First Press Overkill?

[guyfromohio]

I have both the desire and the green light from the finance department to purchase reloading equipment. With 9mm and .223 being my primary ammo, I know the cost/savings ratio isn't in my favor... but that's not necessarily my drive.

I have never reloaded. Never even seen it done. That being said, I'm looking at the Dillon xl650 based on recommendations from friends with some experience. Not considering the cost versus cost of SIMILAR systems, does it make sense to go right to that type of sophistication? Am I missing a necessary learning curve of a single stage? Not looking to tune precision loads, but more to "manufacture" in bulk for my own use. Thoughts?

 

[FROGO207]

Well there are two schools of thought there. One is to mass produce questionable ammo without a basic grip of the how to do it well part. The other is like building a building in that a great foundation when starting will last you well for years. So instead of getting a 6 year old a bicycle would you get them a brand new mustang to use? I think it is a similar comparison. I am sure others will disagree but since you are asking I think you are smart and cautious. I would think that a single stage and some basic tools (that all are still necessary anyway IMHO) would be a good way to start. THEN when you can make 100 rounds with no mistakes whatsoever go to your progressive (that you will now understand the why and what better) and start that part of the learning curve. Am I overly cautious?? Not really when considering what the rounds are capable of doing to you or your firearm if you make one little mistake.

 

[cfullgraf]

You will get lots of different opinions.

I prefer to load rifle on a single stage. I prefer to clean off the resizing lubricant after sizing but before reloading and rifle cases have to be trimmed regularly. Trimming is best done after resizing. I have loaded prepped and primed 223 Rem cases through my progressive. It just does not ring my bell.

Also, a single stage press is good to have around as they do a few, specialized tasks better than a progressive. If you start with a single stage, most of the equipment will transfer to the progressive so it is not like starting over.

That said, there are many folks that cut their teeth on a progressive.

As far as progressives are concerned, I prefer auto indexing ones. Mine is a Hornady L-N-L but the Diilons are great machines.

Do some investigating. There is a sticky at the top of the forum, "Reloading Libray of Wisdom", that has lots of good information. Get a book or two like Lyman #49 or "The ABCs of Reloading".

 

[guyfromohio]

Good Lord, I am a newb. I never even considered the safety aspect. I assumed that if you put all of the components in the right spot and then pulled the lever, a flawless round would fall into the tray. Obviously, before I actually reload, I'll study and get hands on "training".... but understanding the science and mechanics makes sense. These first 2 responses may actually have swayed me. And I can still order thousands of rounds of Tula while honing my reloading skills. Wheels spinning....

 

[tightgroup tiger]

Unless you have a really good teacher to help you with this, I think you may have your sights set a little to high, jumping into a Dillon right away.

Check out Lee's Classic Cast turret press, it has auto-indexing and can be changed to single stage operation in seconds.

It won't break the bank, will allow you to afford all the other things you will find out you need, and will also give you a taste of progressive reloading even though it is not a true progressive press. It's something in between the single stage and the Dillon you are looking at in the way it works.

You really do need to learn the basics of reloading on a SS or Classic Cast Turret press before moving to mass production. It is a lot safer that way for you and everyone around you.

 

[tightgroup tiger]

I assumed that if you put all of the components in the right spot and then pulled the lever, a flawless round would fall into the tray.

Well your right about one thing, something usually will fall out when you pull the lever but I doubt it will be safe to shoot.

You better get the reloading books and learn this right before choosing a loading press. You have a lot of learning to do before you are ready for a Dillon, from your last post.

Start reading my friend, ABC of reloading, Lyman's 49' edition, and so on.
Learn it and if you don't understand it then find someone that does and start asking questions, before moving any further forward.

You will live longer that way.

 

[WvHiker]

I also like the single stage. I painstakingly weigh out every charge of powder, and take my sweet time at every stage.

It's more fun than it probably sounds. No, I don't make tons of ammo quickly, but I make good, reliable, safe ammo.

I make mostly 9mm. I don't save much money, but saving money isn't my primary goal. I do it because I enjoy it (except for the picking up empties, which isn't that fun at all.)

 

[Rollis R. Karvellis]

Get the 650, and all the bell's and whistles, but also get a Lee C press. It is a small single stage, that will cost less then the shipping of the Dillon.

Practice on the Lee, while you are learning the about the Dillon.

 

[JLDickmon]

Get the 650, and all the bell's and whistles, but also get a Lee C press. It is a small single stage, that will cost less then the shipping of the Dillon.

Practice on the Lee, while you are learning the about the Dillon.

then when the arm breaks on it, you can throw it in the trash and not really be out anything..
I'm about ready to give mine and a set of .40 dies to a friend that's getting into the hobby... and I know I have more into the dies than I do the press..

And I'd have to agree about the Dillon.. steep learning curve..

Much as I hate to put aside my, "Overkill? Never heard of it." motto, I'd have to agree. I started on a turret, which is essentially a single stage. That was 30 years ago.
I'm still using it.

 

[CraigC]

I'm mechanically inclined and detail oriented but I'm VERY glad I learned to handload on a turret (glorified single stage) long before I got my 650. You REALLY need to learn the process one step at a time and at a slow pace before moving to a progressive. I cannot stress this enough. There is a lot going on at one time and you need to be aware of everything. You have a lot to learn and a progressive is the wrong press to learn it on.

Same reason you learn to drive on momma's old station wagon instead of an F1 car.

 

[batex]

I started Loading on a Dillon 550 and I'm very glad I did. I can't imagine loading the volume I do on a single stage. In fact I probably would not still be reloading if I only had a single stage at this point. The nice thing about the Dillon 550 is that you can use it as a single stage press. However I am very mechanically inclined and detail oriented. I say go for the Dillon if you feel it's right for you.

 

[solman]

A Dillon RL550 might be what you are looking for. You can use it as a single stage and when you get some experience you have a manual indexing progressive. Tough as nails, lifetime garauntee and an easy sell if you don't like it or want an upgrade to the 650.
I started with the Dillon 550 and still have it 25 years later. I did add a few others to the reloading stable but the 550 is my go to press for loading batches of ammo.
Oops I see above poster beat me to the point...

 

[eldon519]

I started with a turret press which is kind of a compromise between a single stage and a progressive. In retrospect, I wish I'd just jumped right into my Dillon 550. As mentioned above, the Dillon doesn't auto-index, so you can basically use it as a single stage which is how I might recommend getting started, and then once you are comfortable, you can start rocking and rolling in progressive fashion. You said you are planning to do 9mm and .223 and are aware that the savings are slim. To me that is more reason why a single stage isn't worth your time/hassle.

Even if you decide to get an auto-indexing progressive like the Hornady or the Dillon 650, you can always just run one round through all the stations one at a time to get your learning curve down. As long as you are cautious and attentive, you will be okay. It isn't rocket surgery.

 

[guyfromohio]

I'll look into the 550 idea.... something that could grow as my skills grow. To be clear, I have every intention of learning before doing. I don't want to get in over my head, while I also don't want to get something that will be useless in the too-soon future. By "useless", I really am not looking to tune 500 yard ammo. Just looking to roll my own.

 

[CMD-Ky]

When looking, consider the RCBS Pro 2000. It doesn't get much "buzz" but, over time, I have grown to prefer it over the Dillon 550B that I also own. It is all personal preference and the Pro 2000 is worth a thought.

 

[dab102999]

One other way to get some help learning in addition to books is look at a Dnr site and see if any classes in the area you live. Also local gun clubs can help you with a mentor. One thing about reloaders is no matter how much some gaurd there secret reciepts I have never meet one that wouldn't give free advice to keep you safe.

 

[Walkalong]

I started on a single stage, then moved to a turret press while still using the single stage at times, then moved to a progressive.

It really helps to learn reloading on a single stage. Not that starting on a progressive can't be done, it is just more entailed and the learning curve is steeper.

 

[Kevin Rohrer]

This question is asked ad nauseum on all reloading sites.

The safest answer to learning how to reload is to take baby steps and start w/ a single-stage press. A 650 is most definitely not for beginners.

 

[Still Shooting]

Fifty Years' Reloading and I'm Still Learning

I began reloading at age 16, when my Dad bought me a Pacific single stage press, a set of dies for my .22 Hornet, a pound of H2400 powder, and a box of Hornady 45gr. bullets. I reloaded through my 20's, and added .270 dies and .30 Remington dies (for my Dad's rifle). In my mid-30's I began loading lots of different ammo - .223, 6.5x55 Swede, .308, 30-06, and also .380, .38/.357, 9mm, and .45ACP. At that point I had bought a Dillon RL550.

In the 90's and early 2000's I got single again, moved around some, paid a lot to lawyers, etc. and didn't do much reloading - or even shooting!

Three years ago I started reloading again, but all I had left to work with was my old Pacific SS press. I now reload mostly all rifle cartridges, and a friend gave me his unused Dillon 550B to replace the one I had sold to get single again! I replaced my old Pacific (donated it to a newbie) with a Redding 'Big Boss' SS, and I now use both presses. I use the Dillon for loading .223/5.56x45, for .30M1 carbine, and .22 Hornet and K-Hornet. Everything else goes into the SS press. In all, I now have 21 die sets in 20 calibers.

I'd recommend starting with a single stage press, as several have recommended here. Get a GOOD scale (I have an RCBS balance scale, and a Dillon electronic that is excellent). Buy a chamfering tool, a primer pocket brush, a case neck brush, a case trimmer, and a tumbler. Get some case lube (or stick with carbide dies).

Buy a reloading guide from each bullet supplier you use, and by all means a Lyman Guide. IMO the Lyman guide is the best for education, followed by the Hornady Guide.

-Above all, take it one step at a time and enjoy the learning process - I'm still learning, and that's part of the fun. The best pastimes are ones that will let you become capable (reloading a few rounds) in a matter of hours, and still challenge your knowledge and build your skills for years afterward. That, to me, is the best part of reloading!

 

[beatledog7]

A good SS press is a great way to learn the basics and get comfortable with whatever cartridges you eventually want to load in volume (on a progressive). It will also keep right on serving you after you have "progressed" by being there to handle the inevitable "few of" reloading tasks for which altering your carefully tweaked progressive set-up would be woefully inconvenient.

 

[italy176]

Go ahead and spend the cash now. You can learn on a progressive - just go slow. Read the manual for your press. Check out YOUTUBE. Get good loading data and don't be afraid to hit up the folks on this forum.

 

[RandyP]

What are your realistic ammo needs? If you match that and your budget you will be well served.

A single stage is slower (50-75 rounds per hour) but it is a great teaching tool, and thousands of folks continue to use them for all their reloading needs regardless - it ain't a race, it's a relaxing hobby for me.

Auto-advancing turrets (like the very nice Lee Classic) make 150-175 rounds per hour - a complete kit costs about $200.

Progressives - make 300+ rounds per hour but ARE more complex with many things happening at once. They are also much pricier, though again Lee offers their Loadmaster at an economical price. Dillon is the acknowledged Caddy of reloading presses but carries a matching price tag.

ALL the name brands make good machines to their price point and ALL will turn out safe, reliable and accurate ammo identical to any other machine, if the reloader does their part.

 

[GCBurner]

More important than the brand or type of press you use is the amount of care you take at each step of the reloading process. The most time consuming, and the foundation that safe accurate ammo depends on, is inspecting and prepping the fired cases, looking for cracks, splits, signs of excessive headspace, enlarged primer pockets, proper trim length, and any other signs of inconsistency that would affect the safety and accuracy of the finished product.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Here's a utube video of a Lee Classic turret

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KB6OS0LoRPE&feature=player_detailpage


Here's a utube video of an RL550B

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=R9wUKcSskrg

 

[zxcvbob]

A single-stage press is a nice thing to have even if you have a progressive press. Sometimes you just need to load one box of ammo for one gun and your big press is all set up for something else.

I have a progressive and several single-stages. I use them all about equally. I started out with just a used C&H 3-station single stage. It's about twice as fast as most SS's, but new ones (4 stations now) are really expensive. I reloaded 100 9mm's in half an hour with it once just to see if I could, but I don't like going that fast and I couldn't have maintained that rate anyway. [ETA: maybe it was 50 in a half hour for a 100/hr rate, I can't remember for sure and 200/hr doesn't sound right]

I haven't tried reloading .223 on a progressive press, but I think the case trimming would give you fits -- unless there's a press-mounted trimmer I don't know about.