First Stab at Trail Boss in 38 special

[Peter M. Eick]

I finally found some trail boss to try out. Nice stuff. Meters +/- 0.1 grn out of a Uniflow with a baffle in my pro2000 press. Using a nice starting load of 3.6 grns to 4.0 grns of Trailboss I loaded up 50 rounds at .1 grn increments to test out tomorrow or Tuesday. I was loading Lasercast 158 Lead SWC's with cci500 primers to 1.458 COL and starline brass.

A couple of comments because I also loaded up 250 rnds of Unique and 200 rnds of Universal clays to compare to. The Trail boss will not allow you to double charge a case. at 3.8 grns it will spill out of the case on a double charge. Universal clays and unique are barely detectable down in the case on my pro2000 at standard loads. For this reason alone if the rounds are reasonably accurate and have a decent velocity I will stop all further loading with non-Trail boss powder for the 38 special.

My gripe is that I use a redding profile crimp and an RCBS seater die. With a 5 station press, I cannot get a powder check die into the mix without swapping the powder dispenser for the belling step. I am after the safety of being able to see a double charge over just about anything other then accuracy or velocity.

I have not had a chance yet to load TB into the 357 Magnum for lead loads. I will try that out after I get some range time in the next couple of days.

I will post chrono data when I get it done. I will be using a 38/44 heavy duty 5" and a 38/44 outdoorsman 6.5" for the testing. If all is well I will try them out in my 4" diamondback and an 8 3/8" pre-27.

Anyone else have some Trail boss experience in 38 special to add?

 

[tc300mag1]

Good info i havent found it to try yet .. I wish they would list some loads with jacketed bullets as i like to load light loads to and dont like that you cant really see the other powders in the case ..


Cant wait to hear how it works out

 

[BigJakeJ1s]

I've tried it in 45 colt cowboy loads, and it works great! Burns clean. You can double charge without overflowing, but the bullet would not seat, and the powder level is high enough to easily recognize it.


Andy

 

[SASS#23149]

from what I've read on the powder...

the 'fluffiness' is what they were after all along,so that folks would not double charge large cases like .45colt,etc.
Now if i could just find some to try it out. :banghead:

 

[wrangler5]

I understand the concern about double charges, but I'm wondering if anyone using a progressive press has actually experienced one?

I've used progressive presses for about 25 years and don't think I've ever seen a double charge using the press in its regular (progressive) mode. The mechanical linkages on the presses I've used pretty much require a full return of the ram to the bottom of its stroke before the powder charge bar is refilled, at which point the shell plate is already indexing to the next position.

I will admit to throwing double (even triple) charges when fooling with a single case in the press while setting up a different powder charge, but I was trying to do it, and found that you have to consciously do something way out of the ordinary to get a multiple charge in the case.

I will also admit to trying Accurate Nitro 100 powder for 45 Colt loads, just for its bulk, but it didn't meter at all nicely in any of the powder measures I use on my press so I gave it up. My conclusion, for my reloading purposes, was that bulky powder is a nice idea as a defense against double charges, other things being equal, such as load accuracy, metering consistency, cost, clean burning, etc. In my case, these other things were not equal, and they took precedence. Just my personal choice.

 

[ReloaderFred]

Yep, I've seen it happen. When I was shooting a lot of PPC in the late 70's, our team had purchased a C-H inline progressive press. Once in awhile, the transfer bar would slip over the 4 cartridge cases and if you weren't paying close attention, it would double charge.

At one match, one of our team members had loaded his match ammunition the night before, and was in a hurry. He was shooting next to me at the 50 yard line in the prone position when he touched off what was either a double charge, or maybe even a triple charge, of Bullseye. His S&W Model 19, with a Bomar Rib mounted on it, grenaded. The Bomar rib must have taken at least 10 seconds to hit the ground and was bent like a horseshoe. The top three chambers of the cylinder disappeared. It sounded like a bomb going off, even through earmuffs. No one was hurt, but the guy's hand stung from the explosion. I had also seen another gun blow up at another match, but didn't know the shooter, or the particulars.

At that time, S&W had a policy that if a police officer blew up a gun, they would repair, or replace it, for just the cost of the replacement parts. My team member got a new Model 19, minus the Bomar Rib, for $65.00, which was the cost of the frame and cylinder at the time. They applied his serial number to a new frame and said they used the rest of his old parts, but we all believed it was a new gun, with his old serial number, since the trigger and hammer were also new and the old ones had been smoothed out by a professional gunsmith.

Double charges have, and do, happen. It's usually caused by inattention or being in a hurry. There shouldn't be a TV or visiting when reloading, and certainly no alcohol consumed prior to reloading.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Sport45]

I can't wait to read your report on the results. Where did you find the TB in Houston? Carter's Country? Also, how does the price per load compare to other powders like Bullseye or Titegroup?

Thanks!

 

[wrangler5]

Yep, I've seen it happen. When I was shooting a lot of PPC in the late 70's, our team had purchased a C-H inline progressive press. Once in awhile, the transfer bar would slip over the 4 cartridge cases and if you weren't paying close attention, it would double charge.​

I'm not familiar with the press you describe. All of my experience has been with the rotary progressives, where after each stroke the case moves from the powder drop stage to the position where you manually put the bullet in the case mouth. If the system didn't index, so that the once-filled case stayed in place to receive a second dose of powder, you'd be moving your hand to place a bullet in a case that already had one, which would tell you that something's badly amiss. My comment was based on this kind of press.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

Yes I got it from Carter's country. They seem to be the only place in town that has it. Call ahead before you drive to them because they sell out quick! I had them pull aside 4 cans for me on the I-10 store.

It is raining hard here today, so maybe this afternoon or tomorrow morning.

The plan right now is to chrono the loads out of multiple guns to see how it does at different barrel lenghts. I pulled the 35p out but I need to still check the batteries and load up.

Out of around 175,000 reloads I have done on my Pro2000 I have never double charged a case "yet". The problem is, consider the risks. One double charge will destroy a fine weapon and if it happens to be one of my favorites like my early 38/44 Heavy duty or my 1939 Registered Magnum I will be heart broken. I would much rather pay an extra buck or two per can then risk a fine gun.

To me the key is accuracy and leading. If Trailboss is reasonably accurate at the 15 and 25 yard ranges with 158 Lasercasts and CCI500 primers (my standards) then I will stop using all other powders for 38 special and 357 Magnum except for 2400 because it will also spill over on a double charge.

Yes, I still use a powder lock out die, but I hate putting all of my faith in one system like the lock out die. I would rather have 2 checks, ie: Lock out and visual. The odds that both fail at the same time I think are quite low.

 

[BluesBear]

That's one of the reasons I sold all four of my C-H presses after less than six months of use.

There was also the problem of them NOT dropping a powder charge about 1% of the time.