I have a .357 rifle that I think may be ideal for home and urban protection. After reading about the Fiocchi 148gr SJHP rounds, I wonder if they might be just the perfect round for this purpose. It's rated for 1500fps out of a pistol, so it must be screaming out of a rifle. I doubt the bullet would hold together well enough for hunting, but I wonder how well it would hold up for my intended purpose? Has anyone had experience with it?
Fiocchi 148gr .357 in a rifle
- Thread starter pjr1960
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mr.trooper
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Ill debate the "screaming" part. you will probably get 1600fps out of a rifle.
Why is that? because the powder is fast burning. It is a handgun round, therefore the powder is intended to burn up in a short barrel. There are "carbine only" loads, but they usualy use slower burning powders to take advantage of the extra bbl length, or use an over-charge of pistol powder that would be unsafe for a handgun.
THAT being said, yes a 357 rifle is great for urban defence. a 357 lever gun with the stock and barrel cut down to legal limits would give you more capacity than a handgun and give you a smidge more power.
as for the bullet, a semi-jacketed 148gr hollow point will be fine for hunting. what do you think everyone uses? do you think its gunna just disintegrate or something? as far as i know there arent any varmint bullets made for 357 magnum.
Why is that? because the powder is fast burning. It is a handgun round, therefore the powder is intended to burn up in a short barrel. There are "carbine only" loads, but they usualy use slower burning powders to take advantage of the extra bbl length, or use an over-charge of pistol powder that would be unsafe for a handgun.
THAT being said, yes a 357 rifle is great for urban defence. a 357 lever gun with the stock and barrel cut down to legal limits would give you more capacity than a handgun and give you a smidge more power.
as for the bullet, a semi-jacketed 148gr hollow point will be fine for hunting. what do you think everyone uses? do you think its gunna just disintegrate or something? as far as i know there arent any varmint bullets made for 357 magnum.
Depends on the powder they use
The slowest powders in the .357 Magnum typically get a 300-500 fps boost in the long carbine barrel, at least that's what I've seen folks report.
So, if Fiocci used a very slow powder in that load, you might well get 1800-2000 fps in your rifle. Which might well be a whole bunch faster than that bullet was designed to move, which in turn could lead to worse-than-expected terminal performance. It's one of the reasons that hunting loads for .357 Magnums, especially in rifles, use 158-180 grain controlled-expansion bullets, or cast lead. Self-defense bullets aren't designed to hold together and penetrate deeply at the speeds you can push them to out of a carbine.
I would like to see what a 110-grain JHP over a max load of H-110 does to a watermelon out of my Marlin, but I'd never use that load on anything bigger than a rodent... And not on one I hoped to eat, either.
--Shannon
The slowest powders in the .357 Magnum typically get a 300-500 fps boost in the long carbine barrel, at least that's what I've seen folks report.
So, if Fiocci used a very slow powder in that load, you might well get 1800-2000 fps in your rifle. Which might well be a whole bunch faster than that bullet was designed to move, which in turn could lead to worse-than-expected terminal performance. It's one of the reasons that hunting loads for .357 Magnums, especially in rifles, use 158-180 grain controlled-expansion bullets, or cast lead. Self-defense bullets aren't designed to hold together and penetrate deeply at the speeds you can push them to out of a carbine.
I would like to see what a 110-grain JHP over a max load of H-110 does to a watermelon out of my Marlin, but I'd never use that load on anything bigger than a rodent... And not on one I hoped to eat, either.
--Shannon
But that's really my question...
Has anyone seen just how fast this round will go out of a carbine? That, along with just how tough that bullet is will determine it's suitability for my intended purpose (which is defense against two legged predators). Unless it doesn't move out of a rifle much faster than a pistol, or they build that bullet a lot tougher than it should be for a handgun round, it's probably not going to be too great as a hunting round. But if it has the right combination of speed and toughness, it might hold together for a few inches after penetration before over expanding or breaking apart. If so, the extreme tissue damage would be a plus. It would have impressive stopping power as a defense round.
Has anyone seen just how fast this round will go out of a carbine? That, along with just how tough that bullet is will determine it's suitability for my intended purpose (which is defense against two legged predators). Unless it doesn't move out of a rifle much faster than a pistol, or they build that bullet a lot tougher than it should be for a handgun round, it's probably not going to be too great as a hunting round. But if it has the right combination of speed and toughness, it might hold together for a few inches after penetration before over expanding or breaking apart. If so, the extreme tissue damage would be a plus. It would have impressive stopping power as a defense round.
Deer Hunter
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I know from experience that Fiocchi loads their rounds hot, which is a good thing. I'd expect a very nice jump in velocity when you fire that round in a rifle.
Deer Hunter
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Are you sure Grim? The 9mm I've used is extremely hot. It's the hottest 9mm I've ever felt, and it even has more recoil in my CZ75B than my Federal HST +P ammo.
Cosmoline
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Fiocchi is the hottest of the mass produced "inexpensive" .357 out there, and they load their other stuff hot as well. They're not regulated by SAAMI. I always practice with their magnums as there's little if any recoil difference between it and the cranked up expensive stuff.
I'd be very interested to hear what kind of increase people get. I doubt it will be as much of a gain as the Hornady custom loads designed for leverguns, but it should be substantial.
I'd be very interested to hear what kind of increase people get. I doubt it will be as much of a gain as the Hornady custom loads designed for leverguns, but it should be substantial.
http://grimjaw.net/ballistics.htm
Sorry, I forgot I also had 1000 rounds of .38 Special. It was about average for a 158gr FMJ load.
I chronographed 9x19 out of three different guns, including a rifle. It had alot of flash out of a shorter barrel but didn't play up to the consistent 1400 fps I was hoping for out of the carbine. The .38 I only tried with a 3 1/6" bbl.
I don't think it's bad stuff at all, just don't find it to be Maui Wowie.
pjr1960, didn't mean to trample through your thread. I recommend you chronograph a box or two of the Fiocchi load yourself. Sometimes the difference between the published numbers and what you find is staggering.
jm
Sorry, I forgot I also had 1000 rounds of .38 Special. It was about average for a 158gr FMJ load.
I chronographed 9x19 out of three different guns, including a rifle. It had alot of flash out of a shorter barrel but didn't play up to the consistent 1400 fps I was hoping for out of the carbine. The .38 I only tried with a 3 1/6" bbl.
I don't think it's bad stuff at all, just don't find it to be Maui Wowie.
pjr1960, didn't mean to trample through your thread. I recommend you chronograph a box or two of the Fiocchi load yourself. Sometimes the difference between the published numbers and what you find is staggering.
jm
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