FAL newbie

[Rebel Gunman HK]

I picked up a used Fal for $450 today. I got depressed looking for answers at FALfiles. Can anybody tell me what I got? I know there are alot of differnt manufactures. Reciver says R1A1 Sporter. Has a long flash hider. Reciver is Imbel. Imported by CAI in Canada. Did I pick up a potential lemon or am I gonna be ok? Help!

 

[fissionproducts]

My understanding is that Century FAL's are hit and miss in terms of quality. You will only know when you take it to the range. It sounds like the gun was built on an Imbel (Brazilian) receiver. The other parts are likely surplus parts from Century as well. Century is know to import parts and rifles (disassembling the rifles for their parts) and then they hobble their products together with varying results. $450 is pretty cheap for an FAL. Good Luck.

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

So is Century Arms a buch of monkeys or are they ok?

 

[hksw]

So is Century Arms a buch of monkeys or are they ok?

It's my understanding that the build quality of their guns are dependent on the emotional state of those monkeys. On good days, they are happy monkeys making good stuff, on bad days they are angry monkeys making bad stuff.

My beater FAL, very reliable and accurate (in battle rifle standards), sound very similar to yours. R1A1/Imbel (electric pencil lettering, i.e. no gear) except no brake. Metal hand guard, carry handle. Only problem I had with it (bought 'new' at a gun show) is the South African butt stock which was too high to see through the rear sight at its lowest setting. Replaced it with a Penguin.

 

[iamkris]

Century products are a hit or miss proposition. THere is no way for anyone here to tell you if you got a good or bad one. Cenury builds can be great or next to dangerous.

The R1A1 is Century's mixmaster FAL. It is neither fish nor fowl as they are typically a mix of metric (either STG or other) and inch (usually L1A1) parts.

Only way to tell is go out and shoot it.

R1A1s are selling for about $500 "new".

 

[armoredman]

Shoot - have fun, and good luck - Century got me good with a bad CETME.

 

[mattf7184]

Some people have good luck with Century rifles and if you get a good one they are a good deal imo. Go out and shoot (without Indian ammo lol)!!! If it works it works and you already got it, no sense in worrying about something you cant change.

 

[Redlg155]

So is Century Arms a buch of monkeys or are they ok?

Hksw pretty much summed it up. I depends on the day they are having. We also refer to them as "Angry Beavers" since they seem to rely on dremel tools to remove bits of unwanted...and often wanted bits and peices in their attempts to make it work.

Just go out and shoot the thing and see if it works. I've heard of a suprising number of folks happy with their Century built FALs. It may not look the best and might have mixed metric and inch parts, but I look at it like this. Better to have an ugly gal that can cook really good than a pretty one that can't cook worth a darn!

Good Shooting
Red

 

[Wildalaska]

Poor asesembly of mismatched parts with non existent customer service.

The hallmark of century quality

WildgoodluckAlaska

 

[atek3]

if it shoots reliably, great. If it has issues send it here:
http://www.azexarms.com/cai_redo.html

pay the 255 and you should have a DY-NO-MITE rifle.

atek3

 

[Freedomv]

I picked one up at a gunshow for $150. It needed some "attention" as the reciever was broke at the area to the rear of the charging handle slot.
(Please pardon my terminology this is/was the first FAL I had ever handled.)
From what I could determine the barrel was not timed correctly and interferred with the bolt closing. That would explain the extra op springs etc. The bolt had hit the barrel several times with enough force to break off a small segment that is to the right side and bottom of the bolt adjacint to the extractor.
My best guess is that who ever owned it/worked on it and had prided on the charging handle and reciever to "unlock" the jam and had cracked the reciever in the process of taking apart the rifle. The rifle was inparts when I bought it. All this being said I was not impressed with its construction or design (no forward assist) and for me the left hand charging handle is a negitive as I am very acustom to the right hand m-1/m-14 system.
How a rifle in this condition ever got released to be sold beat the h--- out of me.
Upon previewing this, I think that maybe the Gunsmithing section would be a more appropreated area for it.

If it gives you probloms please do have some one who knows the rifle work the bugs out. And Yes the one I have is "for sale" when new parts arrive.
Good luck.
Vern

 

[shoobe01]

My century works great and shoots better than it ought to (7" at 300 yds with military ball).

I have heard good things mostly from people about their customer service. There is a warranty. If your gun won't run, call them up and you can send it back in.

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

HELP!

Well I took the rifle out last night cause I was worried about it not working and sure enough it didn't. It shot but would not extract and definantly did not even try to cycle the bolt. From what I an tell the bolt just unlocked after shooting but didn't really move. Tried about 20 rnds in 2 different mags and got the same result every time. What do you think is causing this problem?

 

[iamkris]

Have you gone through the gas regulation / setting procedure? If not, go over to falfiles.com and learn about it. Without knowing anything else, the first thing is that you don't have enough gas running through the system. What is your setting?

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

I tried it a few times on each setting with the same result. :banghead:

 

[iamkris]

I'd pose this question (in excruciating detail of exactly what ammo and mechanical variation you made) over at falfiles.com. Those guys are uber knowledgeable and can do some amazing diagnosis over online.

If all else fails, you may need to bite the bullet and 1) pay someone reputable to fix it or 2) unload it and buy something you know works.

 

[Redlg155]

Sounds like you have the gas plug set on the grenade launcher/single shot setting rather than the automatic setting. Try turning it to the next position.

With the rifle pointed away from you turn the gas plug all the way to the right, rotating it 180 degrees. You might have a lever or you might just have a pin you have to push in before it will move. Yours may also have markings. Mine is marked "A" and " G". You need to be on the "A".

Good Shooting
Red

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

I just took it to a local smith who took it apart charged me $15 and said "I dunno" Took it back out with a box of their "Nato" ammo and cranked the gas setting down to #1. Now it is working half the time the other half it is not cycling the bolt.

The smith said that the gas tube is differnet in mine than other ones hes worked on. My gas tube isn't the full length of the reciver its only half.

#2 there is a small hole (drilled) towards the front of the gas tube. Should this be there? Seems wrong.....

 

[Redlg155]

What kind of ammo are you using? That would make a big difference, but it doesn't seem to be an ammo related problem since you tried a different type of ammo.

The used part isn't good since the last owner probably got rid of it for the reasons you mentioned. Still , it wouldn't stop me from calling Century and asking if they will fix the rifle. Otherwise it could be any number of things wrong. I suspect that it is related to your gas system. As for the gas tube length, it really isn't a problem since they have both short and long gas tube lengths available. It is possible that your gas piston is a bit undersized. Also, whether not they silver soldered the tube is anyone's guess. It could even be a plugged or undersized gas port combined with the undersized gas piston. The smaller gas port would give you less gas to operate the system while the undersized gas piston would allow gas to blow by.

In any event you need a better smith. You can find several at the FAL Files.Court in Fl seems to have a good following with favorable reviews as well as Azex Arms.

Good Shooting
Red

 

[iamkris]

Another long shot idea...

Try firing the rifle with the dust cover off. I had a buddy with a Century frankenfal that suddenly stopped cycling/extracting. We thought it was the gas system until we tried without the top cover...it worked fine. It had been bent on reinstallation and was impingin on the bolt. Replaced it with a new one and it worked fine from there on out.

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

Red,

I checked an the plub was on "A".

iamkrs, I looked over the top cover. It looked good but Ill give it another look over.

Any opinions on that half gas tube with the hole drilled in it?

 

[Dollar Bill]

I like FAL rifles and I have several but with all the many parts kits which came in and a variety of guys building them with varying degrees of competence I can understand how buying a used one (most all are used) can be a real crap shoot. Most are fixable as it is a design which responds to tinkering. On your failures...were they failure to feed, failure to extract, failure to eject? Check your gas piston as it could be bent. Remove the gas plug by bushing in the button or lever and rotating 90 degrees, remove the piston which is under spring pressure, remove the spring from the piston, remove the bolt and carrier, then insert the piston, sans the spring, into the gas block and it should drop through and protrude out the receiver end above the chamber. If it does not freely drop through then check to see if the piston is bent.
The holes in the gas tube towards the front are normal, actually there should be 2 in the 8 and 4 position on the tube. If the gas vent holes are in another position then your tube is not positioned properly and that could be closing off some gas from cycling the rifle. The half gas tube is normal on some rifles, especially the StG-58. Some half tubes are soldered in the gas block, some are screwed in and pinned.
It gets rather complicated so your best bet would be to read up on the design and try to fix yourself or take or send to a 'smith who is familiar with the design.

Be careful about shooting the rifle with the top cover removed as the cases could come straight back and ding your forehead real good. I don't recommend that. You should be able to tell if the bolt carrier is dragging on the top cover by manually cycling the action.

The FAL Files (www.falfiles.com/forums) used to be real good at helping people with their rifles but now with over 14000 members you get guys responding who don't fully understand the issue and it can get confusing. It is still a great place to read up on the FAL and the problems you may encounter.

Good luck.

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

Thanks Dollar.

The 'smith i took it to pulled out the the piston and it looked fine. Said I might need a larger one as the one I have was kinda loose in it.

The failures are failure to extract & eject. I cranked the setting up to one after the smith put it back together and it worked ok half the time. The other half was no extracting or trying to eject. Its had to find good help in this area. 2 gun stores. 1 the owner will be back on Saturaday "and fix it" and the other was asked if they new anything about FAL's to which they responded. Whats an FAL.

 

[Dollar Bill]

Kind of sounds like you are in a similar area as I am. Not many around here ever heard of an FAL, much less work on one.

It sounds to me like you definitely have a gas problem. Your rifle...not you! Make sure the gas tube is positioned correctly and that the cross pin located under the gas setting ring is in there. That pin is to keep the tube from unscrewing and if it is missing it could cause gas to leak. A worn or undersize gas piston is a possibility. If you have a micrometer or a caliper then measure the head of the piston as it should be .429-.430 in diameter. It is possible to order a .432 piston but that is kind of unusual for a rifle to need one. Once you have checked and corrected as many places as possible where leaks could occur and if you still have problems you could have the gas port in the barrel enlarged. Do it incrementally and check for function after each drill. The standard metric port is .092 I believe and it can be enlarged up to .125 (1/8th inch) but I wouldn't go that far if I could help it. The ports drill out pretty easily if you use lots of lube and a slow speed on a hand drill. Put a steel cleaning rod in the bore to prevent the bit from dinging the bore when it breaks through. You could have an inch barrel. Does the front sight protecting ears have holes in them or are they solid?

Like I said, it gets complicated if you aren't familiar with the design.

 

[Rebel Gunman HK]

I called AZEK arms and they said they should be able to fix it. I guess that there is a difference between made by CAI and imported by CAI.
He said since it was made by Imbel I should have no problem getting it fixed. Does CAI make their own receivers?