Exotic shotshells for Home Defense-Your opinion.

Status
Not open for further replies.
M

Megawatt

Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2007
Messages
9
Location
Louisiana
While ordering 12 gauge home defense ammo on the internet I found on the Ammunition To Go website what are called Specialty or Exotic shells. The 4 Exotic shells that caught my attention are: The Terminator.....a 2 slug shell. The Mini Missle which is a modified slug supposedly to pierce armor 1/4" thick. Incendiary shot that explodes and makes sparks on impact and burns at 3000 degrees. The Flechette which has about 25 steel darts which can defeat light body armor and can penetrate heavy brush or trees used as cover. The Fleschette, I heard, was used in Vietnam. All of this ammo is advertised as safe to shoot in all shotguns and will not do any damage to the gun. What do you guys think? Does this stuff work as advertised? Would it be a good idea to have some of this exotic stuff on hand? I have a new Remington 870 Express, synthetic, 7 shot. I don't want to mess up the gun with this ammo.

After reading many excellent posts on best home defense ammo, I decided on and bought an assortment of 12 gauge including OO/9 pellet, OO/15 pellet, #4 buck/27 pellet, #1 buck/16 pellet. I ordered regular loads as well as some LOW RECOIL. I did not order any slugs. I need a recommendation for a good slug for my 870. Not the best shell for home defense but more for home offense like disabling a bad guy vehicle, shooting through thick wall or other cover where the bad guy might be taking cover.
 
I keep standard 00 Buck, 0 Buck, 1 Buck, and 4 Buck, and slugs, on hand. My main HD pump is loaded with "managed recoil" 00 buck though... seven in the tube, one in the chamber, and six in the butt cuff.

I'd be grabbing a different long-gun if the threat was outside the house...

Les
 
i tend to side with freakshow.....its very tough to beat the stopping power of buckshot for close range work.

2 slugs......i guess could maybe be useful.....i still think a full load of 000 would be my pick though.
1/4" body armor - who did you tick off that you might need that!?!?!?
Incendiary.....hmmmmmm sounds like a bad idea for home defense....unless you want to burn down the structure you are defending....

Dont want to come across as harsh, but the old line 'if it aint broke dont fix it' comes to mind. Buckshot has been doing a wonderful job for a long time. It would be my pick for defense. Having said all that - some of the 'exotic' loads sure would be fun to play with at the range - maybe against an invading army of watermelons ;)
 
After reading many excellent posts on best home defense ammo, I decided on and bought an assortment of 12 gauge including OO/9 pellet, OO/15 pellet, #4 buck/27 pellet, #1 buck/16 pellet. I ordered regular loads as well as some LOW RECOIL. I did not order any slugs. I need a recommendation for a good slug for my 870. Not the best shell for home defense but more for home offense like disabling a bad guy vehicle, shooting through thick wall or other cover where the bad guy might be taking cover.
Click to expand...

Home "offense" gets you in jail for attempted murder or worse. If you are not in immediate danger, using lethal force causes way too many troubles.
 
Ask an Expert

Call your local Prosecutor's office and ask him his opinion.
As was said on one of the self defense programs by (I think it was Massad Ayoob or Sheriff Wilson you must survive 2 fights the gun fight and the legal fight) I'm sure the DA would will tell you how easy it would be in a court of law to show that your intentions were to kill the intruder and not just stop him or worse to maim him so that you can pay support for the rest of his life. That is also why they teach not to use reloads for SD/HD.

Thank you lawyers!
 
I was taught the same thing in my CHL class as trstafford said. How do you think a jury would react to hearing that you shot someone with 25 little arrows, or a round loaded with 2 slugs.
 
I think SWAT teams tend to use 00 buck. That's just what I've heard. It makes sense though. I think anything else is rather unnecessary. If you're really that worried, get some regular slugs. If someone is coming at you and a slug won't stop them, you were screwed from the beginning. Otherwise there's no need to light your house on fire with incendiary shells.
 
WoooHoooo, I've been waiting for the incendiary round my whole life!!!! I'm going over there to order some right now!!! I'll post a range report after I try them out.
 
The flechette rounds are crap, in a HD situation I feel they would certainly ruin someone's night though due to close distance. But why do that when 00 can too? PS have fun explaining to the jury ("a jury is a group of 12 people who couldn't come up with an excuse to avoid jury duty") why you specially used a round called "The Terminator" to slay someone.

Here's the Flechette round ballistic test:
http://www.brassfetcher.com/Sabot Designs Flechette Sabot (19 flechette cartridge).html
 
Well, I just ordered $200 worth of crap, thanx. (sarcasm intended). I got:
12 Gauge Original Shell Crackers
12 Gauge Flame Thrower Ammo
12 Gauge Flash Bang Ammo
12 Gauge OC Tear Gas Ammo
12 Gauge Incendiary Ammo

A bit expensive, but it should make my next trip to the cabin a LOT of fun! I'll post a report at a later date. Will probably get some of the incendiary and tracer stuff for my rifle and for my .45 before then too. Oh, and some smoke grenades. I never realized how much fun stuff they had over there!

I wonder if that incendiary rifle ammo would amplify tannerite?
 
How do you think a jury would react to hearing
Click to expand...

A jury will never hear it if it was a lawful use of deadly force. You don't get tried if you didn't break the law. You don't even get charged. Makes no diff whether you shot him with a .22 short or a 12 gauge loaded with razor blades. If you were justified in shooting, you were justified in shooting. There is no halfway.

how easy it would be in a court of law to show that your intentions were to kill the intruder and not just stop him or worse to maim him
Click to expand...

There is no law in the US that gives you the right to shoot to injure or to maim someone. If you did and you admit it, *you* broke the law. Deadly force, as in shooting someone, says you are at a point whereby shooting him to death is the last resort in and of itself. If it's a deadly force situation, you shoot to kill and you keep shooting as long as you believe there's a threat. As I said, there is no halfway. No lawyer can argue "you could have just winged him....you didn't need to kill him". Either you're justified or you aren't.

richard
 
A jury will never hear it if it was a lawful use of deadly force. You don't get tried if you didn't break the law. You don't even get charged. Makes no diff whether you shot him with a .22 short or a 12 gauge loaded with razor blades. If you were justified in shooting, you were justified in shooting. There is no halfway.
Click to expand...

Hmmm, ever here of a civil suit? They are commonly filed by surviving relatives.
 
PS have fun explaining to the jury ("a jury is a group of 12 people who couldn't come up with an excuse to avoid jury duty") why you specially used a round called "The Terminator" to slay someone.
Click to expand...

Again, there is no jury if you didn't break the law. If you shot legally, then it makes no difference what you shot him with. You can't be charged for using one type of ammo over another. There is no law against ammo type in an HD situation.

rich
 
There may be no criminal jury, but sure as God made little green apples, his relatives will come out from under the rocks and sue you in civil court for wrongfully taking the poor little misunderstood, "my boy was a good boy," a##h##e that broke into your house. Your use of something called the "Terminator" will not sit well with a jury. Remenber, in criminal court the prosecutor has to prove beyond a shadow of doubt, where in civil court the plaintiff only has to prove 51%. Err on the side of caution and use standard buckshot.

Blubacon50
 
Stay with buckshot loads

The lawyers will have a "field-day" with anyone using exoctic ammo in a shotgun.
 
his relatives will come out from under the rocks and sue you in civil court for wrongfully
Click to expand...

'Cept for the fact that pretty much all states have laws prohibiting suits based on deadly force cases. All, perhaps? I'm not well versed on the yankee states but here in the south, if you shoot someone legally, you did it legally and that's it. There is no civil suit. It's fun to compare what-ifs, but reality is a bit different.

I'd love to find out which states allow civil suits based on deadly force cases. My state of NC doesn't. Anyone else know theirs?

richard
 
Last edited:
"Exotic ammunition" is just a fancy way to separate dupes from dollars IMHO. Stick to plain ordinary buckshot and slugs for defensive purposes. Everyday ammo is inexpensive enough that you can afford to train/practice/experiment with it, so you can be fully aware of its capabilities and limitations. The overhyped 'exotica' costs several dollars per round- not something anyone is apt to blow a few dozen of downrange in practice.

As far as good 'ordinary' slugs go, try Brenneke KOs, the plain rifled slugs and not the sabot version. They are a very hard lead alloy, solid in cross section, unlike most of the traditional Foster type slugs that are soft lead and cup shaped. Brennekes penetrate, they don't flatten and stop.

Wholesale Hunter ( http://www.wholesalehunter.com/product.asp?productid=9847 ) lists them at $3.48/box of 5, if you buy a case of 250 rounds. Shipping is extra with them. Try a few before you order a whole case. Back in the Good O' Days (pre-O, that is) they were less than $2/box in case lots... which is why it'll be a while before I need to order any more.

fwiw,

lpl
 
Just for the sake of argument:

Civilian flechettes have poor penetration.

An incendiary round would be a terrible idea inside your home, for obvious reasons.

2 slug shell; why would this be better than a single slug? Could you count on the slugs flying straight?

No idea what the mini missile is.

The buck and ball shell is about the only novelty ammo that isn't a waste of time, and even there you're dealing with over penetration in the home. One might imagine a scenario where it would be worthwhile, though.

Reduced recoil 00 with a flight control wad is universally lauded for a reason! But even the cheapest buck ought to perform reliably and consistently at self-defense ranges.
 
LOL 2 "disabling bad guy's vehicle"

I sense a rude legal awakening in this fellow's future. "Home offense?" LOL, wow. One of the silliest things I've read on THR
 
Sounds like someone has been playing WAY too many video games.......Just the type to DO something like he mentioned and give the rest of us another bad time in the media......:banghead:
 
Welcome Megawatt,

You need to pattern your shotgun with all those types of buckshot to determine what combination of "you + shotgun + shotshell" works best in terms of accuracy and handling. This differs for everyone, so don't take any 'recommendations' here as absolute gold.

Go to the top of this subforum and click the sticky "shotgun 101" and read those posts. Start with the one about "patterning" to understand how you should start in preparing a home defense shotgun and then read the others.

Take a shotgun self defense course if any are offered nearby. You will learn more from one weekend, than you will ever learn from the commandos on the internet.

Lastly, stick with well-known brands of buckshot and slugs for your SG. Stay away from anything "exotic". They don't work other than stealing your money.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

5
  • Locked
  • Poll
Home Defense Ammo
Replies
14
Views
687
Ranger30-06
R
Brass Fetcher
  • Locked
Exotic shotgun ammunition
Replies
11
Views
1K
mac66
M
A
  • Locked
Good Ammo for home defense and range?
Replies
2
Views
390
mountainclmbr
M
C
  • Locked
shotshell crushed crimp?
Replies
8
Views
1K
Uniquedot
U
B
  • Locked
Which 12 Guage Shells for HD / SD?
Replies
8
Views
780
rbernie
rbernie
Back
Top