Filling the grain on an oil finish without removing the finish?

[someguy2800]

Hey guys,

I am finishing up on two sporter project guns I picked up this winter. One of them is in a very handsomely shaped walnut stock in nice condition except that whoever did the oil finish on it didn’t fill the grain before they pit the oil on. I had to reshape a few areas on the stock so I need to touch up the finish but what I’m wondering is while I’m at it is there a good way to fill the grain without stripping it down to bare wood? I was thinking of wet sanding the existing oil finish with new oil to see if I can fill the pores with with the sanding dust of the oil. I remember seeing some stuff in a video that was a powder you put on the stock and mixed in with the oil to form a clear filler. Any ideas?

 

[jmr40]

I don't know how well it will work without stripping the finish, but something like this is what you need.

FWIW it has been years since I've done any of this and this is not a recommendation of any particular brand. I just googled wood pore filler and found this. There may be better options, but something "like" this is what you need.

https://www.amazon.com/Old-Masters-...pID=41XzRtiubhL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

 

[someguy2800]

I’m not sure how well that will work without first stripping the stock. I was hoping to avoid using a creme type filler and do more of the wet sanding with oil method.

 

[Schlegel]

One of reasons real shellac has continued to be used is that you can put it over or under basically any other finish. You can fill in with shellac and spray or wipe a top coat of more durable stuff on after.

 

[someguy2800]

One of reasons real shellac has continued to be used is that you can put it over or under basically any other finish. You can fill in with shellac and spray or wipe a top coat of more durable stuff on after.

Any recommendations on how to do that? Would I apply it to the pin holes in the stock one by one or will it fill them in if I just rub it on. Never used shellac before.

 

[Skylerbone]

My woodworking skills haven’t advanced much since high school but we used to use a lot of Danish Oil finish. Defy and Watco with some fine steel wool between coats, and tack cloth to remove all trace of dust. It took a few coats before those pin holes disappeared but they did (for those who made the effort). The great part was of course the near zero effort it took. I still have the walnut bow rack I built and the finish has held up with an occasional wipe down with Pledge.

 

[Schlegel]

1st response..I think of shellac first because instruments are why I learned about finishes. Just apply several layers, letting it dry between applications. Then knock it back with very fine sandpaper. Once the surface is level cover with a topcoat or 2 of a durable type.

2nd response... But if you want a more durable finish why not make a slurry of oil and fine walnut dust and pore fill with this then sand it back and put on a couple of smooth glossy top coats. Do you have some scrap wood to make sanding dust?

 

[Schlegel]

If you do the latter pore fill a base coat of oil finish goes on the bare wood 1st.

 

[Mizar]

OP, your proposed way of filling the grain will work if you let the oil cure a little bit - to get tacky, and then sand it. It's better to post good pictures of the stock in question, because the general term "oil finish" does not give enough information - is it just a polymerizing oil (BLO), or it's a Tru-Oil (Danish oil) type of varnish? Shellac can be used also as grain filler, but you must first blend in the reshaped areas with the proper oil and wait for the finish to cure. You can buy a ready mixed Shellac from Home Depot stores or the like and dilute it 1:1 with denatured alcohol to thin it and to dry faster. You proceed the same as with oil - when it starts to get tacky you begin to sand it down, perpendicular to the grain orientation. Repeat as many times as needed and finish with your preferred oil.

 

[Schlegel]

Pore size determines if filler like dust is needed. If small, just multiple coats will work. If large, wood dust will really speed up the process and improve the look.

 

[Laphroaig]

I'm having a hard time visualizing your problem. If you want to keep the oil finish, it sounds to me like you need to keep applying it until the pores are filled. I've been finishing some stocks recently with raw linseed oil, and it takes multiple coats to get a smooth finish. The first few soak in fairly rapidly then decline as the pores get filled. I've been doing 4 or 5 coats, but I've heard of custom stockmakers who do 10 or 15 coats.

Now I'm not recommending raw linseed unless you know for sure that is the original finish as it takes forever to dry after the first couple coats are applied, I think that tung or Danish oils are more user friendly. Boiled linseed also dries faster I've been told. Oil finishes are beautiful but take time to apply.

 

[forward observer]

I had asked a similar question on another forum. I had just purchased an 1892 Winchester sporting rifle made in 1911 and even though the oil finished stock appeared to be in quite good shape it had a raised grain feel--especially the forearm. Somebody said they had gotten good results with 0000 steel wool and Renaissance wax. I thought this stuff was just for protection, but I tried it and it did the trick. I don't know how permanent it will be, but it's been about 6 months since I did it and it seems to be holding up through a lot of handling.

Cheers

 

[someguy2800]

Thanks for the suggestions guys. Here is a picture of the stock. I have no idea what specifically it was finished in beyond being an oil finish. I’m afraid I’m not knowledgable about such things. I grew up in the polyurethane era so that’s all I’ve ever used in my wood working.



I have a bottle of truoil so I guess I will start in on it with wet sandpaper and steel wool and see what happens. Anyone think truoil is a bad idea?

 

[Mizar]

That sure looks like a Tru-Oil finish to me. Just be careful around the edges with the steel wool.

 

[Scooter22]

Thats does look like TruOil or one of the wipe on finishes. You can rub a coat of TO in let it dry and knock it back and add another until it's filled to your satisfaction. Follow the directions on the bottle. I've used it a lot over the years. Some guns from the factory have a open grain look. Like old Mossberg .22s so if I use it I let the pours look like they would from the factory. Other stocks I've filled like glass. But DON'T use SW anymore. Most is China junk that breaks and imbeds in the wood, finish and fingers. Go to a big box store and get some of the 3M sanding pads. They are marked with the SW equivalent. IIRC the light grey and grey are the most like 4/0 and 2/0 sw. Good luck.

 

[243winxb]

Tru oil , dry , sand, repeat. No steel wool.

 

[Picher]

I'm skeptical about trying to add to existing "mystery" finishes. I'd just remove the existing, sand to bare wood, apply filler and finish with multiple coats of Tru-Oil. An overlay finish could flake off in use and then it's more work to remove the whole mess. Good luck with whatever you try.

 

[Offfhand]

Save yourself some trouble and wipe the old finish off with varnish remover. It is fast and easy to use and works great with Tru-Oil type finishes. In a couple hours or less you'll have clean wood to work with and ready for a proper finishing job.

 

[someguy2800]

I wanted to thank you guys for the advice, this is turning out beautifully. The first thing I tried was wet sanding it with 400 grit wet/dry paper with truoil. That was not really very effective since you can’t see the pits when it’s covered in oil and the truoil tacks up so quickly that you don’t get a whole lot of time to sand. It did fill up the grain about half way though. The next night I applied another coat of truoil rubbing it on with a paper towel as I am used to doing with stains and wipe on urethanes. That is the wrong thing to do since it’s too sticky and picks up all the lint from the towel.

After that I did some reading and watched a video on the correct way to apply it with your finger tip. I buffed it out with OO steel wool and applied another fairly thick coat last night with my fingers and that worked well but it was a bit too thick and I got some runs. Tonight I buffed it out again with OO steel wool but this time kept going till I got 98% of the pits out. After blowing the dust out with air it was a really beautiful semi gloss finish and I really contemplated rubbing on some furniture wax and leaving it that way, but a polished blue gun deserves a gloss finish stock so I rubbed another thin coat on. I really got the feel for how thick to apply it now and it went on so fast and smooth I can’t believe I ever bothered with urethanes in the past.

This worked out great and I’m glad I was able to keep the finish intact. It may sound silly but the reason i did not want to strip and refinish is that this was somebody’s used but cared for hunting rifle with worn bluing on the working parts and some ding and dents on the left side and I wanted to just refresh it and class it up a bit while still leaving it’s scars. I figured they were probably well earned and it adds to the character of the rifle. I will post some pictures when I get done touching up the bluing and put it back together.

 

[someguy2800]

There one refinished Type 99 Arisaka. I touched up the blueing with a blue wonder bluing kit also. I flattened out the last coat of truoil with 00 fine and then 0000 super fine steel wool and then gave it three coats of Birchwood Casey stock wax. The stock wax did not bring back the gloss as much as I had hoped so I may strip the wax and give it another coat of truoil. It doesn't quite have the wet look I wanted.

 

[Scooter22]

Thats looks great! I agree 100% with restoring a finish instead of a refinish. You still have the original character but with a fresh face.

 

[1KPerDay]

I like it. Wet/polyurethane-looking stocks don't look as good as a nice buffed sheen IMO. Wet stocks look plasticky. Like the old Remingtons with the 1/2" thick poly.

 

[someguy2800]

I like it. Wet/polyurethane-looking stocks don't look as good as a nice buffed sheen IMO. Wet stocks look plasticky. Like the old Remingtons with the 1/2" thick poly.

I think a glossy polyurethane looks fake, but a glossy oil finish looks fantastic.

 

[someguy2800]

Well that didn't last long, I just did not like the semi gloss finish. It just didn't show the wood grain and color at all. I stripped all the wax off with wax and grease remover and gave it two more coats of truoil by hand. Much better.