Federal made a winner!

[mesinge2]

I purchased a Taurus Judge when they first came out. I was impressed with the 45LC ammo, the #4 shot ammo, but the OOO buckshot (the reason I bought it) was painfully inaccurate. The following is 5 subsequent shots with Winchester Super-X .410 Bore 2 1/2" OOO Buck with 3 pellets from the 2.5" Chamber Judge with 3" Barrel at 14 yards.



Pathetic Right!

I was throughly disappointed and ready to sell the gun. Then I heard of this new ammo for the Judge, actually made for it. Federal Premium Personal Defense .410 Handgun 2 1/2" OOO Buckshot with 4 pellets. This is the same gun and the same range (14 yards).



Amazing improvement. I think the trick is that the pellets of the Federal are contained within the wad therefore clustering the shot. I know I sound like an ad for Federal but they really did create a winner.

 

[z3ro]

Nice grouping!!!

Question: how do you like the gun in general?

 

[mesinge2]

Incredibly well made gun and now with this grouping it is an amazing self-defense weapon. Plus Tracker Hogue monogrips fit on the Judge as well as crimison trace laser grips.

 

[z3ro]

Ive seen quite a few of these at local pawn shops as well as gun stores. I think its a beautiful looking handgun, ive just never had the money to pick one up

 

[mgkdrgn]

Oddly enough, I put both those rounds through the chrony just yesterday.

-----------------------
Taurus Judge Ultralite, 4" barrel, 2.5" chamber,
8' to Chrony

Federal 4 pellet 000 buck load
859, 874, 868 fps

Winchester 3 pellet 000 buck load
981, 928, 975 fps

Remington #9 shot (for reference)
901, 955, 930 fps

45 Colt, 255 SWC over 6.5gr green dot
758, 780 fps
------------------------

I -really- wanted to like the Federal ammo, as it offered an extra 000 ball in the 2.5" format. However, the "vertical zipper" pattern and loosing 75-100+ fps gives me pause.

To me, the whole reason for firing something with a pattern is to, well, get a pattern. I rather like your Winchester pattern ... turns near misses into hits. Not so with the zipper.

Also, 14 yards is out of the Judge's "niche", beyond SD range. 14 feet would be more to the point.

IMHO, your mileage may vary. No warranty expressed or implied. Void in all 50 state, PR, and/or anywhere prohibited by law. Any resemblance to real people or events is a damn shame.

 

[mesinge2]

However, the velocity is about the same as a .38 SPL and it is 4 accurate 38 SPL rounds to center mass per trigger pull. 20 .38 SPL rounds in 5 pulls of the trigger. Instead of carrying a 5 or 6 shot 38, I could carry a 20 shot 38 in the form of the Judge.

At 14 feet the spread would be less than a 5" group.

 

[Steve C]

Lower velocity makes for tighter paterns with shot gun loads. There's a reason shotguns are called scatter guns. 000 is .36" diameter and about 73 grains in weight. Multiple hits should be effective but will likely not penerate as well as a .38 spl. The guys at the Box of Truth did some penetration and other informal testing of the Judge and you can read their results at http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot41.htm

 

[mesinge2]

Thanks, Steve. I like the Box of Truth site. The Federal Pellets are also copper jacketed not just lead, I wonder if that would enhance penetraition and prevent them from flattning themselves out.

 

[Grey54956]

While each pellet in the 4 pellet load sees a 19% decrease in energy over the 3 pellet load, the total energy of the load is actually increased by about 8%. I am guessing that this is due to the higher mass of the load creating a higher chamber pressure.

What you lose in potential penetration, you may very well make up for with total energy transfer, seeing as the total energy is higher and the pattern smaller. Bad news for being on the receiving end.

Typical engagement range will probably be less than 14 yards, so patterns will be even tighter. Ouch.

 

[Stainz]

I still find myself looking over the pusher's stash of Judge revolvers, even after trying one over two years back at the range. I swapped with a fellow at the public range - he shot one of my 625MGs in .45 Colt, with my 850+ fps 250gr GDJHPs and 255gr LSWCs. He didn't like my wood grips - said it was tough on recoil. His 'ribber' grips were nasty feeling. He couldn't hit the small (8"?) rebounding steel plates with it - I couldn't hit them with his 'cowboy' MagTech ammo in his Judge. His .410 shot load was too fine, and left a swirl pattern on the blank side of a large bg silhouette. We left the range that day without any envy over the other fellow's revolver.

They are a novelty. Yes, I may make the trek to the pusher's this afternoon... I'll probably look at the 3" chamber models... look only, of course. YMMV.

Stainz

 

[rhinoh]

I vote for the first pattern in the OPs test
I want it to spread out if I'm using the Judge, to me thats the whole point of shot. If I wanted a tight pattern, but perhaps risking a miss, I'd just load it up with 45LC.

 

[MCgunner]

I like the pattern of the Federal. I want all my shot in the kill zone, myself. A miss won't work for me. The idea is, the BG just got hit by 4 ball from a .36 navy colt all at once. Federal claims 1200 fps from the pistol length barrel. Don't look like it makes it out of a 4" barrel, maybe 6"? I kinda doubt 2" more barrel is going to help that much, though. Looks like this is THE load for home defense for the judge, though.

I don't have a judge, but thanks for the post. I wondered how the Federal stuff would perform. That's awesome!

 

[MCgunner]

BTW, 14 yards is extreme range for a gunfight, especially a home defense type shooting. I think in terms of 14 feet, myself. This is a VERY tight, useful pattern at that range and shorter range will be even better. Awesome. This is what the Judge is supposed to be about, multiple torso hits with one pull of the trigger.

 

[mesinge2]

I chose to post the 14 yard targets because the with targets at 7 yards it was hard to see individual pellets holes in the target with the Federal.

 

[KBintheSLC]

Nice pattern... I'd still likely choose .45LC for my defensive load if I were a Judge owner. However, I doubt that this 000 buck loading would tickle either.

 

[m2steven]

I have a judge - it's about 3 weeks old. 3 inch barrel, 2.5 inch cylinder. The thing about this gun is the fun to shoot factor. It makes a lot of noise and kicks hard. The superior Taurus grip turns the recoil into a 6-Flags experience - fun.

I found the BB sized shot to stay fairly well grouped at about 30 feet. The 3 shot '000' ammo didn't do so well.
The pattern from the new 4 shot '000' ammo looks good.

An observation about the quality of the gun. I can tell you that even the quality of the small screws in the gun is high. That's because several of them were not tightened down at the factory. Nevertheless, the double-action trigger pull was extremely pleasant and the gun was, I think, a good investment. When I get it back, I'll buy some of the new '000' shells and try them out. Also looking for a supply of 45LC ammo. Seems that someone is shooting it - it's nearly as hard to find as 380.

Good Gun! Gonna throw some clay pigeons soon...

 

[earlthegoat2]

I would call both those shot patterns acceptable. The Federal wins by a landslide though. I have often called the Judge a compromise gun. It is a compromise in accuracy for power. I dont own one but I would probably gravitate towards a 45 Colt dedicated revolver.

 

[Moonclip]

Walmarts in my arwa sell the Federal .410 handgun loads. Problem is, they sell them in CA as well, a state that bans .410 handguns!