Finally bought my first (and now second) SIG

[chaim]

Well, a couple weeks ago I posted that I bought a 9mm CPO SIG 226.

MD has a waiting period so I couldn't pick it up right away. I was "not disapproved" last week (yes, the MD State Police can not say you are approved for a gun, the official wording is "not disapproved) but was unable to pick it up. I'll finally be able to pick it up either Monday morning (I work at 11am) or anytime on Tues.

I will be sure to leave a detailed post here about my impressions when I finally get to handle and shoot it. I will probably shoot it back to back with my 9mm CZ 75B for a good comparison.

Anyway, while waiting I got impatient. I've been doing a lot of SIG research the past couple weeks. I've been looking at a lot of SIGs. Even though I haven't even taken my first ever SIG home yet I seemed to have been bitten by the SIG bug so many talk about.

Well, I did it. I ended up buying a second SIG online. MD has a one month waiting period after you buy one handgun before you can buy another. I haven't even picked up my first, and I went and bought another. Luckily the seller was understanding and the dealer will hold the gun for 2 weeks for me after he gets payment. So, figure 2-4 days for payment to get there, he'll hold it for 2 weeks before sending it, it will probably take a day to get to my FFL (I assume a gun will be sent next day delivery) and by that time only the one week waiting period will be about all I have to wait for.

What did I buy- I got a nice used SIG 229 in .40S&W for around $450 with shipping. After FFL transfer fees I'll be right around $500*. I can't wait.



*after spending that much on 2 guns in less than a month I'll probably have to wait a while on some of my other desired purchases, though I may just have to find a nice 239 or 239SAS to put on layaway before I stop

 

[GroovedG19]

Congrats on your 2 new Sigs.Own a P229 in .40S&W and it is the smoothest shooting pistol I own.Very accurate and reliable as well.Good price you got on it too.

 

[bluto]

Let me add my own congrats. I own 6, all in classic P series. You've made excellent choices in the two you've purchased so far. And the prices are teriffic.

CPO's, as you'll probably find out, are pretty much "like new" from the reports that I've read. My P226 in 9mm is just a fantastic pistol. If I had to grab one 9mm, that'd be the one. Take time to "bond" with your Sig and you'll begin to see what all the fuss is about (not knocking other brands). I hope a P220 is in your future. That's my favorite Sig. Sort of "first among equals" so to speak.

Tomorrow I'm going to rent a CZ 75B and shoot it side by side with my 226. All the discussion on these boards comparing the two has made me curious. I'm sure the CZ will be impressive. It would be interesting to compare impressions: one from a Sig shooter trying out a CZ and one from a CZ shooter trying out a SIG.

Have fun at the range. Look forward to your report.

 

[klover]

must be contagious

me too

 

[chaim]

I picked it up today

I picked up my 226 today. I haven't fired it yet (I just took it home to handle and clean first) but I do have some first impressions none-the-less. I hope I can get back to the range this evening but most likely I won't be able to fire it until tomorrow evening.

Anyway, my first impression is how easily this thing takes down. Not that it is difficult to take any gun apart really (with a few exceptions I suppose), but this is particularly easy with fewer steps than anything else I own. You lock the slide back, turn the takedown lever, release the slide stop and take the slide off the frame. No taking the takedown lever or slide stop out of the frame. No pulling the trigger. No lining any lines or dots up on the slide and frame. No nothing else, that's it. Getting it back together is also amazingly simple (put the slide back on, lock the slide back, turn the takedown lever- and I'm not 100% sure you actually need to lock the slide back for re-assembly).

Dry firing it is probably the best overall trigger I have in an auto. Some may be lighter in DA, some lighter in SA, some may have a shorter SA reach (only my 1911), but none are better overall. My Taurus PT140 Milennium Pro is actually a lighter DA pull but it is much longer and just doesn't have the overall "feel" of the SIG trigger (the SIG trigger pull feels more substantial). The DA on my CZ is a tad lighter, but it is much longer in both the pull and trigger reach, both are about the same smoothness with the advantage barely going to the SIG (maybe). The SA on my CZ is about the same as the SIG SA in lightness but it isn't as smooth as the SIG, it has much more takeup than the SIG and it is longer in pull and in reach.

Build quality seems top notch as well. Since my SIG is used with who knows how many rounds before I bought it and my CZ has many thousands of rounds through it I compared the workmanship in the frame instead of the slide (I figured that would have less noticable wear due to use). The CZ did have some noticable machining marks but isn't bad, but the SIG had nothing I could see whatsoever. Inside and outside fit, finish and workmanship was near the same. I also compared it to my Taurus M. Pro which I had to use the slide for comparison (the Taurus is polymer)- I was surprised that the internal workmanship was much better in comparison on the Taurus than I thought- not quite up to the SIG's standards (but close) and much better than my CZ's. Overall, the SIG's workmanship inside and out is impeccable.

The gun is pretty big but really doesn't feel like it. It is noticably a bit wider than my CZ but I have thick hands so it still feels very good. It is about 1/2" shorter in length than my CZ (eyeballing it). It is probably about the same height but may be just a tad shorter (it is hard to tell eyeballing it and I didn't break out my calipers). It definately feels a lot lighter. It is around 28oz unloaded. In size it really does look and feel very similar to the CZ 40B I used to own (and hope to one day own another). It would probably make a very good winter concealed carry gun when wearing layers of clothing or a good all day open carry gun, but summer concealed carry would probably be a bit tight.

One interesting thing I noticed inside the slide (I didn't take the gun apart before buying it) is the prior owner must have etched his/her initials into the finish. I forget for sure what the initials are (I think it is "MB") but they are there. There also is some noticable wear (if you look very closely) on the grips and the barrel has the usual half-moon wear marks. I guess it gives the otherwise nearly new looking gun some character- I don't mind, I knew I was buying a used gun.

Unfortunately, it did only come with 2 10 round mags. I do have 3 used factory 15 rounders on order that should be here soon. If the 3 used 15 rounders are reliable I doubt I'll be using the 10 rounders much so I'll probably sell them for the cost of shipping if anyone wants them in one of the states (CA, NY) that limits gunowners to 10 rounders so they won't go to waste (I'm pretty sure these are new mags).

I can't wait to fire it.

I am also even more impatient for the 229 I ordered.

I asked the dealer about a transfer (it has been a couple years since I last checked- back then they charged $75 so I wasn't really planning on using them but figured I'd check, maybe I'd get a discount since I just spent nearly $600 with them). They charge $100 and only do transfers for guns which they don't carry and can't order through their distributors. Oh well, I was pretty much planning to transfer the 229 through one of three other dealers anyway.

 

[AK103K]

Your done for now!

I started out with one little ittsy bittsy P230, and now have 10 SIG's, and I expect it will be 11 soon. I keep hearing this plaintive little cry calling my name everytime I drive by my local shop.(they know me and my fetishes well there)

 

[lyricsdad]

i purchased a cpo sig a while back.. yeah i was comparing it to a brand new sig, and just the plastic handle had a nick, and the outer blueing of the barrel had very slight wear..

it seemed almost brand new, I have since put wear on it, and it looks used, beautiful exterior finish, I would like to get the aluminum anodizing maybe touched up on the grip as there are little nicks, from me carrying it.

I like my p226, it is not had a failure once, feeds and fired everything, the pistol has an excellent trigger, kind springy and not as solid as my walther, but I like it, it is my number one target shooting/plinking pistol.

Note, there are not tool markings on this thing at all, its pretty amazing the workmanship that these things have..

 

[Falconeer]

I recently attended a three day shooting class (Randy Cain's Tactical Handgun 101) with my CPO P229 in 357 Sig. I shot a bit over 500 rounds, and had ONE malfunction that was due to a bad round (all the ammo was my reloads). I didn't clean, oil, or otherwise care for the gun the entire time (I was using the class as a test). The mags were used that came with the gun, plus one additional new purchase. All three mags ended up dropped in the dirt from time to time. The gun worked flawlessly the entire time. Accuracy was top notch when I did my part. The class also cemented the my opinion of the P229 as an incredibly comfortable carry gun (I used a C-TAC IWB holster). All in all it's deepened my appreciation for Sig!

I SO desperately need to get another P226.

 

[bluto]

chaim -

Detailed Range Report!

 

[.45FMJoe]

I recently attended a three day shooting class (Randy Cain's Tactical Handgun 101) with my CPO P229 in 357 Sig. Accuracy was top notch when I did my part.

Hmmmm ... OK Mr. Speed Racer.

P.S. I would bust your cajones about the Glock reset being better but after the class I ditched the Glock as my carry gun. I'm now using a Series 80 Colt Government model.

As soon as I finish my papers for school we are gonna have to setup a range trip!

 

[Falconeer]

Hmmmm ... OK Mr. Speed Racer.

I'm working on that!! Like I said, when I do my part the pistol does great things. I spent some quality time at my local range last weekend and had some fantastic groups when I took my time and concentrated on what I was doing. I spent a couple of magazines on double action only and was getting good solid hits.

At least you were shooting a Glock in the class. When Randy discovered I was shooting 357 Sig from a Sig I thought he'd throw me off the range!

j/k folks, Randy was fantastic the whole time. He's just not a fan of either the 357 Sig round or the Sig pistols in general. He's a dyed in the wool 1911 fan.

PS: When I was a kid I so wanted my very own Mach 5 car.

 

[chaim]

(note: This post is a duplicate of a range report thread I'm starting. I'm only doing that since someone here on this thread asked for a range report but I'm still starting the thread so more people will see it and possibly have advice to help me out)

OK, on Wen. evening I finally took it to the range. I was very disappointed.

First the good news:

It was accurate, very accurate. I first shot 30 rounds out of my CZ 75B. My CZ is one of my top 2 or 3 handguns for accuracy in my hands (the only gun I consistently shoot better is my 1911, sometimes I shoot my 6" S&W 586 better). After those 30 rounds from the CZ I kept the target to compare, then I shot about 50 rounds out of the SIG and I shot them into a smaller sized group. I am looking forward to checking its accuracy against my 1911- I may have a new most accurate pistol.

It also was very comfortable to shoot. It is relatively lightweight and large but the recoil was still virtually unnoticable (weight wasn't a problem) and in my beefy hands the grip was extremely comfortable (size wasn't a problem).

The bad news:

It is currently the least reliable pistol I've ever owned. My first 6 shots (UMC ammo)- the first shot failed to eject, the rest failed to feed, it was quite an expensive single shot pistol. I then switched to the S&B JHPs I brought and they were only slightly better. I then sprayed some Remington Dry Lube into the gun and only had slightly better results but I had a FTF (feed) or FTE on every mag, and often more than one.

I remembered reading online that SIGs like to run wet so I took it partially apart (I took the slide off the frame) and lubed the rails with Breakfree CLP. For the next 50 rounds or so I had virtually no problems but as soon as the Breakfree started to dry just a little I started having FTF and FTE problems again (sometimes every mag, sometimes every couple mags). For the rest of the 120 rounds total I fired it remained the same.

I also had problems with the gun not locking back on the last round. Since I've heard of a lot of people with high grips having this problem with SIG due to the positioning of the slide stop lever I intentionally put my hand as low as I could (about an inch below the lever) and actually watched my hand (not the target) to be sure I didn't creep up when I fired and it still didn't lock back. It also did it left handed. However, when the CLP seemed to help the other reliability issues it did seem to lock back a little more consistently.

So right now I'm not too happy with this gun.

Still, I'm not ruling out that it will be a good gun yet as at this point there are a few possible extenuating circumstances:

It could be a bad mag. I only used one of the 10 round mags that came with the gun. The SIG case is rather large so I left it at home and only brought one mag. It is very possible that it was a bad mag (though that wouldn't explain the better performance for a short period after adding lube).

I didn't clean and lube the gun before going to the range. I picked it up Tues but didn't have time to clean it before going to the range Wen after work. It is possible the packing grease/oil was a problem. Also, since SIGs like to run wet the fact that I didn't fully lube it may have caused the problems (it did run better for a while after lubing the rails). Still, when I relubed the rails I only got about 50 rounds out of it without trouble- having to relube every 50 rounds at the range is not acceptable. I may go to grease to see if this is the problem- my Ruger KP345 also likes to run wet and grease has solved all its problems, this can be the cause of all the SIG problems (too slow a slide due to too much resistance could cause the lockback problems) and the grease won't run off or dry as fast as oil.

I was using cheap ammo that not all guns like (S&B and UMC). S&B can be great ammo, but online you see quite a few people whose guns don't like it. UMC is just cheap stuff and not all guns like it. I may do better with no changes other than using WWB or Speer Lawman or some other practice ammo instead of these brands.

So, there are several possible explainations other than gun trouble so the jury is still out. Also, at worst, it was a used gun so I blame that and not SIG, but I may get to see how good their warranty is.

 

[Falconeer]

It is currently the least reliable pistol I've ever owned. My first 6 shots (UMC ammo)- the first shot failed to eject, the rest failed to feed, it was quite an expensive single shot pistol. I then switched to the S&B JHPs I brought and they were only slightly better. I then sprayed some Remington Dry Lube into the gun and only had slightly better results but I had a FTF (feed) or FTE on every mag, and often more than one.

All Sig pistols (in fact pretty much every pistol) come from the factory coated in a tacky, sticky rust preventative. It comes off as a brownish-red paste. You have to strip the pistol down and clean all the preventative off before use, then lube it. The CPO pistols may have been recoated, or may not have any lube on them at all. It sounds very much like this is what has happened to you. It's unlikely (barring something very wrong with the gun itself) that the ammo types you're feeding it are causing the problem; Sigs historically will feed and shoot damn near anything out there.

I highly recommend you field strip, spray it down with CLP and make sure it's clean. Then lube it; Sigs do like to be run 'damp', but they don't require it. I shot 500 rounds over three days with no maintenance and the gun ran like a clock. You want to see lube on the parts, but not dripping/running off. Here's my procedure (I don't have the gun in front of me and my description of the actual part names may be off ):

1) Set the slide top down on your bench. Looking straight down, apply some oil/lube to the following places: 1/2 inch in front of the ejection port (where the top of the breach block makes contact), inside both slide rails, top of the central ridge behind the breach (about half way back is fine)
2) Pick up the barrel and with your fingers apply a thin coat of lube around the entire round part of the barrel. Set the barrel in the slide. Apply some lube to the top of the two locking lugs.
3) Holding the slide in your left hand with the barrel towards you, inside up place the spring and guide rod assembly in your right hand and install it in the slide. Doing this with the barrel pointed away from you guarantees you're going to catch the spring in the chest/face if it slips out of your hand.
4) Pick up the receiver. Apply lube to: the hammer face, both rails, and the top of the locking block (where the lugs on the barrel lock).
5) Complete reassembly, rack the slide several times, wipe away any excess.

The mag problem could be one of two things. One, the mag springs are shot. Call Sig, tell them you bought a CPO and the mags don't lock the slide back on empty. They'll send you new springs. My CPO P229 has the same problem and the springs are en route. The other problem could be the mags are dirty. The Sig armorer manual states that the pistol should not be considered clean until the mags have been cleaned.

Disassembly of the the mags is fairly straight forward. Use a punch to press the small 'button' on the bottom and at the same time start sliding the mag base forward. What you find depends on the mags. 10 rnd mags have a plastic base with a small metal plate held in place my two lips. You'll need to remove the plastic base, then carefully push one side of the plate down while lifting on the other to get it clear of the lips (it won't slide out as the mag spring is attached). Be careful to control the spring! Full cap mags usually don't have the lips holding the plate so it will come out when you remove the base. Once you have the mags in their component parts, wipe them down (inside and out) with a clean cloth and reassemble. DON'T lube the mags; they'll just collect dirt and cause problems.

Check out SigForum for more info. Also, Chris Orndorff (the mod of the Sig gunsmithing forum on SigForum) has a DVD out on total disassembly, reassembly, etc of the Sig classic pistols which is great. Also, Massad Ayoob has a book called the Gun Digest Book of Sig-Sauer: a complete look at sig-sauer pistols which has a good general section on general maintenance.

Hope this helps. Once you get the pistol cleaned/lubed up and shooting properly I think you'll find the Sig bug has you good!