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Fav Cal For Africa/Rifle type

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by BigBuckMaster, Oct 15, 2008.

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  1. BigBuckMaster

    BigBuckMaster member

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    mine is a .470 NE double barrel. i also use a .375 Holland & Holland for leopard and plains game. I have used the .500 NE on elephant (ele) and Cape Bufflo (buff). the ele cow i shot with it dropped like a stone.

    at a range in my neiboring state, tx, i shot a .600 NE and i wound up on my rear.

    in africa, i will use nothin under a .375, cause i love big/dangerious game huntin'.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2008
  2. BigBuckMaster

    BigBuckMaster member

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    Come on people, let me hear your opinion!!! even if you aint been to Africa, join it!!!
     
  3. Ratshooter

    Ratshooter Member

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    It doesn't sound like you need any advice from us.

    But for what its worth I just got the selected works of Finn Aagaard from Rifle magazine and he was sold on the 375 H&H for most near everything. He did mention he used a 458 Winchester some but not much.

    He spoke well of the 9.3x62 as a good stand in for for the 375 H&H. I guess the new Ruger 375 round would work also.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2008
  4. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    i don't much care what caliber of rifle... i'd just love to go shooting in africa someday. never been much interested in hunting in the US.
     
  5. rondog

    rondog Member

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    OK, so say you kill an elephant, or rhino, or buffalo. WTH do you do with it then? Can they be eaten, and do you? Or are you just after the head for a trophy?

    I've never understood WHY people will spend thousands upon thousands of dollars to go kill gigantic animals on the other side of the planet. You got a dead elephant, cool. Now what? Ya gotta have a crane lift the carcass onto a truck or a trailer so it can be hauled away?

    I'm not trying to be a smartass, I'm serious. What is the attraction and justification for doing this? I can see hunting deer, elk, moose, etc., in a local setting for meat and a nice wall hanger. But going to Africa to kill things that could kill you first? And if you DO succeed, it looks to me like the nightmare is just starting. Not to mention the costs and other hassles involved.

    I just don't get it, never have.

    And if the calibers mentioned above are sufficient, then what is the .700 Nitro Express for?
     
  6. Golden Hound

    Golden Hound Member

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    If I were going to Africa....I would want a FAL...and lots and lots of ammo.

    And some Selous Scouts accompanying me.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. crushbup

    crushbup Member

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    The only big bore hunting rifle I've ever really wanted was a CZ Safari in .375 H&H. Unfortunately, I don't hunt and I have no idea to go about doing it, so I likely won't be buying one of those for many more years, when I will have more discretionary income (i.e., enough to go big game hunting in another country)
     
  8. atlanticfire

    atlanticfire Member

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    RonDog - I agree with you entirely and the 700 nittro. . . . . just cause. . . I guess…?
     
  9. Reid73

    Reid73 Member

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    I would say that most people are best equipped with a .375 H&H. It tends to be about the largest caliber that the average shooter can tolerate without excessive flinching, and of course accurate bullet placement is the sina qua non of effective and humane hunting. Also, ammunition is much easier to obtain than for one of the exotic double rifles.

    You're right. There is no way to justify travelling to Africa for a hunting safari.

    But then, how many of our activities can easily be justified? There's no real need to work more than the absolute minimum one needs to survive; no need to travel overseas for any non-business purpose; no need to own a television, a sportscar, or a large house with swimming pool; no need to play golf; etc. etc. And probably >95% of local deer/elk/moose hunters have no genuine economic justification. Finally - let's face it - in a civilized society the vast majority of people have no actual need to own private firearms.

    As far as the attraction goes, it's a personal thing. Probably the result of a childhood (mis)spent reading books by John Taylor, John Hunter, Robert Ruark, and Peter Hathaway Capstick! :)
     
  10. BigBuckMaster

    BigBuckMaster member

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    to robdog;
    when i shoot an animal, i eat it. buff, ele, rhino, ect, though are usally given to a local village. of the 5 ele's i have shot, i have feed 7 villages for a year each. it is really somthin to see 50 or so little natives skinning an ele.

    why, then do you ask? what else will keep the population in check? there are more buff now then there was 25 years ago.

    why hunt somthing that can kill you first? why then should people hunt a grizzly or gator? it is sport with reason and a benefit. when i hunt buff and hippo (my last two of each), i get close enough so they can charge me. it may sound dumb, but any durn fool can shoot a dangerous from 200 yards out. i give them a charce to run or charge. if they charge, i could die. a bad primer, bad shot, out of ammo, faster animal- anything can happen. if i die, it is my fault.

    call me crazy, but you have your way, i have mine. i am not saying anyone elses way is wrong.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2008
  11. BigBuckMaster

    BigBuckMaster member

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    to Reid73;
    you are right, there is no real need to hunt for most. i grew up dirt poor, and what my family ate had .22 holes in it. i had c's and d's in school, except in reading. when i wasnt hunting, working to hunt, and dateing, i was reading.

    the result of a childhood misspent reading books by John Taylor, John Hunter, Robert Ruark, and Peter Hathaway Capstick? no, not misspent. Capstick made me want to hunt bigger stuff than deer. when i shot my first grizzly, i was hooked on big game/dangerious game hunting. its also a Irish thing. and i grew up with Cajuns. those guys could write! so can Tom Clancy, P.W. Storm, Jack Higgans, and Richard Connel.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2008
  12. rondog

    rondog Member

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    Thanks BBM! Please don't misunderstand me, I'm not trying to be critical, just trying to understand the sport. And hey, if the local villagers can and will eat the animals, that's wonderful! They get food, you get your trophy and the experience, and the animal population gets some necessary culling. Win-win-win! If that's your game and you can afford it, more power to you!

    I don't even hunt birds anymore, just don't have the taste for wild meat. Although I have to admit that I might like to take an elk, if the chance ever arose. But I tend to enjoy shooting them with a camera too. I'm just not physically able to tromp around the mountains anymore, don't know anybody to hunt with, or have a place to go. Probably not a wise solo activity.

    I look at a beautiful animal like this, and I don't really know if I could shoot it. I'm not hungry, and don't really want its head on my wall. I don't know how to dress them, or butcher them, or even how I'd get it back to my truck. I have no moral objection to hunting, not saying I wouldn't if I had the chance, but it's just not a burning desire of mine.

    0000706-R1-020-8A.jpg

    It was pretty special just watching this bull with my grandson, and talking about how magnificent yet dangerous it was. This was in Estes Park, CO, where the elk just roam the streets everywhere. We were staying in a cabin on the river.

    0000706-R1-026-11A.jpg
     
  13. browningguy

    browningguy Member

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    .458 Winnie, works and I can actually buy ammo if I need some. Although friends I hunt with have .416 Remingtons and Rigbys and that may just be the best all around compromise.

    Rondog, if you don't like hunting then don't contribute to the thread.

    Everyone has their own sport, we don't knock people that are "just" paper punchers. I do like eating them, I like hanging them on the wall (but my boss makes me keep them in my study), and in Africa absolutely nothing goes to waste, usually the local village has a big party.
     
  14. Big Daddy Grim

    Big Daddy Grim Member

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    I like my .375 Ultra Mag. and for elephant I guess a .458 I trust Winchester alot.
     
  15. MikeKeyW

    MikeKeyW Member

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    I bought my 20" barreled Steyr Mod. S 375 H&H for a safari that never happened. Wife and children have put that off for the foreseeable future.
     
  16. gvnwst

    gvnwst Member

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    undecided rifle in .416 ridgby. best inbetween caliber, IMO
     
  17. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    When I finally make it to Africa, I plan on taking my .35 Whelen bolt-action and hopefully a .416 Rigby.

    John
     
  18. Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow

    Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow member

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    I ain't been and don't have any experience, and if I go, it'll be quite awhile before it happens, but just daydreaming... planning to use my CZ 550 FS in 9.3x62 for large plains game like Zebra and Eland, and get a big boomer at some point - probably a CZ550 Safari Mag in .458 Lott/Win Mag - for big ugly mean stuff like cape buff. For smaller game, probably sporterized Swedish Mauser in 6.5x55mm.
     
  19. garyhan

    garyhan Member

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    My two gun Africa battery would be my Rem 700 CDL .30/06 with 3-9 Leupold, and my Ruger #1 .450/400 NE with 2 1/2 Leupold.

    gary
     
  20. oregonhunter

    oregonhunter Member

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    You must not get out much. "Dangerous"
     
  21. Al Thompson

    Al Thompson Moderator Emeritus

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    Rondog, meat does not go to waste in Africa. :) All of it gets eaten - locals or vultures and hyenas. When I was in Botswana, the locals ate everything we let them and my PH make biltong out of the buffs.

    As for calibers, if dangerous game is not an option, any good medium (.270 to .35 Whelen) will work. Biggest thing (IMHO) would be to have GOOD tough bullets for the caliber. I'd also take two scopes - scopes have a rough life there - in rings and previously mounted/sighted in.
     
  22. Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow

    Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow member

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  23. rondog

    rondog Member

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    Well, from the looks of those six huge spikes facing forward, and the fact he weighs several hundred pounds, I just assume that if he was pissed off he could easily spear a human and cause serious bodily injury and death. I would call that "dangerous".

    That's why my grandson is standing on "this" side of the flower garden, I was cautioning him that we don't want to get too close and make that feller feel threatened in any way. He also had several cows and calves with him, and we stayed far away from them too.

    I guess I'm just not as manly as you, I consider anything that's unpredictable and can kill me as dangerous.

    I'd still like to know what the .700 Nitro Express is used for. There's a gun shop here that has them in stock, and the rifles too. Must be for T-Rex's that escape off the island.
     
  24. BigBuckMaster

    BigBuckMaster member

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    The 700 Nitro Express came about when a customer of Holland & Holland wanted to purchase a 600 Nitro Express double rifle, but H&H had sold the "last one". Undaunted, the customer pushed the project ahead and H&H built a 700 N.E. double rifle for him. Currently H&H, Watson Bros. and Searcy Enterprises offer double rifles in 700 N.E. Hambrusch Hunting Weapons of Ferlach, Austria offers a bolt-action repeater in 700 N.E. as well. Standard ballistics indicate a 1000 bullet at 2000 f.p.s. However, there has been some discussion of penetration problems with the cartridge and talk of increasing the bullet weight to 1200 grains while keeping velocity at 2000 f.p.s. to improve penetration. Rifles for this caliber weigh in the 16-20 pound range and only the fittest of men can carry such a burden for 20 miles on an elephant track in the hot African sun.



    A 700 Nitro Express was taken on a recent elephant hunt in Botswana with Safaris Botswana Bound, and the following report was provided by Graeme Pollock.


    Similarly, professional hunter Mark Sullivan who has hunted with a 16 pound Watson Brother's 700 Nitro Express, finds it a bit too heavy to get onto charging buffalo as quickly as he would like. When considering the cost of a rifle in 700 Nitro Express, the weight and difficulty of carrying one, and the savage recoil, the performance on game is 'rather disappointing.'
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2008
  25. NCsmitty

    NCsmitty Member

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    Capstick

    The stories of Capstick always conjured up visions of a 2000 lb. Cape Buffalo charging out of the bush at 30 yds and sliding dead at your feet from a well placed brain shot.
    I do not hunt anymore, just punch paper, but that excitement and oneness with nature are memories that I'll forever hold special, and that was hunting whitetails, not dangerous game. Those who are fortunate enough to be able to plan hunts in other states or countries need to treasure those moments for the rocking chair.
    As far as rifles for Africa, I would think a 30-06 or a 300 Magnum would suffice for most non-dangerous game. For dangerous game there's a lot of choices, but I've always had a penchant for the 460 Weatherby. :)

    NCsmitty
     
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