moment I am sure to this day I'd have killed the SOB responsible if he'd have been present. I'd have killed him without a second thought and with extreme prejudice with any available tool or my bare hands if that's all I had. You can shoot at me that's not going to be good for you but your welcome to try. Once you put my kids in the picture it's a whole nother story boys and girls you just F----up big time!!


I off loaded my pack checked the rounds in my .44mag grabbed my keys and headed for the truck. Half way there I was stopped by Doug who said "listen I know how you feel I'm coming with you and you only have to do two things. one let me do all the talking, two don't start anything and let me do all the talking." Oh yeah if the SHTF back me up.

It wasn't hard to find the shooters as they were camped directly above us on the next switch back in the road. I was still in full kill mode when we pulled into there camp tactically illuminating the area with headlights. Doug with over twenty years of Law Enforcement experience approached the subjects with caution keeping every one covered. I was hoping to find some drunk mouthy SOB whom desperately needed a severe case of my fists. And even more so was just waiting for someone to produce a weapon so I could drop him. I was that mad..

Instead what we found was a dad with two teenage children who were obviously scared and clinging to their father. They could sense the rage in aggression in our movements and tone. And they knew that they'd made a mistake. My heart went out to the children. I realized at that moment that this had all been a terrible and almost tragic mistake.

Doug defused the situation and I immediately calmed down. There is a big difference between malicious and stupid this guy had been plain ole stupid with a capitol S.

The guy was from downtown Denver via some other sate further to the west on the Pacific ocean....And this was his first time ever hunting. He'd brought his two children up to the woods to experience the same things and for the same reasons that we'd brought our children to the woods.

The major difference being he had no idea as to the power and lethality of the rifle he'd been carrying. It seems that he'd tacked a target up to a pine tree so he could sight in his rifle. He didn't think that the bullets could go all the way through the tree. He didn't stop to think that there was a road and a camp not 150 yards directly in line and below his target. It never occurred to him that his bullets were damn near the end of my life as I know it. It never dawned on him that being an outdoorsman and a hunter and a shooter is one of the most awesome responsibilities a free man can have. It also never occurred to him that if he'd have killed one of my family members there would have been no jury, no judge but there would have been an execution right then and there. As it damn well should have been. There are some things in this life worth fighting, dieing or going to prison for. But I'm sure glad now that I didn't have to bring it to that level.

I guess what it boils down to is that while we all have the right to enjoy this country and to bear arms some of us don't have the background to do it. They need some training and mentorship before they go out into the wild. Apparently Hunter safety isn’t cutting it for some folks... :banghead:
 
Thank God I've never been in a situation anywhere near that. I'm glad to hear everything turned out OK.

Sadly, I think your last statement is a big understatement. There aren't nearly enough hunters who are shooters first, hunters second (or at least make an effort to know something about guns). The guy my dad and I hunt with is safe, but he knows absolutely nothing about his rifle. Didn't know what brand it was or what "270" meant until we told him and has absolutely no concept of bullet weight. I'm not even completely sure that he knows how to adjust the scope. About all he knows is that his gun is a "270" and to buy "270 ammo."

It's too bad. A lot of hunters who aren't shooters don't know what they're missing out on.
 
This kind of story or situation is repeated time after time. I have had one experience along these lines and I knew for sure that the other hunter did not see me. Hunting is one thing, but taking shots at a target from camp is a controllable situation and they should have been shooting into a backstop (ie. dirt). PERIOD. A tree is not a proper backstop. I hope that the other hunter learned a very valuable lesson and understood the seriousness of the situation. These things can get out of hand quite easily especially if there is an injury. Some would just call that justice.

I'm glad you had a buddy with you. Thank you for telling your story.
 
I don't know about killing but a good clubbing is sometimes called for.
I've looked thru my binoculars at some sob a scoping me out. dude you can see the orange with out any glass.
then there is the slob who will come up my back side, say hello and then walk up the line I'm watching.
 
H&Hhunter wrote"

" I guess what it boils down to is that while we all have the right to enjoy this country and to bear arms some of us don't have the background to do it."



I don't mean to rehash the whole "hunter vs. shooter" thing, but nico nailed it.

The vast, and I do mean VAST majority of hunters around here in western Arkansas don't know a damn thing about guns in general.

They are often times slightly less knowledgable about guns than taxi cab drivers are about the workings of an internal combustion engine.

There are, as I keyboard these words, literally THOUSANDS of "hunters" within one hour's drive of where I sit who are still working their way through that one box of twenty 30-30 shells they bought at Wal-Mart three years ago.

Three rounds to confirm zero on a paper plate at 50 yards, one round to shoot a deer.......heck, there's still 8 rounds in that box from three years ago.

But that's the true price of freedom.

Freedom means even the doofuses and idiots get freedom, too.

And that's a price I am personally happy to pay. I'll gladly deal with doofuses and idiots and take my chances if it means I get to be free, too.

hillbilly
 
I've had nearly the exact same thing happen to me, but it wasn't pass through shots dropping around me, it was ricochets. I don't know exactly how close they were coming as they went by, but they were LOUD. One puffed up the dirt about 15 feet away. I went to where they were, the LONG WAY, and found a father and son shooting over the hood of a pickup truck. I asked them if they heard the bullets bouncing, they said yeah, and I asked if they had any F___ing IDEA WHERE THEY WERE BOUNCING TO!!!!!!! They thought about it for a second, asked if anyone had been hurt, and apologized thoroughly. STUPID!!!!!!!, but I bet they don't do it again.

I have also been shot at intentionally while hunting in southwest Colorado. I had no cover and nowhere to go to get cover close, with bullets hitting within a few feet of me. I turned to the sound of the report and saw some blaze orange peeking out from behind a tree about 350-400 yards away, leveled my scope on it and was looking at a rifle pointed at ME!!!. I fired back at him, hit the tree about two feet below the rifle and he took off. I won't say whether I shot at him again as he ran, or if I went after him after that. It is my belief that he intended to kill me. How he didn't hit me I don't know, I was crossing a park at a slow walk in full blaze orange and he took at least 5 shots at me, 2 of them before I realized what exactly was taking place. That guy hopefully never tried it again, but you have to wonder how many of the hunting 'accidents' are just that and how many are malicious acts.
 
H&Hhunter: If you don't mind, I'd like to use this story in my classes. Too many ppl do not stop and consider the potential results when they do not have the proper training. I sat in on a Hunter's Education class in Buffalo (part of my certification requirement) and was disgusted at how poorly the students were supervised with firearms. It was like the instructor didn't care about safe gun handling. And these are the future hunter's that will come down to my neck of the woods and potentially cause me and mine bodily injury.

Berek
 
H&H

Man do I understand that.

I was hunting elk in eastern arizona one time and something similar happened to us. We were glassing a big herd of elk on opening day. We had seen the same heard for a few straight days. We were waiting for them in an area that they went out of the big field they were in. We were about 500 yards from them and they started coming toward us on a path into the woods. Then we see bout 1200 yards away on the other side of the field 3 trucks scream down and dirt road and screech to a halt. They were about 8-900 yards from the elk. Then all of a sudden these 5 idiots get out and start shooting at the herd STANDING up. These idiots were just randomly shooting at the herd. We must have heard 60-70 shots. The herd was off to our right so the shots werent diredly at us. Then the idiots got back into their truck and took off. The heard wasnt spooled and kept coming towards us. When they were about 100 yards from us the same idiots showed up about 500 yards away. Then of course the same thing happened. Standing rapid fire at the herd. This time we were in the path. The elk came right at us as we hid behind a tree. We tried waving our orange after hunt vests but they didnt stop. I was about 2 seconds from dropping a bullet into the guys truck or one of them when someone finally saw the orange vest I hung on the front of the tree. This type of recklessness in shooting and hunting is really scary.
 
As I read through the other posts, I had a thought. How much different would the situation be if hunter safety courses were administered by groups like the NRA instead of the state DNR? It seems like there are plenty of CCW holders who aren't really shooters going into the classes, but leave with a very good sense of the damage that can be done by irresponsible gun handling.
 
Reminds me of when I got shot at the range...

In 2002, I was at the range sighting in for deer season. A "gentleman" with less than common sense was over at the "clays range" about 100 yards away. Seems he did not know that he could ONLY use LIGHT TARGET loads there becuase in the background, just beyond the 20 foot dirt mound was the rifle range.

I was walking down to the 100 yard mark to check my target when I felt the stinging of about 10 pellets striking me...I mean this hurt. Then, I felt it again. Someone beside me knew what was going on and yelled for me, "Get out of there!" We did so, and notified the range officer.

I never did learn what load the "fool" was using, other than it was an "off the shelf DISallowed load." I did not have to go to the hospital, but the incident DID break skin and DID draw blood.

There is a fool born every day. Hopefully we intelligent folks can manage to not be taken out by one of these fools.

By the way, I have NOT gone back there since this happened. Can you believe the range owner didn't offer a free day of shooting, and didn't even offer to refund our day's shooting fee.

Oh, gee...almost forgot the most important part...who do you think was the "fool's" shooting instructor for the afternoon? Yeah...the range owner and lead officer. So negligent he didn't even check (verify) the "fool's" loads. :what:

Doc2005
 
I've done the bit where I spotted someone scoping me out with his rifle scope. I went over to speak with him: 1)You're trespassing, friend. 2) If I ever see someone using a scoped rifle on me again and realize that it's you...I'm going to shoot first-in self defense. Have a nice day, get off my land, and stay off my land.

H&H, glad nothing came of it. That's the main reason that I try to avoid public land. Public idiots.
 
H&H - salutary experience and one well worth telling. Thank you.

Where was rule #4? Of course this el stupido probably knew nothing of any basic rules of gun safety. Not the way to teach kids!!!

Last hunting season here we had a father shoot and kill his son - tragic beyond belief but - every time this happens I wonder - where is the target ID phase - it's better to miss a chance than improperly ID the target and surroundings. Plus in this instance - how the heck can blaze orange be seen as a legit target - I mean - it is by its very design and nature - visible.

I think the backpacking, outdoorsman deal is something where, because stupid and irresponsible folks exist - probably has to be in a sorta condition yellow tho even that would not have warned you about incoming HV bullets.

Glad everyone was Ok - but more by luck you'd reckon that much else!!

Continued (and safe) good hunting! :)
 
To all thnak you for your intelligent and as usual, thought provoking comments.

Berek,

Please feel free to use any and all of my posts threads ETC for your classes. Glad that I can help.

What is the most interesting about this to me is that I am a pretty level headed logical guy for the most part. It truley amazed me how I went into instinctual kill/protect mode when a threat was presented to one of my cubs. I truely had every intention of illiminating that threat with extreme violence.

Don't ever mess with a predators offspring.. I mean that.
 
Friend, after reading your story--and more importantly, how you handled it, and the mindset--well, to paraphrase one of my favorite writers:

You'll do to ride the river with.
 
Glad everything turned out for the best H&H. I have only had the opportunity to hunt once in Colorado in the early 90's. It was a good time even though I didn't get an elk, but I remember the sound of a bullet zipping through some trees within 100 yards of me from God only knows where. :eek: Only one shot but I stayed hunkered down for about 10 minutes just in case. I have to believe it was from at least a couple miles away. Still would of killed though.

I understand the parent mentality you underwent though. Someone threatens my kids and family...watch out... :fire:
 
P95Carry...you're EXACTLY correct!

In all the years I've taught "Hunter Safety" one of the rules has always been sight in before the hunt. If verifying the scope at the hunting area, you MUST walk out of the sight-in area beyond the target, OR shoot into a hill. This post is the very case my wife makes for why she will NOT permit me to take our 11-year-old daughter hunting with me.

But, lest we feel too safe on private land, trust me, these "fools" will tresspass, and bullets certainly do NOT recognize bounderies. Over my 45 years of life, I have seen SO many of these kinds of incidents.

About two years ago, two pouchers here in Michigan helped society out. As the driver jumped out to take a deer out-of-season, the passenger tried to beat him to the draw... unfortanuate for the two of them, they were shooting at the same deer...let's say the driver killed "two birds" with one shot...neither "bird" was a bird, both were mammels, he lost a friend, one went to jail and one went only God knows where. How dumb!

Doc2005
 
This is the reason I'll only do Oregon's General season if I have no other choice. General season sounds like D-Day in The Forest.

It's also the reason my FIL refuses to hunt with anything other than a bow. Many years ago he had a man die in his arms, a victim of just such an accident.
 
Reminds me of the time I was shot at 3 times.

Here's how it played out for me;

When I was stationed at McChord AFB in Tacoma Washington a buddy of mine and I went out scouting for deer down south of us. We found a nice clearcut by a stream that had good deer signs so we decided to hunt that area when it opened in 2 weeks. We combed the clear cut inside and out and there was no sign of any other hunters using that area. We put up 2 tree stands. One on each side of the clearcut. Mine was by a great rubline and his near the stream. There was an old road about 200 yds to the right of me that has since grown up and didn't have any tracks on it from vehicles.

The opening morning of deer season we were out there bright and early. As the sun rose we seen plenty of does but not the buck we have been watching for. About 10 am I see a red truck driving down the old road that didnt show any use previously. The guy stops, gets out and raises his rifle and scans the clearcut. From what I can tell I think he was just looking to see if there was deer out there. I went back to watching the area to my left and I hear the guy shoot. Next think I hear is the bullet going thru the trees above me. I immediately raise my binoc's to see what he was shooting at and then a second crack of the rifle and the bullet strikes the tree about 10 feet above me and showers me with bark. By that time I'm pissed and swing my 30-30 his way. He gets off a third round that hits about 5 ft above me and now the shock of someone shooting at me is gone. I put a round downrange his way and it hits the tailgate of his truck. I think he figured out that I am a better shot cause he throws his rifle in the truck and starts to haul butt. I put one more his way for good measure. I aimed in the front of his truck and it hits 5 ft in front kicking up dust. He kicked it into high gear and is gone. My buddy Donny comes running over to see if I was alright. He said he seen the guy shooting my way and had a clear shot at the guy but hesistated shooting.

Needless to say, we never went there again. I did report it to the law but didnt have a license number or any decription other then a red Ford Ranger.
 
The "Other" Lesson

The parental negligence of this whole unfortunate situation isn't the only issue that makes your story such a good one to use for a hunter safety education class. Your hostile thought processes as exemplified in the following quoted passage illustrates your "road rage" mentality at the time.
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"I was seeing red I was so hot that at that moment I am sure to this day I'd have killed the SOB responsible if he'd have been present. I'd have killed him without a second thought and with extreme prejudice with any available tool or my bare hands if that's all I had. You can shoot at me that's not going to be good for you but your welcome to try. Once you put my kids in the picture it's a whole nother story boys and girls you just F----up big time!!"
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You brought 2 young children into a hunting area of known risk and subjected them to the "elements" which are unfortunately, not unforseeable. Even if someone was accidently shot, what makes you think you are justified in using the "I'll get even" raging logic? You sound like you are still suffering from a lot of stress from the situation, hence the title of your thread. You have a lot of sympathy from everyone here including myself, but the behavior of the negligent parties is no more or less unforgivable than your extremely poor corresponding illogical & judgemental written descriptions of your then current attitude & temperment, in my honest opinion. Thankfully, right made might that day, for all of the involved parties. That's what I consider to be the "other" lesson to be taught to any hunting student from your story, how one should never even consider taking matters into their own hands unless left with absolutely no other conceivable alternative. Instructors already teach something about that when dealing with "anti-hunting" protestors in the woods while hunting. Walk away and contact law enforcement. :cool:
 
I'm amazed at HSMITH'sa and Lennyjoe's responses. Having someone intentionally fire on me I'm not sure if I would offer a warning shot.

This isn't as close to me as others but having a cow recently killed on my parents land I'm keeping my eyes peeled and a rifle handy while down there
 
Good Lord! I'm going out deer hunting for the first time this season, and you guys have me spooked. How about some reasuring comments to keep me out in the woods?

:confused: :eek:
 
The parental negligence of this whole unfortunate situation isn't the only issue that makes your story such a good one to use for a hunter safety education class. Your hostile thought processes as exemplified in the following quoted passage illustrates your "road rage" mentality at the time.

No flame intended, friend...

but have you ever had to duck a bullet? Or two, or three?

It's bad enough when YOU are dodging. However, all you need to do is to find cover and stay there, as an option.

However, what do you do if your family is in the line of fire?

Would you be so calm if your wife/husband/child/significant other took, for an example, a 180 grain softpoint from a .300 Win Mag in the chest while you watched?

I, for one, congratulate this guy's maturity and restraint.
 
You brought 2 young children into a hunting area of known risk and subjected them to the "elements" which are unfortunately, not unforseeable. Even if someone was accidently shot, what makes you think you are justified in using the "I'll get even" raging logic? You sound like you are still suffering from a lot of stress from the situation, hence the title of your thread. You have a lot of sympathy from everyone here including myself, but the behavior of the negligent parties is no more or less unforgivable than your extremely poor corresponding illogical & judgemental written descriptions of your then current attitude & temperment, in my honest opinion. Thankfully, right made might that day, for all of the involved parties. That's what I consider to be the "other" lesson to be taught to any hunting student from your story, how one should never even consider taking matters into their own hands unless left with absolutely no other conceivable alternative. Instructors already teach something about that when dealing with "anti-hunting" protestors in the woods while hunting. Walk away and contact law enforcement

Arcticap

If I may sir,

That is the huge load of touchy, feely, phsyco babble B.S.

In the real world sir, there is a time and a place to take matters into your own hands. That is why we as Americans at least in some states are still free.

Law enforcemnt will not save you in the heat of the moment. 911 will get you killed more often than acting appropriatley to a hostile threat situation.

My children being shot at is a hole different ball game from somebody cutting you off in traffic. Your road rage comparison is less than appropriate.

You are free to run away and call for help. I don't operate that way.

As far as your vague mention to parental neglect and my bringing my children to an "area of known risk". I don't know where you live I don't know what your belief sytem is but I do know one thing.

We live in a "hunting area" we do not live in some cozy little gated community with protective services available with the mere ring of a phone. We take care of our own. Out of neccesity. So I guess in your book my children are always in a state of risk. I wouldn't have it any other way.

I will continue to raise my children in the outdoors hunting and shooting. It is far more risky to raise them in the burbs or the city by all accounts and for multiple reasons. But that is a whole other subject.

And I can promise you this, if anybody ever threatens me or my children with a deadly weapon I will respond with extreme violence as I've been trained to do.

When being shot at there simply isn't time to tune inm to Dr. Phil and see what the PC reponse should be.

With all due respect, Arcticap

Get a life....

Greg
 
Carnaby, wear lots of orange, know the area well, and avoid places that are easy access for less-serious hunters. If you do get a deer, cover it completely in an orange poncho before hauling it out. And keep your weapon loaded (or at least easily loaded) at all times when outdoors.

I know quite a few deer hunters that you couldn't pay enough for them to hunt public land during deer season. Sometimes, however, that is the only option if you want a deer then you just have to be careful.
 
I've looked thru my binoculars at some sob a scoping me out

I've seen this before. Not good at all. People need to understand that a rifle scope is NOT a substitute for binoculars.

I'm normally a pretty calm guy. I avoid conflicts whenever possilbe. But if someone is shooting at me, I'm going to shoot back. And if I can tell they intend to shoot me, as was the case in some of the above storys, there will be no warning shot...

I also carry a pistol whenever I hunt. My rifle is for the 4 legged critters, the pistol is for the 2 legged ones...
 
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