First gun

[no0b]

hey all, im going to be getting my first gun soon (yay) but im still kinda deciding on which one to get. Im wanting one thats compact, It wouldnt be a every-day-carry gun but instead a self defence gun. I was thinking of getting a little .22 pistol seeing as how they are compact, somewhat cheap, and still deadly. Anyone suggest another gun thats still compact, cheap (300 & under), and inexpensive ammo?

Also if anyone knows a good .22 feel free to suggest, im thinking of getting a Phoenix Hp22 seeing as how its a supposedly good gun. (also is Federal Bullets good ammo? Ive heard alot of ammo will dirty up your gun fast and mis-fire alot which isnt something i want to happen especially when i need it)

Thank you so much

 

[AZGlock13]

Personally, I would go up to 9mm caliber for a good self defense semi-auto pistol (9mm is fairly cheap cost-wise, not .22lr cheap, but the cost is nice compared to other self defense calibers such as .40S&W, .357SIG and .45ACP). I don't have any experience with The Phoenix Arms HP22, but .22lr is more of a have a fun time plinking at the range type of caliber to me (IMHO), though I still wouldn't want to be shot by a .22lr bullet either. Lots of people have been kill by being shot by a .22, don't get me wrong, but I just feel more confident counting on a caliber a little bigger myself. I think the Ruger LC9 (9mm) would be a great fit for you. It holds 7+1 rounds, though I know the Phoenix Arms HP22 holds 10+1 rounds, but 7+1 of 9mm is still pretty good compromise for a small compact pistol like the LC9. The LC9 runs a little more than what you wanted to spend, but not too much more (around $330-360). Hope this helps.

 

[Ranger30-06]

For less than $300 you can pick up a 3rd generation S&W. All stainless steel, comes in 9mm, dead reliable, decent capacity, and relatively low recoil because its a heavier gun. The only con is it is a bit bulky for carry, and some people complain about the trigger being a little rough. I found though that by shooting the gun a lot the trigger smooths itself out which really isn't a bad idea for the gun and for your practice.

 

[no0b]

thank you both for your suggestions
I checked out the LC9 that AZglock13 suggested and i like it, has alot of good reviews and is small enough that its an easy conceal gun
Im looking into the 3rd gen S&W but from what ive read and seen so far it looks a bit big for a conceal gun but im not ruling it out yet
Thank you for the suggestions anyone else care to weigh in?

 

[robinkevin]

OK .22 is not really the pistol you need for defense... however it is a good pistol to learn on. In the $300 budget for a defense pistol I would recomend such as Ranger a used 3rd Gen Smith and Wesson if you could find one for $300 usually they are $350+ but it does depend on the shape of the pistol. However thats not the only choice out there by far, you could get a Markov from one of the many milsurplus website which they are usually under $220. Also you may be able to find a Hi Power clone such as FEG. Also since you did in fact mention the Phoenix Arms HP22 that makes me think you are on the lower end of the $300 budget so you may want to even look into Hi Point 9mm a lot of people put them down but those who own them usually praise them for being reliable.

*A 3rd Gen Smith and Wesson can be conceal pretty easy with a IWB holster as well as can most of what I mention besides for the Hi Point. the main thing that will get you with both a 3rd gen smith or a Hi Power clone is they are steel frame guns so they are heavy. But at the same time if you are new to shooting that will help you a lot by reducing recoil.

**I really don't suggest it to a new shooter due to recoil but like the Ruger LC9 the Kel Tec PF-9 is also a great little 9mm and is a little cheaper. But recoil in these tiny pistols can be rough to a new shooter, personally I been shooting all my life so it doesnt bother me much but others complain and it.

 

[no0b]

thanks for your input robinkevin, im thinking about spending the extra $100-$200 on the 3rd gen but im not making any decissions yet. I might get the cheap .22 and use it to get use to shooting on and then move on up to the 9mm once i feel like ive gotten better at shooting.

anyone else care to weigh in?

 

[Dr_2_B]

Welcome Noob. You are right that a 22 is the ideal gun to begin with. You will learn proper technique, etc. If you get a 22, I wouldn't go with a Phoenix - you can get much better quality in a Browning or a Ruger. They will be a little bigger, and that too will help you with your technique.

However, a 22 is not really a good choice for defending yourself. Certainly 22s can kill, but for many reasons it's less than ideal. If you want something for defense as well as plinking and learning, a 9mm would be a good choice. The aforementioned Smith would be good. A Ruger P95 would also be a great choice. There are others as well. Don't be scared off by a used gun. Most are excellent and most manufacturers are pretty decent about standing behind their products even if you aren't the original owner.

You've come to the right place for advice. Of all the sites around, this one is probably the best for getting good info. As you begin to zero in on a choice, mention it on here with specific questions and you will get pretty good answers.

 

[no0b]

yea im starting to see that a 9mm would be more ideal, but easy conceal is still a big factor for me for now
anyone have any experience with the Kel-Tec P-11 Semi 9mm?
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/25990-55.html

 

[robinkevin]

The P-11 is a nice pistol but once again its a tiny light pistol shooting a high pressure round so there is a lot of recoil. The other issue with small 9mm or even the small .380 like the P3AT or the LCP is that they are more prone to limpwristing and other types of errors and malfunctions that larger pistols. In this case you want some experience at clearing a malfunction in a semi and get in back into action quickly. Remember that many people conceal carry a full size 1911 so a pistol does not have to be small to conceal just have to work a little harder on it (correct shirt, good holster, ect). I don't know how I forgot about the P95 another great pistol and a soft shooting 9mm which would be good for starter... more than likely next best thing to start with over a .22.

The HP-22 is not a bad pistol, its not a great pistol but for just some plinking it can be a good gun. There is always better options out there however.

If you really need a small pistol I suggest as a new shooter to get a .22 and 9mm if you can. In your budget you could get a HP-22 and a Markov, would be able to get both and stay in your $300 price range, both are about the same size so it should be easy to switch from one to the other and Markov even though they are small they are very reliable.

 

[no0b]

i cant seem to find a place to buy a markov, do you have a link to one?

 

[Ranger30-06]

About CCing the 3rd gen Smith, it really is not that hard provided that you have a good holster. I can't carry here in NJ, but I have a holster (for the day it finally happens) that is very comfortable to wear while moving around.

 

[robinkevin]

They do seem hard to find then last time I looked... found a few on Gunbroker here is few.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=261598957
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=262429158
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=262428427
Also here is a site if you want to learn more about them http://www.makarov.com/

*Keep in mind that you can buy a new one for $291 http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_1059/products_id/411546545 but you can usually get a better deal buying from a milsurplus or used. There are also other surplus sites that I am sure has some just don't know which.


Also here is a P-64 its a little different than a oringal Makarov but I understand they are also nice pistols for the money. http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx?groupid=360&name=Polish+Radom+P-64+9x18+Pistol

 

[breeze010]

IMO a small subcompact 9mm for CC isn't the best choice for your first handgun. Recoil is going to be substantially more than a full size gun or 22, most of the ultra compacts (LC9/PF-9) barely have sights, etc.

A 22 is a great first pistol: minimum recoil, very cheap to shoot, etc. If you really want something for home defense and not just to plink with then a full size 9mm is the next cheapest option ('cheap' being about $11/50rds around here). My P-95 has been completely reliable, cheap ($300 or under), is a pleasure to shoot at the range and even when I do pick up a CC weapon it will still have a use at home. Just my opinion of course...if you could fire/rent a few of the guns you're looking at maybe you could get a better idea of what you want.

 

[Maple_City_Woodsman]

A .22 that you are proficient with is a far better defensive tool than a centerfire you suck at shooting.

Phoenix does get good reviews for reliability, but know this - the service life of the gun is SHORT; even the fans will admit that. Key components of the gun often fail in as little as 10K rounds. That's pitiful for a .22.

For just a hair more money I would look at a Beretta Neos or a Ruger 22/45 in the low $200 range. They will last a LOT longer, and they don't need to be modified to function properly (as does the Pheonix). You also won't need to worry about finding spare parts, or whether the company will be around in 10 years to honor their warranty.

 

[Dr_2_B]

Noob, you're asking good questions. The P11 may not be the best choice. I like Kel-tecs and I own the P11. But it has 2 marks against it as a first pistol. (1) The trigger on the Kel-tec P11 is poor. Don't get me wrong - I like the pistol, but for a beginning pistol it's just not a good trigger. (2) The P11 is pretty small. While that makes it easier to carry, it prevents the development of good shooting technique.

It will be hard to hit your target because of both the above reasons, thus rendering the P11 a less-than-optimum choice.

 

[Dr_2_B]

I don't know your knowledge base, so permit me to be so presumptuous as to throw out a couple recommendations. Then I recommend you run the ideas past some others for a second opinion. The Makarov is a reliable, inexpensive, effective pistol and caliber for plinking and self-defense. It is also small enough to conceal, without being too small.

A larger option that is not too expensive would be a 9mm Ruger P95. But it's not so easy to conceal. For a few more dollars, you could get a mini Glock 26 or a medium sized Glock 19. Assuming you like those, they would both be great for practice as well as defense. The G19 would be preferable for developing your shooting technique, but the G26 would be better for concealed carry.

 

[jdjake]

noob,

Rather than taking other people's opinions, I went to a local shooting range and rented a number of guns to try. I ended up buying a Kel Tec P11 9mm. I use it as my CC weapon and it works very well.

But that is just my opinion.

 

[ATBackPackin]

I'm wanting one thats compact, It wouldn't be a every-day-carry gun but instead a self defense gun

Welcome Noob. I have to admit I am a little confused by the above quote. Is it going to be a carry gun or not? If not, I would not recommend a compact gun for a beginner. Obviously a .22 would be the best way to start on your marksmanship skills, but if you are only getting one gun and need it for self defense then I would get a 9mm. Preferably in a larger frame. Something like the Ruger P95* or the S&W 5906* would serve you much better. I would not, I repeat I would not buy a Phoenix. It may be a little cheaper but I assure you that your life is worth more.

If you really do want something more compact and do plan on carrying sometimes there are a few options. Something like the S&W 6906*, Kahr CW9*, or Ruger SR9c* might work better for you.

As far as ammo, you are going to need at least two types. Practice ammo like some 115gr FMJ and a defense load like 124gr JHP. You must practice with your defense load as well to make sure it works and to get used to it. Those two loads will perform differently.

You are in the right place. Ask as many questions as you want and you will get advice from people with a lot more experience and expertise than I.

Good luck
Shawn

* I'm not recommending those particular auctions, but chose those for the pictures.

 

[tuj]

Get a .22 because you will be able to practice really cheaply. Practice and practice, then get a 9mm or other after you have established your marksmanship skills.

I recommend a Ruger MKIII. Great 22 target pistols.

 

[blinkjr]

Hey No0b - fellow newbie here. I recently purchased a Sig SP2022 in 9mm. It is my first handgun. Had considered a .22lr but wanted something bigger for SD/HD. I like it so far. You can find them NIB under $300 over on gunbroker.com.

If you have a range nearby that has rentals, go try some out and see what fits.

Good luck!

 

[ORHunter79]

Get a used Glock 26 or 19. Just my opinion. Besides a revolver, Glocks are the most reliable.

 

[dcarch]

I went with an FNP. It's a good, solid, easy to learn platform that is rather inexpensive, reliable, accurate, and backed by a solid company with an excellent reputation and first rate CS.

 

[Safetychain]

I have several autos, but with your $$ restriction, my S&W 639 police trade in would seem to fit your needs. It is a great 9mm that has never malfunctioned on me and if I wore anything other than shorts and tee shirts would be my preferred carry gun. A Taurus TCP in 380 ACP fits my lifestyle. There seems to be a flood of compact S&W trade ins on the internet market now, some for under $300. The KELTEC P9 or P11 are around for under $300 and if they were in stainless would be what I would be carrying. The heavier the gun, the easier it is to shoot. The P9/11 and the 380 mouse guns are fun, accurate enough for carry and have a snappy recoil but aren't nearly as punishing as you will read on most forums.

 

[woad_yurt]

Avoid the Phoenix! My friend has one and the bottoms of the mags have all fallen off, one by one.

About Makarovs: Easy to master, both in shooting and in maintainence, as reliable as any revolver & cheap to feed. They're easily carry-able and will fulfill all of your requirements. I have one, have owned two thers and they're fantastic, problem free pistols.

J&G Sales has Bulgarian Maks for $229.00, a really good price.

 

[Wanderling]

Mak is the gun I am planning on getting next.

Alternately, if you can go just $160 higher, you could get a Glock 19 for about $460 (I think the way it works, you pay $35 for yearly GSSF membership and they let you buy a Glock at $425 from an authorized dealer).

I am carrying a full size G17 around the house (didn't get my permit yet) and it seems to be pretty easy, once I found the comfortable holster position. The G19 should be even easier to carry.