Finding a supply of lead

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mohunter55

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Missouri
I plan to start casting my own, but i would first like to get a good supply of lead before i purchase the equipment. I have called tire shops in my area, but so far all seem to already have a company or someone who gets their wheel weights. I noticed i can buy lead on ebay for $56 for 50 lbs shipped. This lead is wheel weights that someone else has already melted down. Am I okay to buy this lead? Are there any problems with doing this, for instance i understand that zinc can ruin your lead.

also, if you know of a reasonably priced online source, let me know.
 
Casting Alloy

We have a little bit that we would be happy to sell. It's certified analysis foundry alloy, 2/6/92. This would be a ready-to-go way to start casting. Buying wheelweights already in ingots would also be highly viable assuming you do enough fluxing and don't need real hard bullets.

Depending upon the amount of casting you want to do at a sitting, you might do well to get a propane burner (like for turkey fryers) and an 8 or 12 quart cast iron dutch oven and run 60-80 lbs. per potful. This would assume that you found a reasonable supply of raw wheel weights.

Anyhow, however you wind up doing it, you'll have fun!

Brad
 

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Thats some lead....what are you charging? I am getting some for $1 per pound from a private seller plus flat rate shipping box price at the end of this month, and $42 for 30 pounds, wheel weights.
 
I have called tire shops in my area, but so far all seem to already have a company or someone who gets their wheel weights.

That's the last thing you want to do. You need to go down and pay them a visit. I made the calls and had the same luck as you. Then I started showing up and asking for WW's. It seems like it's harder for them to say no to your face. I offered to pay them and told them what I thought was a fair price. They said don't worry about it just take them. Every so often I will bring them a 12 pack of Coke and that seems to get me larger quantities. I'm up to around 1,400 pounds of WW's now and it all cost me a 12 pack per bucket.
 
You can also tell your friends you're looking for lead. I've done that, and in the last month had over 200 pounds of lead delivered to my door. I've already smelted it into ingots and some has already been turned into bullets. I've got roughly a ton on hand at the present time, all cleaned and in ingots. I never, ever turn down any lead that's offered, especially if it's free........

Hope this helps.

Fred
 
Mohunter, where in missouri are u? I run a battery recycling center in St. Joseph and i always have lots of different lead that i could sell you. as long as i can get what the smelter pays me per pound then i'd sell to anyone
 
A good source for lead is often shooting ranges. The backstop lead can be smelted down and recast as ingots to make new bullets. This is often VERY dirty lead so it's best to do it in a dedicated smelting setup such as a turkey fryer and a metal pot, outside. Many trap/skeet ranges also have reclaimed lead shot for sale. Shot is a good antimony source, too.

I batch my range scrap ingots out of 60# pours to homogenize the lead alloy as much as possible. I find that the BHN (hardness) of my range scrap tends to be about 6-8, which is halfway between pure lead (3-4) and wheel weights (10-12). My source allows cast bullets and there's a lot of them shooting there.

Some ranges don't allow cast bullets so you will probably find a high amount of nearly pure lead from .22 rimfires and the cores of FMJ or plated bullets. This lead will tend to be quite soft and might need to be alloyed with something else to get the hardness up.

You could also try scrap-metal dealers. If there are any stained-glass shops or radiator repair places it's worth asking. Call the recyclers to find out what they pay, and be prepared to pay the same or a bit more.

Tire shops are pretty hit and miss, mostly miss. Nearly all the major shops (Wal-Mart, Firestone, Goodyear, Tire Kingdom, Tire Discounters, Pep Boys, etc) will have a contract with Johnson Controls or Exide Battery to return all used weights with the battery scrap. They won't let you buy or beg any lead. The people to ask are the independant shops- a lot are under contract, a lot aren't. I find that a shop that you do business with is more likely to let you get lead than a shop you don't.

I've had much better luck cruising by the tire shops right at opening or closing time when they are not busy. I usually bypass the front counter and ask the shop manager or lead tech directly, usually with a couple of $5 bills in my hand. I've also learned not to mention bullets and instead if asked, I say I make fishing weights. This is because there was a surprising number of people who when they heard BULLETS became unfriendly or even hostile in one case.

Something about tire weights- California banned lead wheel weights. Many manufacturers and distributors, rather than maintaining dual inventory systems for CA and Not-CA, decided to just not use lead anymore. Over the past year the amount of non-lead weights I find in my weight buckets has steadily increased. Instead of lead, it is common to find zinc and iron weights and these are useless to a bullet caster.

One thing to know- be very cautious of buying lead ingots from anyone you don't know, especially on eBay.

Once lead has been ingotized, you have no way of knowing what the actual source is.

Why is this a problem?

When I buy wheel weight lead, I want 100% wheel weight alloy. This will typically be between 3% and 5% antimony and slight tin.

If I want pure lead, I want pure lead.

Some people melt down the entire bucket of wheel weights without removing the stick-on weights. Stick-ons are nearly pure soft lead and this dilutes the antimony content.

Some people may even melt down the wheel weights then bulk it up with whatever other lead they can find so they have more "wheel weight alloy" to sell. And that's technically not incorrect- it's still a "wheel weight alloy", but it has less antimony.

This deceit is especially common when talking about type metal alloys since these contain a higher percentage of antimony and very expensive tin! I personally will not buy any alloy claiming to be linotype, monotype, or foundry type that has been recast into ingots. I want to see it as type metal so I know that's what it is. This is still no guarantee since many type shops recast their alloys. But seeing type metal as letterpress is more a guarantee of alloy composition than whatever claims are made about their ingots. I honestly don't understand why a seller would smelt down letterpress into ingots anyway- typically, letterpress packs very well in boxes as is and you don't need to add a whole lot to a 10# or 20# pot to get a good tin level in the alloy.

There was one specific case in which a fellow was casting wheel-weight alloy ingots and then water quenching them to attain an increased hardness and then selling them as type metal ingots (which are harder). That meant he could about double the price of his ingots.

So why does this matter?

Antimony in lead bullets is useful to toughen up the lead. It allows hardening by water quenching or oven tempering. Tin is needed to make the lead flow better. Antimony by itself is difficult to alloy at home. Tin is easy to alloy, it's just very expensive compared to lead. A typical casting alloy is the HardBall alloy, 92% lead, 6% antimony and 2% tin.

So, long story short, I would rather buy raw wheel weights as wheel weights than ingots claiming to be wheel weights. That way I can know it's all clip-on weights. And I can save the stick-ons for other purposes. The same goes for type metal.
 
I am a part time plumber and any plumber that is removing old cast iron plumbing in renovations will have a supply of soft lead that can be alloyed to what you want. Ask them and you may find that they would like to help you rather than deal with the scrap yard. +1 on the fishing weights BTW.
 
When we moved here a year ago I had no source, so I stated calling the plumbers. One guy, who was also a loader, put me on to a recycle yard that wasn't in the phone book. I get a lot from them now and have since found a garage where I had some work done on the car. The garage just gives the w w to me. You don't want to call around as someone already said. For some reason when you call they automatically say no.
 
Mohunter, where in missouri are u? I run a battery recycling center in St. Joseph and i always have lots of different lead that i could sell you. as long as i can get what the smelter pays me per pound then i'd sell to anyone
We're 45 miles SE of KC. We use foundry lead for the bullet casting operation but buy dead-soft pipe or sheet lead for the roundball trade. I bet you know Randy Best!
 
A great post, Mr. Price!

So, long story short, I would rather buy raw wheel weights as wheel weights than ingots claiming to be wheel weights. That way I can know it's all clip-on weights. And I can save the stick-ons for other purposes. The same goes for type metal.

Damn straight! We have 3100 pounds of linotype in a Gaylord carton that we sell by the pound and I won't ingot-tize it for that very reason. I want folks to know that what they are getting is actually linotype.

Brad
 
Thanks, no Sawzall, either. :)
Never used linotype, just straight wheelweight metal. The people I get it from are old time casters, and so far it's been good stuff. :)
 
Just this morning I turned in some aluminum cans. It only cost me ten dollars to do so. Seems the scrap yard had wheel weights for .30 a pound. I came home with 100 pounds of them.
 
Before long, lead wheel weights will be a thing of the past.
Europe banned them 5 years ago, Jap auto makers have switched to zinc, California bans them, so will Washington state next year. Companies that stopped using lead or are phasing it out: Costco, Sams, Walmart, General Motors, Ford, Goodyear...the lists goes on.
The EPA is hell bent on banning lead, http://www.epa.gov/wastes/hazard/wastemin/members.htm
 
You can believe this or not, but I just had new tires installed on my truck and they re-used used weights! I heard this was happening, but never saw it until now. I would stop and get lead from these places, and all of a sudden, they quit selling to anyone. Now I know why!
 
Before long, lead wheel weights will be a thing of the past.
Brad, does this mean the demand for lead will go down and the commercial cost for lead will come down ... and maybe the cost of bullets will go down too?

Won't that be sweet! :D
 
Lead is a very fungible commodity. Most of the lead traversing the markets is recycled. When wheelweights aren't made of it anymore, that lead will go to other uses and demand will remain high. Consider the push on for "green" vehicles - lots of lead in those batteries, at least there will be until truly inexpensive, powerful batteries made of other elements become common.

Wheelweights are just a tiny piece of the market, I believe, and the movement away from lead ones won't impact the lead market. Just my opinion.
 
I have a secret formula for casting, using wheel weights~! :uhoh:

As received, wheel weights in its-self are very soft; so using a
1X1X1/2 of high speed babbit per 11 lbs of wheel weights, make
perfect bullets. ;)

That is, 1 inch in length, 1 inch in width, and 1/2 inch thick. :D

I have used this sucessfully when casting handgun bullets;
ranging from .38 Special, 9m/m (Lyman 121 grain conical mould),
.357 mag, .41 and .44 magnum, and .45 ACP~!. If mixed right,
this will allow you too shoot hard cast lead bullets without using
a gas check at over 1,000 fps~! :)
 
joetown, im in st. charles, looks like its a 4.5 hour difference...quite a bit of a haul for me although i guess if the price is right it would be worth the drive.
 
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