Expansion of .357 Gold Dot or XTP 158gr

[Byron]

Has anyone done any test for expansion of the 158 grain Speer Gold Dot or Hornady XTP at velocites as low as 700 FPS?

 

[eldon519]

I have never seen expansion data for loads that slow before, but I would caution that there is a thread going on about getting jacketed bullets stuck in the barrel at below-starting load .357 velocities. You may be better off with a swaged led bullet like the classic FBI load.

Check it out:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=636108

 

[helotaxi]

Hornady shows .38Spl loads using the 158XTP with MV as low as 600fps. I would call that well below starting .357 loads. I highly doubt those loads fired in a .357 revolver would stick either since a .38 and a .357 have the same bore.

As far as expansion, it's hard to say. It won't expand as much as it would when fired at max velocity, but it will probably expand some. If you're worried about expansion why are you trying to download in the first place? If you're after a lower recoiling load, shoot .38s. Speer makes Gold Dot bullets specific to the .38 that expand at lower velocities and are lighter in weight.

 

[Byron]

First, let me say Thank You for your input.I recently purchased a Model 10-5 that S&W said was made in 1962. The gun was NIB and had been sitting in the back of the closet shelf.It is perfect and I am the first to have fired it.Smith said not to use +P ammo as it was 1985 when they recommended it.I am using the Hornady #4 manual.The data showed with the 158 grain XTP a charge of 5 grains of 231 and was not +P.I felt this revolver would be good for home protection and was trying to determine if it would expand.Thanks, Byron

 

[buck460XVR]

I doubt @ 700 FPS there'd be much, if any expansion at all. Maybe some deformation if something solid like bone was hit. I've pushed the 158gr XTPs in .357 mag to 1200 fps with good expansion on deer, but for HD @ 700fps, I'd be more concerned with accuracy than expansion.

BTW....Speer shows no loads whatsoever for their 158 gr GD in .38 Special.

 

[SHR970]

I have never seen expansion data for loads that slow before, but I would caution that there is a thread going on about getting jacketed bullets stuck in the barrel at below-starting load .357 velocities.

It's not below 357 starting loads you have to worry about; it's below 38 Special starting loads that you worry. If you look many manuals don't list 158 jacketed at standard pressures or at all because of sticking and expansion problems. Personally I wouldn't bother loading 357 brass below top 38+P if I wanted to go slow to prevent sticking. If you want to go any slower go lead (swaged at that). At least if you get one stuck it will be a lot easier to unstick it.

 

[Byron]

The Hornady Manual is the #3 instead of 4. I also use Speer #10.Both are old and have served me well.The 5 grains of 231 is below +P in both manuals.I might well stay with the LSWCHP at 4 grains of 231 giving me 800 FPS.I was just curious as to minimum velocity for expansion. Byron

 

[helotaxi]

Personally I'd go with a 110 or 125gn Gold Dot or XTP or the 135 Gold Dot SB. Those bullets are designed to expand at lower velocities and there is extensive .38Spl data out there for them.

 

[kelbro]

So, you have a lot of speculation and suggestions but no real expansion data. Time to test it out yourself and report back.

An e-mail or call to Hornady and/or Speer might also answer your question.

 

[Byron]

I talked with reps from Speer and Hornady.Speer said their 158 grain Gold dot is iff on expansion below 850FPS. Hornady told me their 158 gr XTP/HP will offer adequate expanion down to 700FPS(not full expansion at 700 but adequate). Byron

 

[gamestalker]

I would never down load a jacketed bullet that much. But I have done expansion testing with both the XTP's and Gold Dots, but at full house velocities. I used a cardboard box lined with a plastic trash bag, filled with water and tightly rolled up denim jeans very well soaked. I don't recall the exact dimensions of the box, but I think it was like 16" or so. Both the Gold Dots and XTP's performed as designed to, and most of them exited the box leaving a large wound channel.
The load tested were 16.5 grs. - 18.5 grs. of H110.
Velocity average was 1100 fps on the lower charges of 16.5 grs., and 1220 fps average with the 18.5 gr. charges. I also tested the 125 gr. XTP's with 20.0 gr. H110 and they produced amazing performance. Just under 1500 fps velocities and total expansion at just about upon impact. Impressive I thought.
I have killed numerous jack rabbits with both of those bullets and they always produce very impressive evidense of full expansion.
I bought a box of the 110 gr. Short Barrel Gold Dots to load 38 spcl with a while back, but I haven't gotten around to testing them yet. But I've never been disappointed with Speer's design or intended performance, so I would imagine they are a reliable low velocity self defense round.

 

[Byron]

I plan to load it at a muzzle velocity of 825 FPS. Byron

 

[bfoosh006]

http://brassfetcher.com/38%20Special.html

Look around here...

( note they list other calibers on the left side. )

I think he has videos on Youtube .... "Brassfetcher"